L.K.S Audio MH-DA004 - probably sounds bad

@Lenny Try to get a listen to an R2R DAC sometime. The Modi Multibit is cheap enough you may be able to buy one, especially used, just for the sake of curiosity. It will provide a different flavour to your current DAC and you can sell at practically no loss, if you don't enjoy it.

I also haven't heard the MH DA004, but I have heard another DAC with the exact same chipset. I cannot say it was terrible, underwhelming would be a better word. At the price, most people here would prefer the Gungnir Multibit, I think.

 

"The mantra of this forum is to remain skeptical. You can judge all you want but most DACs that have been declared giant killers by the press, other reviewers, etc suck. We're skeptical here until enough trusted members have declared it a winner."

As far as I know there have been no press reviews of the LKS 004. So no "giant killer" press reports. The DAC has virtually no publicity presence, unlike some real "giant killers" out there. It's truly word of mouth. I never declared it a "winner." I only wrote that I liked it and compared it to my vinyl front end. I declared that the title of this thread was a bit silly to be written by someone who has not heard the DAC.

"It's okay to like it. It's not okay to be insecure because you don't understand the culture here."

Thanks for telling me that I can make up my own mind. Do I sound insecure? I don't think so. Read on.

"Are there actual links to these "reviews"? Is it anyone we know whose actual reviewing skills people here trust? If not, you're not any different than the OP."

You can find the comparisons if you search. You can then judge the qualifications of the writers. I am not your administrative assistant. The difference between me and the OP and some others is that I have actually heard the component under question. The rest of you are pontificating without having heard the DAC. If that's the "culture" here I'm not sure I want to linger. Just sounds like a lot of folks here are full of Shiit.

"@Lenny Try to get a listen to an R2R DAC sometime. The Modi Multibit is cheap enough you may be able to buy one, especially used, just for the sake of curiosity. It will provide a different flavour to your current DAC and you can sell at practically no loss, if you don't enjoy it.

I also haven't heard the MH DA004, but I have heard another DAC with the exact same chipset. I cannot say it was terrible, underwhelming would be a better word. At the price, most people here would prefer the Gungnir Multibit, I think."

IMNSHO it is the implimentation of the DAC more than the DAC chip (given one of sufficient quality). I have also auditioned another DAC that runs the ES9038PRO and was not impressed. In its use of two DAC chips, femto clock implementation, and particularly two VERY oversized and well implemented power supplies, plus a large and discrete FET analog section and other very high end parts as well as an independently powered Amanero USB to I2S converter it does what other components using the ES9038PRO chip do not. You should hear pure DSD files over this thing. Try that with your Shiit. And all for about $1500.

Comparing one DAC to another is not a useful excercise IMO. I don't want my DAC to sound like a DAC. IMO the comparison to my analog front end (not to mention to live unamplified music) is more to the point. Don't bother to ask me about my "sounds like crap" analog set up. It's really quite good, but I'm not going to provide you with a punching bag.

In any event no one has asked about my analog, and no one asked me anything about the sound of the LKS 004. And I'm the only one here who has actually heard it. #peculiar.

 

Last I checked you're using a VPI deck with the 12" 3D JMW arm and an AT-ART9 cartridge. No one asked you about it or this chi-fi DAC as no one really cares or can take you seriously enough to care. I'm afraid you can't make yourself an authority on here quite as easily as you can on SH Forums. There exist members on this forum who already know much more about digital and converter implementations than yourself, with better analog front-ends to boot; so you're not really special there.

Feel free to share your findings on this converter versus your analog setup but no one is going to beg you for them.

 

LOL, putting the burden of proof on the reader? Um, sure mate.

Welp, someone sounds like he likes to win friends and influence people. Good luck with that.

 

"Another problem that compounds DAC to TT comparisons is the masters are different."
But not when I compare my RCA shaded and white dogs to .dsf rips of my SACDs of the same disks.

 

"You need to more specific. That would be funny if waveform analysis showed significantly different masters; but you couldn't hear the difference."

Not quite sure what you mean here. AFAIK the SACD's from the old RCA records are made by running the 3 track master tapes through the DSD recorder just as they did to make the tape that they sent to the record cutter for the disks. It is true that the tapes were then decades older, and the mix of middle and sides could change a bit, but I think it's about the closest comparison that can be made. It is also true that some of the later parallel work done by Acoustic Sounds are said to sound different, and better.

"LOL. You guys are so mean.

@Lenny: I don't think it's anything against you personally. It just that the community (and it's funds, that is money) have been burned recently by several recommendations of this sort. We are still reeling from this.

Also, Chinese manufacturers have used shills and sock puppets to push their products on various forums like this one. The first post of this thread reeks of this. I can't tell you have many times I have been promised free gear with a wink-wink if I wrote an appropriate review."

Thank you for the first friendly post. I hang out mostly somewhere else, and by the way it's not at SH.

At the other place there was a post today about MQA referencing a thread on this forum, which I had never heard of. After looking at the MQA post, i did as I normally do when at a new site: look at the analog forum and look at the digital forum. I was surprised to see an LKS thread as almost no one knows about this small Chinese company. I saw the ridiculous title and was surprised by the number of opinions of the DAC by persons who had never heard one. So I chimed in that I have the DAC and that I liked it. I did not say it was better than any other DAC; I did not encourage anyone to buy it. Frankly, I don't give a damn.

Talk about insecure: I sense insecurity in many of the responding posts since my first. I don't know if it is true, and maybe it's not, but it would be a real kick in the head if your favorite DAC could be out-done by this one for $1500 - - - [What would it cost if made in North America or Europe?] - - - and one that does DSD beautifully too. Evidently some say it's so. But I guess we'll never know for sure. LKS is just too small to matter.

 

Backhanded compliments do you no favors. Most people here already figured out to be open minded about stuff. The title of the thread was in reference to the original poster shilling the product without much of an actual review against other known products. Looks like it triggered you to come in here and bash the site with your first post. And here we are.

Personally, like what you like. That's what most people do.

 

@Lenny I think just about all of us would welcome a DAC that sounds as good as the hype would suggest at the price point.

I would love to hear one and won't judge until I do, but we as a community have been burned a few times recently by hyped products from across the ocean and it would be irresponsible to spend loaner tour funds on another (without someone with trusted ears vouching for it).

The build quality and internal components seem to be up to snuff. Does that translate to good sound? We'll only know if we hear it.

 

All Sabres I've heard (ODAC, Geek out 450 and V2 , an oppo bluray player, an Aune sabre dac) had one thing in common; they all sucked.
GO V2 was listenable but the timbre was still off. Of course none of those dacs were fancy $1k+ stuff but do give an idea of the Sbare in-capabilities. One note texture less bass, treble glare/hardness, compression, lack of microdynamics to name a few.

 

@Torq (Retired) just called me (from his boat) to say he's coming out of retirement for one last hurrah, namely a comprehensive review of this DA004. Since he couldn't get a hold of a loaner I believe he just went out and bought one from his own funds, I know he doesn't usually like to do that, but this is a seriously revolutionary implementation...

 

Moreover, this was followed by the arrival of a a breathless and salty hypemonger. These are often wave two, the willing thralls of the sockpuppet shills (as we saw with the S19 and similar). Wave two are often not deliberately dishonest, just clueless and caught up in the heady excitement of groupthink. They get very pissy when this is challenged. The sealioning can become deafening.

It is all absolutely conforming to type; the deja vu is strong with this one.

I would write more, but I just stubbed my toe tripping over all those those fuckin' harpsichords that we have lying about here. You know how it is, Europe stuff.

 

"I don't think you can assume that. Vinyl will usually be mastered a bit differently because of its dynamic range and bass level constraints. I was hoping you could provide exact catalog numbers of these RCA titles, whether the LPs and SACDs are originals, reissues. remasters from Analog Productions, etc. I know for a fact that some of the Living Stereo SACDs (the three track stuff) is mastered differently than the original LPs or reissues of the originals."

When someone refers to shaded dog and white dog RCA vinyl, they are referring to the original releases of classical music, primarily Boston and Chicago Symphony recordings. The original tapes were three channel (except for a few very early 2 channel recordings). For vinyl (and CD) releases they were mixed down to 2 for disk cutting. For the SACDs, and AFAIK there was only one RCA edition, they were offered as two track and 3 track DSD files as well as two track red book.

I know that the SACDs are not identical to the 2 track tape meant for disk cutting, but as I said earlier, I don't think you can get closer if you want to make a comparison to vinyl.

Just for the record, I think that recording and editing in analog (especially with simple miking) and then transferring to DSD (which as I am sure you know cannot be edited) is a great recording technique. Too bad no one works this way today. Some of these .dsf files directly from analog are just remarkable IMO.

"Backhanded compliments do you no favors."
It wasn't a backhanded compliment. It wasn't a compliment.

" One note texture less bass, treble glare/hardness, compression, lack of microdynamics to name a few."
IMO the 004 has none of this. But I agree there's no particular reason you should value my opinion. I also have an Oppo 105 which I hardly listened to (for these reasons) until I got the 004 and now use the Oppo just as a front end. I also use a laptop to play .dsf files (mostly ripped from SACDs) directly into the Amanero board.

"imagine you then coming in full steam ahead making bold claims"
I didn't do any such thing. Please reread my first post. All I said was that I thought the 004 was "really fine." I said that I have not compared it to other DACS. I said that it's been spoken of favorably around the 'net. I also criticized the thread title.
I'm afraid the rest of my remarks were responsive to the attempted insults strewn about rather freely here.

"The build quality and internal components seem to be up to snuff. Does that translate to good sound? We'll only know if we hear it."
Yes, exactly. Also, if you've read only sellers' promotional material you may not be aware that the connectors are Cardas, Neutrik and Furutech. I only mention this because I think that this tiny company is trying to produce quality stuff.

"@Torq (Retired) just called me (from his boat) to say he's coming out of retirement for one last hurrah, namely a comprehensive review of this DA004. Since he couldn't get a hold of a loaner I believe he just went out and bought one from his own funds, I know he doesn't usually like to do that, but this is a seriously revolutionary implementation..."
Nice to know you have participants who would do that. Long burn-in. I will watch for it. But I'm not a trader and I live with components for a long time. I bought my LKS on the advice of someone I trust. I am very happy with mine, especially for the price and the versatility, and am not looking for the holy grail. Caution that it's hard to sell one of these as it is hard to find anyone who has heard of LKS.