Schiit Saga Thread

Discussion in 'Preamps' started by HitmanFluffy, Feb 2, 2017.

  1. batriq

    batriq Probably has made you smarter

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    They can be both switched on, but they don't need to be since the Saga feeds both of them. The Joti is always on, so when I want to listen to the Vali, I set the Joti volume to 0.

    PS. Sorry for the very late response. I've been missing in action.
     
  2. Garns

    Garns Friend

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    Derp, yes, if I thought for a minute ... the first thing in the monitors is an input transformer, so probably not much reason to add another transformer before that.

    So for a RCA to XLRM cable do I just connect RCA tip and sleeve to pins 2 and 3 on the XLR and leave the shield floating at the RCA end?
     
  3. Grahad2

    Grahad2 Red eyes from too much anime

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    I believe you connect 2 to tip, then connect 1 and 3 to the sleeve. This can be done at XLR pin side (i.e., short length bridging 1 and 3) if using a RCA cable, or 1 and 3 soldered to the sleeve if using an XLR cable at the RCA side, or just float the cold.

    You do need to consider if the DAC is OK with it though:

     
  4. Hekeli

    Hekeli Facebook Friend

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    Everything is described in detail in the O300 manual... pro stuff. ;)
     
  5. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    I would only connect the screen to pin 1 of the xlr and leave it floating. Connecting pin 1 and 3 might cause ground loops and cause interference.
     
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2017
  6. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    For RCA to XLRM, it goes tip to pin2, sleeve to pin3, and it's a bit of a tossup on where what to do with pin1. Some way say connect the shield of the cable and float it on the rca side, which is what I would recommend. I do not like shorting the negative to shield.

    If going from XLR to RCA, use a transformer DI and call it a day.
     
  7. Garns

    Garns Friend

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    Thanks all. I leave my shield floating at one end even for XLR to XLR so I think that's what I'll do here.
     
  8. alubis

    alubis Acquaintance

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    Having been using both Saga and Freya for the past three weeks, here are my impressions of the two.

    Speaker: ATC SCM19A (active speaker with built in class AB amps with xlr input only). Note that ATC recommends using balance connections in their manual.
    DAC: Schiit Yggdrasil.

    To my ears, the best setup is Yggdrasil-xlr-Freya (passive)-xlr-ATC SCM19A. Second best is the same setup as the previous with Freya in JFET mode.

    Third best is Yggdrasil-rca-Saga-rca to xlr-ATC with Saga in tube mode while Saga in passive mode came fourth.

    Freya in tube mode is my least favorite despite in full balanced mode. Freya tube mode sacrifices too much transparency and changes the soundstage too much for my liking. Saga tube mode does sound more transparent compare to Freya tube mode. However there are many factors at play, and for the ATC the balance mode is favorable, making it hard to go unbalanced with Saga.

    I wish Schiit would make Saga with balance input and output which would be ideal with my setup.

    For the rca to xlr cable, I tried both configuration: 1. with pin 1 connected 2. with pin 1 floating. Both configurations are stated in the ATC manual, but I can hear hum on the no 2.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2017
  9. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    Nice one. I was waiting for more comparos of the non-tube mode(s) between Freya and Saga. When you say you like Freya balanced/XLR passive and JFET modes the "best" can you describe what you're hearing that you prefer?
     
  10. alubis

    alubis Acquaintance

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    On my setup, moving from Freya passive to Saga passive, I hear a less dynamic and less open sound. It feels like the noise floor (not sure this is the correct terminology) is higher with unbalanced setup hence masking dynamics and transparency (although I can only prove this based on my hearing alone).

    For Freya, the JFET mode seems like adding a slight bass and treble extension, hence my preference for passive since it's sound more neutral to my ears. However, it's a smaller change compare to the all balanced vs unbalanced.

    Please note that on my setup both the ATC SCM19A and Yggdrasil are both balanced designed.

    Before moving to ATC SCM19A, I was using ATC SCM40 passive with Freya and Musical Fidelity m6i (bypass the pre section with Home Theater bypass mode). In the old setup the difference between Freya inputs are not as significant as with the active ATC.

     
  11. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    Might be an issue with cable length, judging from your avatar you speakers are connected with what 2m interconnects?
     
  12. alubis

    alubis Acquaintance

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    The one in my avatar is actually my old passive ATC SCM40, but yes you are correct the interconnect is 2m lenghts.

    Regarding the interconnect is quite interesting since if I float pin 1 in my rca to xlr cable for Saga, then I would hear slight hum coming from the speaker. As per ATC manual:
    "Balanced (XLR to XLR) connection offers lower noise and better immunity to “hum” pick-up. Unbalanced (XLR to Phono or Two pole Jack) connection carries risk of hum caused by multiple signal earths. Hum problems resulting from unbalanced connection may be reduced by making ONE of the following modifications to the signal cable connections: If the driving preamplifier (or desk) is double insulated (i.e. has no mains earth), disconnect the signal cable screen at the RCA Phono plug end. Alternatively, disconnect the signal cable screen at the XLR end. This second option will make the source the reference signal earth."

    Since Saga has mains earth, on the first option (pin 1 connected to rca shield) I don't hear any hum.

     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2017
  13. Riotvan

    Riotvan Snoofer in the Woofer

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    Well 2m should be fine as long as you don't run passive with the saga. The way i would do it with a 2 core cable is have the shield connected to pin 1 of the xlr and floating on the other side. Bridging 1 and 3 on the xlr is asking for noise/hum. But at 2m i would stick with Freya balanced if you want to use passive mode.
     
  14. Jerry

    Jerry Friend

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    Question: if we use saga/freya in passive, does it eat up the tube's life too?
     
  15. alubis

    alubis Acquaintance

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    If you're using passive mode a lot, I would suggest removing the tubes to preserve tube's life because the tube mode is always active even when you are using other modes.

    However, for Saga, I prefer to use tube mode rather than passive. Saga tube implementation is excellent. It's just adding slight tubbiness which is pleasant to hear.

     
  16. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    Last edited: Nov 22, 2017
  17. deserat

    deserat Acquaintance

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    Saga on order along with Vidar, some KEF LS50's, and a bunch cable... Will be feeding Saga from a Yggdrasil. Went with Saga instead of Freya because I'm guessing all I'll need is passive. Also figured passive plus 100 watt amp sounded alot like a Ragnorok for about $900 less ( after taxes ), minus the headphone jack and balanced. Crossing fingers.
     
  18. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    I don't think you'll be dissapointed. Saga + Vidar make a deadly combo for the price and I have tested against some over $2-3K integrated amps and it has them beat in most aspects. Only area I could wish for is bigger soundstage (Vidar is only average in this respect I believe) but actually rolling a good tube in Saga has mostly solved this, which is why this combo is so great and more flexible than integrateds in this price range or above. Passive mode is very good but tube mode is quite nice as well with the right tube, and adds only about 1dB of gain I've found. The benefit being slightly more forward (and palpable) vocals and a broader soundstage, with virtually no loss of transparency.

    Regarding Ragnarok, I've heard it sounds similar to the Vidar, but the LS50s really love power, so I think you made the right choice with Vidar.
     
  19. deserat

    deserat Acquaintance

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    Thanks for the reasurance.

    Any suggestion on a tube to open up soundstage?

    I've also got a maxed out foreplay 3 that I need to finish refurbing, going to enjoy comparing the two,
     
  20. RiddleyWalker

    RiddleyWalker Friend

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    Just got my Saga in. Currently just running it as a preamp to my Black Widow, but it will also serve my JBL monitors. Oddly, it seems like I need to have the volume pot turned all the way up in order to get decent volume. And even then, it's about the same volume as if I had connected my RCAs directly from source to amp. Is this to be expected, or is something amiss?
     

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