Denafrips Ares technical measurements

Discussion in 'Source Measurements' started by atomicbob, Jul 23, 2017.

  1. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    @atomicbob
    I think at some point people might appreciate a post or video detailing just how much work goes into taking these measurements. It's not to toot your own horn, but I think the average person here just doesn't grok what goes into it and imagines it's something akin to hooking up a couple wires and pushing "start" on the magical measurement machine.
     
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  2. johnjen

    johnjen Friend

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    I 2nd that request.

    However it too takes time etc, time that could be used to measure etc.

    A dilemma of sorts.

    JJ
     
  3. Dino

    Dino Friend

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    Everyone I know (including me) finds documentation to be a much more unpleasant (and longer) task than actually doing the job. Maybe @atomicbob is different.

    (Yeah, it would be very interesting, if @atomicbob feels like doing that.)
     
  4. atomicbob

    atomicbob Friend

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    Somewhere in one of the forums (maybe the predecessor changstar) I did a brief outline of the major tasks from setup to teardown. A video would be wonderful for the viewer but it is a lot of work for the producer. I've worked videos from scene capture through post production. A lot of work in itself. Maybe screen captures, pictures, and a description of what each represents, but even that could easily take 6 to 8 hrs. It is like a miniature version of a studio setup prior to session start or venue setup prior to sound check, through actual showtime and then teardown / documentation / post production.

    Very astute JJ. Quite the balancing act between documentation and actual measurements given time constraints on every day. Even organizing the data collected takes time before it is ready to post.

    Dino, you are a man after my own heart. The documentation is easily the most difficult, especially data quality assurance, error checking and cross checking labels to avoid misrepresentation. Tonight, rather than vetting today's measurements I'm having a glass of good red and listening to Muddy Waters via A/B of dac1541 and Gungnir MB into Liquid Crimson and HD800. Tomorrow I really must wrap up and send the dac1541 on to @Hands who has been waiting patiently for me to quit fiddling around with measurements (and a vacation in between.)
     
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  5. gixxerwimp

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    Maybe just one camera with a wide FOV that you then speed up to something like 10x and then throw onto Youtube. This would give people an idea of the amount of effort involved, and hopefully wouldn't require too much work on your end.
     
  6. Elnrik

    Elnrik Friend

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    I could just follow him around with a video camera for a few days. It gets less creepy after 6 hours or so. Just ask my Ex. Actually, don't.

    I'd assume 1 hour setup, 20 minutes per pic he attached to this thread, and a lot of booze. So that's about 9 hours and a hangover. You have my appreciation sir!

    Back on topic, I'm not sure how long this thing should take to settle in. Left it on since I got it a few days ago, and haven't noticed much (if any) change. @atomicbob did you notice a change after initial power on vs after?
     
  7. atomicbob

    atomicbob Friend

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    You aren't far off. Setup is in a shared space so it is similar to a temp Sound Reinforcement gig in a venue except I know the space and locations for power sources.

    Approximately:
    2 hrs - setup, warm-up and calibration checks, verify noise floors. DUT is on one shielded distribution circuit. All SMPS powered devices are on a separate shielded circuit.
    0.5 hr - generate folders with template filenames, rename the files (bulk rename utility used), print appropriate data collection checklist Configure periodic backups to server.
    1 hr - setup / teardown camera, tripod & hot lights for photo documentation, then pick the one with best lighting, reduce size in editor for forum limits.
    4 ~ 6 hrs for each superset of 25+ measurements per configuration (spdif, ASIO, WDM, Balanced outputs, SE outputs, Filter modes, etc.) at 44.1 KHz 24 bit.
    This includes final measurement setup adjustments if any, run the measurement, assess quality of measurement, screen capture results, save to correct folder / filename.
    Repeat 4 ~ 6 hrs for each configuration to be measured. If spanning multiple days, repeat warm-up, cal checks, noise floor verification each day.
    2 ~ 8 hrs (depending on quantity of measurements) organizing and vetting data for forum presentation.
    1 ~ 2 hrs agonizing over any comments and annotations to be made.
    1 ~ 2 hrs posting data to forum.
    No libations until the end of each day. Too much opportunity for mistakes. But I appreciate the sentiment.

    Additionally, I do this as part of my corporate responsibilities, so when corporate fills my queue, it takes precedence over my discretionary measurement time.

    denefrips requested I perform 200 hr burn-in before measurements and listening evaluation. I did not listen other than to verify audio was being produced before the 200 hrs was completed. Yggdrasil did make significant , measurable and audible changes after 168 hrs so it is plausible, though I think 72 hrs is sufficient for most devices, first power on. There-after 1 to 4 hrs for thermal stabilization.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2017
  8. johnjen

    johnjen Friend

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    The one aspect that can all to easily be overlooked is the degree of focus and attention that must be maintained by the operator, continually, in an ongoing basis for each and every one of those 4-6 hr measurement sessions. Not to mention verification of the setup and remembering to document the notes and info that pops up during these sessions.

    It is a demanding mental challenge to remember ALL of the pertinent details, over and over again, with out slipping up.

    These sorts of data generation sessions are definitely not a set and forget, just mash down the button and walk away until its all done kind of thing.

    JJ
     
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  9. atomicbob

    atomicbob Friend

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    Thank-you for pointing that out jj. It is a demanding task requiring extreme, sustained focus.

    Earlybirds viewing the postings may have noted I removed a 20 Hz -3 dBFS square wave response for balanced output because I forgot to Alt+PrtScr before CTL+V to irfanview and then saved the the screen capture of the 0 dBFS version. which had been the measurement preceeding. Very tired when I went into the posting cycle. Saw the mistake just after saving the uploads.
     
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  10. Grahad2

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    Might I suggest Greenshot? This is one of the essentials I install on every machine now since it's light and yet pretty useful.
     
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  11. mitochondrium

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    @atomicbob

    Just want to thank you for the work you put into these measurements. It is very nice to have unbiased test results on gear.
     
  12. atomicbob

    atomicbob Friend

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    Denafrips Ares data updated to include measurements with USB input, Schiit Eitr DDC and some extra information. See first post and posts 5 through 10. Updated post 1 highlights concerning correlation of measurement data to @Torq listening impressions.

    Begin new data here
     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2017
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