July 15, 2017 - People's CanJam Pasadena Impressions Thread

Discussion in 'The Meeting Place' started by dmckean44, Jul 15, 2017.

  1. LFF

    LFF Friend

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    It was a total blast seeing all of you guys again!

    Highlights of the meet:

    Friends. Without you guys, I wouldn't go to these things. Thanks for the feedback. Thanks for being my friends.

    @n3rdling - Orpheus Clone. Amazeballs. 'nuff said.

    @Donald North - his rig was fantastic. The HD800 (which I still hate) sounded so good...so good from his amp. Definitely some magical synergy there. I don't know how Donald does it.

    Eddie Current's amps are always a thing to appreciate and admire. Such was the case at this meet. Fantastic sound.

    The thing that Jason didn't bring sounded AMAZING. Probably my favorite Schiit thing in non-existence.

    HiFiMan Susvara Hardcover Book: What an amazing thing to include with such beautiful headphones and a fancy box. The printing. The feel of the paper. The smell of the box. The dedication to illustrating the HiFiMan family tree and explaining the technology behind the Susvara. You could jizz in that book. That book is definitely worth $5,850.00

    Modded Andromeda & Modded Astell & Kern DAP from @Bill-P. Great little portable rig and one I would be happy to have.

    There were many disappointments and some great, almost epic majestic failures but those of you who were there already know so why bring it up here.
     
  2. mkozlows

    mkozlows Friend

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    For context, I'm pretty sure the one you listened to was one of the units with a production issue, which hasn't been sent in for the fix yet. That description doesn't at all match my experience with a no-production-issue unit, so may want to withhold judgment on it.
     
  3. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    Yeah, sorry we have to be so cloak-and-dagger. Here's the thing (to explain the pathology a bit better, maybe, for those who care): we bring preview stuff out to small meets with people we trust. Sometimes these previews don't go anywhere. I had another preview about a year ago--the same size and general idea as the preview this year--which everyone kinda said, "Meh," to. And it was kinda meh. And so we never did it.

    This one...a lot more people are excited about it. It's on a path to production. But there's still stuff to work out. Sometimes that stuff goes fast (like, 3-4 months) and sometimes that stuff goes wayyyyyy sideways (like Vidar). So please excuse the tease...but thank you everyone for your input. We do listen!
     
  4. DigMe

    DigMe Friend

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    LOL

    Man, I wish I could make it to these meets!!
     
  5. LFF

    LFF Friend

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    But you didn't bring anything. ;)

    We listen as well, and the nothing is indeed fantastic. I think we all walked away with plans to save up some dough. Your stuff just keeps getting better and better.
     
  6. Bill-P

    Bill-P Level 42 Mad Wizard

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    Just to say...

    ...I'm eagerly and very patiently waiting for the things you didn't bring this time. And I'm also looking forward to discussing more of what we didn't talk about yesterday. Hehehe

    Haha, thanks, man! Hope you enjoy the GO2A! Sorry, the firmware has shitty control right now but the sound is good! Hope Larry will be able to fix it in the future.

    Also, I think AK120 is just one of those hidden gems that people don't seem to realize. When its price goes down to sub-$300 range (at this rate), it'll be a killer value.
     
  7. LFF

    LFF Friend

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    I'm happy with the GO2A Infinity. Sounds fantastic. Don't have an issue with the firmware.

    I'm now looking for an affordable AK120. o_O
     
  8. miceblue

    miceblue Friend

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    All righty. First of all, thank you to @Marvey et al. for getting this meet in order, and thank you to @netforce for providing transporation. This meet reminded me a lot of the Seattle meets, so it was a nice atmosphere to get to know people and to listen to gear a little more critically at the same time.

    Thank you all for being so inviting! This was my first time attending a SBAF meet and it was nice to finally put a face to the username. I didn't even know Alex of @Audio Zenith, Craig of Eddie Current, @Donald North of D.N.A., and Luis/@LFF were there until @insidious meme pointed them out to me! Their faces looked familiar, but I didn't put 1 and 1 together, so my apologies if I was a bit awkward. Next time I want to spend more time talking to more people.

    As mentioned, photo time!
    Orz I can only upload 10 photos per post. Flickr it is.
    https://www.flickr.com/gp/miceblue/50uB04


    There were quite a few setups at the meet that I liked, but the ones that stood out to me were Donald's Stellaris and AKG K1000 (when the CD player worked), Alex's new PMx2 with Marvey's "Krell" speaker amp, the Code-X on @brencho's rig, @Bill-P's NW-ZX2, and of course, @n3rdling's Orpheus Clone.

    I've heard the K1000 a few times at Seattle meets since Bottlehead uses one as a reference headphone, but DANG it sounded good through Donald's rig. I still like the ability to adjust the sound with the rotating wings; the sweet spot for me tends to be around 30% from the closed position. The Bottlehead rig I'm used to hearing sounds quite a bit darker than what I heard through the Stellaris, but it could be source material since the Bottlehead rig one is usually connected to their system with the reel-to-reel tape setup.

    At the time, I didn't realize who Alex was, but he insisted I give the new PMx2 a try with the "Krell" amp. I've previously heard the PMx2 and thought it was only okay. With the new PMx2 hooked up to the "Krell", holy moley did it sound a lot better to me. It still has the sweet mids of the PMx2, but it's much more linear sounding overall from the bass to the treble.

    Likewise, I was surprised with the Code-X on Brencho's rig. At the time, I thought I was listening to a HE-5 and I was like "wow, these don't sound like a HiFiMAN at all!" I thought the treble sounded a little grainy/crunchy at times while listening to Marvin Gaye and Luther Vandross on Tidal though (for whatever reason, Yes's Fragile album wasn't working through Tidal both here and on Alex's rig above...).

    I had a great time talking to Bill-P about stuff in general. He got me interested in the NW-ZX2 now, hahaha. I thought it paired really well with the Campfire Andromeda as well as my UERR, and is certainly far better-sounding than my current go-to portable media player: OnePlus 3. I backed the Geek Wave ages ago and that money is already gone, so I'm not sure if it's worth shelling out $500+ for the ZX2. Bill-P's custom Android tweaks certainly make it a compelling device for me to use on the other hand; the UI is very important to me in terms of a PMP. It did sound very good though and is one of the better-sounding PMPs I have heard; very smooth-sounding with good imaging.

    And last but not least, n3rdling's Orpheus Clone still blows me away. I didn't get to A/B it with the SR-009 last time, so it was a treat to hear them side-by-side. I've always found the SR-009 to sound a bit too bright for my preferences, and the Orpheus Clone is a nice departure from that sound, blending in a bit of the SR-007's sound instead. I found the SR-009 to have the better instrument separation of the two, but the overall sound signature of the Orpheus Clone is just more linear and smoother to me.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
  9. insidious meme

    insidious meme Ambivalent Kumquat

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  10. Ringingears

    Ringingears Honorary BFF

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    Ditto!

    Sorry I just walked in the door about an hour or so ago. Traffic bad, sound good. I wish I lived in Bodega Bay in the Bay Area. I live in Sacramento. Hey but I have met the GOV a couple of times! Thanks @brencho. Next time I'll tell my wife I am not being a pain in the ass but being a catalyst. :D

    Great to see everyone again. Yeah I remember Watergate and Woodstock. Sometimes I get them backwards. Jason, enjoyed our discussion of the state of audio reviews.

    More tomorrow. Maybe we can do a Nor Cal meet sometime?
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
  11. Scott Kramer

    Scott Kramer Friend

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    Does anyone else do the SE / BALANCED like the Vidar?* I really like how they did it here... L/R for SE -- and then L for + phase, R for - phase. By default perfectly mirrored electronics... there's even room to do 2 power transformers, but thats probably overkill anyway!

    No fiddly switches, specific ways to to connect it, or buy the mono / stereo version... just use a balanced cable in! Love it!

    @schiit is really following through on the simplicity!

    PS. I thought the prototype ran warm when I touched it... but they're able to bias it higher now!

    *2 RCA's stereo or 1 XLR mono
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2017
  12. ald0s

    ald0s Facebook Friend

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    Great pictures @miceblue . Id love to head to a meet like this but Aus is quite far away unfortunately. Still blessed to live here of course! Rumors of new Schiit stuff are exciting as is seeing the EC Afficionado come along. Id love to here a few more impressions on it if anyone gave it a good listen, Stellaris seems to be taking up most of the excitement here.

    Looks like a great community vibe and wonderful to have so many of the designers themselves there to chat to. I always find it interested listening to peoples creations and then talking to them and slowly building an idea of their design goals and what they were going for.
     
  13. miceblue

    miceblue Friend

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    Derp, that was a copy-paste fail. XD
     
  14. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    If it's my Aeon ultrabike brought, it's currently without the tuning fix. He will get that to MrSpeakers for me, and we'll go through the review process again. I am curious to see if anyone tries it again that was at the meet to see if it is indeed improved.

    Sounds like you all had a great time! Wish I was able to make these things on that side of the country.
     
  15. winders

    winders boomer

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    Could someone explain what is gained from a sound quality perspective by being able to use a higher bias in the production Vidar versus the preproduction units?

    Thanks!
     
  16. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    There was a chance for a while that I was not going to make it to this meet. My wife and kids were coming back from ELP and had to pick them up. The plane came a bit later in the evening and wife gave me the go ahead. I was very motivated to make it to this meet. It's been a while since I have meet with @Marvey and @Bill-P. Much longer since I've seen @LFF.

    I carpooled with @Cspirou. A great pleasure to talk to Gael and discuss random stuff about audio, schools, kids, and life in general.

    I actually got to hear more stuff for longer time in this meet. For me the following were the audio highlights:

    The Good:
    1. Orpheus clone + Blue Hawaii by @n3rdling: This is a real endgame setup. I don't think there is anything out there that can top this. He had the 007's or 009's there next to his clones. It took 2 seconds for me to tell that the Stax were not up to the challenge. The Stax are great, but they are not the clones.
    2. Donald North's Strato-Smurf (Stellaris 2A3 I believe) + AKG K1000 micro open baffle-ness by @Donald North: The DNA deal may be blue. But it's gorgeous looking. And it drives the K1000 to greatness. To me, these are as close to speakers as one is ever going to get. These are the "bass heavy" K1000. BULLSHIT!!! These are the NOT-FUCKED-UP K1000. I took the time to measure these to @Donald North dismay (it's his baby), and they measure roughly how I hear them. Really awesome. A true reference.
    3. Codex + Luis uber amplifier + digital music collection: I shared with @LFF that in many cases, folks are looking for that extra 0.00283983% in their equipment. And are missing the %95.5862 in great music releases. Luis gets it and has it all.
    4. Aficionado + HD650: Great pairing and great music. I can see and hear why there is a lot of interest in this system. Very engaging sound. Well balanced, good impact and great detail.
    5. 445 + HD580 + Schiit Stuff + Focusrite Red-deal: Yup. I don't like the Utopias, so I hooked up an @Bill-P HD580 to this. Great system as well. I cannot easily make my mind about which I like better, these of the Aficionado + HD650. Would have to spend more time. This is a reference system.
    The Bad:
    1. Susvara: I'm not going to sugar coat this. This, IMO, is a piece of shit. It distorted quite badly in the bass region with some pretty basic music at non-stratospheric volume levels. The highs compressed in a very obvious way. I believe distortion in the highs generates harmonics higher in frequency which may go ultrasonic, and we tend to hear less dynamics if the driver cannot hold it's own. Given this level of performance, this thing probably should be knocked down 2 decimal points to $60. @ohhgourami and other are lucky to have HE-6s. The HE-6 may not be my favorite headphone. But it's one of the greats and walks around and all over the Susvara. The HE-6 may have the best ortho-dynamic planar driver ever made (and the harder to drive).
    2. MrSpeakers Aeon: This is not nearly as bad as the Susvara. It just did not impress me. It does have it's coloration and stuff. And I'm sure some folks are going to like this. But I was expecting better mids. It is possible that this is yet another "broken" can, but both drivers were "broken" exactly the same as matching was very good. Who knows. Will ship these back to @Hands and see if we get another Aeon with the "right" tuning.
    The News:
    1. Great things coming out from @schiit, as expected, which should become available for disclosure as time goes by. Patience.
    2. Great showing by the Aficionado. I really like the new presentation and solid construction.
    3. Great stuff by @Audio Zenith with PM mods with little to no distortion and the same neutral response that I tend to prefer.
    The Friends:

    1. Great time talking to @Bill-P. Really down to earth super awesome dude. Really nice to see you man!
    2. Super nice to see and talk to @LFF and @n3rdling again.
    3. Great time talking with Craig, @Marvey, @Donald North, @schiit.
    4. Always a pleasure to see @insidious meme and really nice to finally meet @miceblue! I spent some time with his Lambda's + mini electrostatic amp. Amazing what this entry level Stax system can do for the money. I was told this whole system could be bought for $400 at one point!
    5. I was very happy to meet @Ringingears! Very motivated and high spirited dude. Really had a great time meeting him. Nice talking with @dmckean44 too.
    6. Saw @brencho, but was not able to talk to him for some reason. Really enjoyed this meet man. Thank you.
    7. Saw @ohhgourami and I don't know how many times I shook his hand LOL! Nice to see you mang. We had a discussion about your home speaker rig. From memory you mentioned you had a dynamic/electrostatic rig with straight panels as opposed to the curve panels offered by Martin Logan. Maybe you can share a link or something about them since I (and perhaps others) are not familiar with them. Thanks for sharing some of your time.
    8. Always nice to talk to Alex from @Audio Zenith.
    9. Proly missing some people. I'm just some dude with shit memory though. Had a great time.
    Will post some measurements for public release later if you guys like.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
  17. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    He's got an older version of the Sanders electrostats. I don't remember if he upgraded to the newest model or not.
     
  18. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    Got it. These: http://sanderssoundsystems.com/products/model-10-electrostatic-speaker

    @ohhgourami mentioned that these had a relative narrow sweet spot. But a really awesome sweet spot at that, with amazing sound stage which is one of his top priorities. I think Jason attributes some of these capabilities to the planar geometry of the driver. Possible one of the reasons he focused on a system around his HE-6s.
     
  19. miceblue

    miceblue Friend

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    Oh wow, that's THE Sanders. I was going to look through his e-stat cookbook some day when I get the time.
     
  20. Scott Kramer

    Scott Kramer Friend

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    Means it operates in pure Class A to a higher wattage (...say 10watts, but now 20watts.) So you can listen a bit louder before it has to go into Class A/B switching (one set of transistors handle the positive, one the negative... so possible bit of zero voltage transition distortion, but that may not even be an issue these days or with this amp.)

    *someone please chime in... think that is the basic gist of it though. Transistors need a bit of bias (or pilot light, power) to function.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017

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