Sonic Frontiers SFD-1mk2 Vintage DAC for $750 That Stomps Most Modern DACs

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by purr1n, Nov 9, 2015.

  1. thoth

    thoth Acquaintance

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    P.S. Could it be that the DAC is actually ok-ish, but the amp eats too much current and exhausts some capacitors in the output stage? I've read, I guess from this thread, that SFD-1 has weak output stage. My amp is single-ended Apex Peak.

    Edit: unlikely. Peak has input impedance 50K Ohm. Higher than many other amps.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
  2. Xecuter

    Xecuter Brush and floss your amp twice a day

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    Transformer incompatibility like Yggdrasil and studio perhaps??
     
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    What's the history of the DAC? Do you know? Could be the tubes are old and bad. Last way I would describe the SFD1 DAC is bright.

    The soundstage is farther away and more diffuse though compared to many other DACs.

    Output should be fine into Peak.
     
  4. Mr.Sneis

    Mr.Sneis Friend

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    You could try a tubes swap? I tried different 6922 tubes and didn't like many that otherwise sounded great with amps. 6h23-eb is pretty affordable.
     
  5. mscott58

    mscott58 Friend

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    What's a good price for a used SFD-1? Seems like the one currently on eBay might be a bit steep, and it looks like an original version.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/112253535600?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

    (would have listed on used deals, but figured this audience would know better how to answer this specific SFD-1 question)

    Cheers

    PS - Just saw there's a SFD-2 up on eBay as well, so wonder what a decent price for that will be as well. This one looks like it's had some major upgrades, including an I2S port added to the back panel.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sonic-Front...132384?hash=item360ff7ce20:g:jtgAAOSwnHZYbYqH
     
  6. thoth

    thoth Acquaintance

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    No details on history. But the owner agreed to take it back, so prospects are good. I actually have a choice between sending for repair or returning.

    One more question to SFD-1 owners:
    - The most obvious wrong with my unit is low output volume. Specs say output should be 2.5V single ended, which is similar to modern DACs.

    Is the volume the same as on other DACs or it's lower?
     
  7. Xecuter

    Xecuter Brush and floss your amp twice a day

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    So after leaving the sfd-1 on for a week straight I had a listen tonight and had audible distortion from the LHS channel. I will let the tubes settle and have a listen tomorrow and see if it is sorted itself out.
    I do not think this is a leave it on all the time DAC. It may take the tubes a few hours to settle in after being transported. It might sound its best somewhere between 4hours-48 hours of being on. But I do not think you should leave it on permanently.
     
  8. thoth

    thoth Acquaintance

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    I'm still trying to figure out whether my SFD-1 has any issues.
    1. Xecuter just confirmed that SFD-1 has lower volume than other DACs. Manual says it has output voltage 2.5V, same as DAC-19. Shouldn't it have same volume?

    Other freshly registered user also said in PM that his SFD-1 has lower volume.

    2. @Marvey : How much more terrible is COAX input compared to XLR? I only have COAX for now and it sounds way worse than DAC-19. DAC-19 should be slightly inferior to Master 7/11.
     
  9. philipmorgan

    philipmorgan Member of the month

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    Sfd-1 had less output signal than my Gungnir Multibit I think due to HDCD stuff on sfd-1.
     
  10. manatworks

    manatworks Friend

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    I guess this'd be the good thread to ask, did anyone heard SFD2 mkiii? It uses 8xPcm 1704 instead of ultra analog module from what i dig up from google. Looks pretty interesting.
     
  11. JoeDoe

    JoeDoe Acquaintance

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    Rise from the dead, thread, rise!

    NOS DAC Noob here – looking to dip my toes in the pool of pseudo-analog goodness. I'm going back-and-forth between the SFD mk II and MHDT pagoda. Any of you blokes who've both care to chime in?
     
  12. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    SFD mk II isn't NOS, but allow me to summon @Hands or maybe @Luckbad can answer.
     
  13. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    @JoeDoe, what are you looking for? More bass? More clarity? Smoother sound?

    The SFD MKII has more punch and bigger soundstage. It's very analog sounding and pleasing.

    The Pagoda is a NOS DAC and has the traits that go along with that. It can be quite smooth and easy to listen to with the right tube or even pretty sharp with some.

    It would be hard to choose between the two for most people. Similar qualities. One requires a transport (SFD), so if you don't have a good one you'd need to look into that as well. Both do better with a good S/PDIF converter, but the Pagoda allows you to use USB if you want.

    If you have limited space, the Pagoda is about 1/3 the size of the Sonic Frontiers DAC.

    I actually have two Pagoda boards here, each one a single working DAC chip. I've been meaning to figure out how to remove the chips to swap one over to a board for a while, but have never been brave enough to do so.
     
  14. JoeDoe

    JoeDoe Acquaintance

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    My mistake!
    Thanks for your response. I'm assembling an endgame setup for my PS1000s. I don't do DSD and frankly, SQ is more important but convenience isn't totally irrelevant. My rig is largely desktop based, but getting something like a Singxer F-1 isn't out of the question. The DAC will most likely be feeding one of the ampsandsound amps (still deciding between Kenzie and Mogwai).

    Which unit responds more to tube-rolling? Not a deciding factor, but interested to know which is easier to tailor.
     
  15. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Have you heard a non-oversampling DAC before? If not, why do you want one? I ask because most are best served by OS.

    If you are set on NOS, I say skip all the crap on the market and get the new Metrum Amethyst at least. It's basically a Musette with DAC Two modules and a headphone out if you want to use it as a combo unit. The Musette was OK, but the DAC Two modules in the Amethyst should be a big step up in comparison!

    FWIW, the SFD did not sound particularly like NOS or analog to me. Wasn't particularly warm or anything, if you want that. Good balance overall.
     
  16. JoeDoe

    JoeDoe Acquaintance

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    I have heard NOS - owned the Pagoda for a couple weeks as well as one of the Starting Point Systems DACs. Didn't care for the SPS, but enjoyed the Pagoda with a WA6SE I had at the time.

    I recently sold my Cuinas DAC, which I thoroughly enjoyed, but I've noticed as I listen to more and more music via headphones, I've grown less and less tolerant of upper-end um, intensity. Looking for things to sound more 'analog' to use the overused. I guess I'd say that I'm looking for something that's going to be smooth, maybe a touch warm, but not syrupy, mushy, or under-detailed. I want to hear everything the recording has to offer without having details rammed down my ears!

    I'm trying to keep things under $1k and right now that doesn't apply to the Amethyst.

    PS - I placed an order for an a&s Kenzie last night, so that'll be the headamp with which I'm pairing.
     
  17. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    You may still want to consider SFD1. The SFD1 sounded analog in the sense that the sound was very smooth fluid and the high-end very natural (tube output). Resolution wasn't anything like Yggdrasil, but actually close or meeting Master 7. The stage is deep with SFD1 which works for headphones, if that matters. Most NOS DACs don't stage deeply.
     
  18. JoeDoe

    JoeDoe Acquaintance

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    Thanks Marv. Is the SE+ version comparable to the SFD-2?
     
  19. willsw

    willsw Friend

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    The single-ended version of the releasing-this-month new Soekris is about $825, plus shipping from Europe. We have an OEM board of theirs on the way but it will probably be a while before I can listen to it properly. The Border Patrol DAC, right at $1000 doesn't sound like your typical TDA1543 DAC and is more precise in detail and with better bass than the Pagoda.

    Looking forward to reviews of and hearing the Amethyst. I believe the website says that when used only as a DAC, the power supply is fully given to the DAC and the headphone amp section is essentially cut off, which is a neat feature that makes it more appealing to buy only to use as a DAC.

    It seems like a SFD-1 Mk.II is not going to be less than $1000 for a bit, unless you get a good deal.
     
  20. Thenewerguy009

    Thenewerguy009 Friend

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    I don't think he heard the SFD-2.
     

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