That time when Cellist88 was a pretentious asshole and didn't realize people were messing with him

Discussion in 'How to Win Friends and Influence People' started by Cellist88, Jan 19, 2017.

  1. Cellist88

    Cellist88 Friend

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    I never said the WM1A was a great pairing with the andomeda before I got it. I said I heard...that was it was a good pairing. The CDM did sound better and its a fact. ......and after burn in on the 1A it sounds good. There is no parroting going on here.

    You haven't even bothered to try the player and you don't own the equipment so you don't have the right to say anything in the first place. I don't think you have any experience with the CDM or the WM1A so unless you do, you have no say. I'm sorry to be so blunt.

    There are no comparisons between the WM1A and the Geekout v2+, nor the CDM on head-fi. I don't know where I am getting the populist opinion on HF when it doesn't exist.

    You really have a ego problem, and i told you yesterday, its a forum so people can share their thoughts. If people want to disagree with me, its ok.

    What's wrong with someone liking the Mojo. Instead their ears are wrong and you have to gorge your opinion down their throat like its the truht. I do agree on your assesment over it, but not everyone believes the Go V2+ is better. And thats fine.

    You'll begin to notice there are many good choices that can be made to other people outside of your own preferences and you have to grow up and accept that.

    I play on multi million dollar instruments, and I work in much finer gradients than you do. These fine gradients often split prices around 250,000 dollars to millions, so I know how to critical listen to the most subtle differences.

    You might have some technical ears from hearing a lot of gear, but you probably couldn't tell the difference between two cellos played by the same person, yet alone two pianos played by a different person. Yet alone string timbre, different bows. You can't identify a strad to a grofiller, to a guadanini to save your life. As far as I'm concerned your ears are actually probably pretty shit to mine. You can't hear harmony, and remember pieces that you can dictate them after. You probably can't even hear voicing differences in the piano and identify specific artists playing certain pieces. You probably can't tell a good sound from a bad sound from a string player. Its ok...its not your field of expertise. You don't have a doctoral degree in music.

    Do you like this tone of voice I used? Because it is what you are doing now?

    Your opinion is shit because I for 100% know my experience, knowledge and practice will leave you in the dust because you just are not qualified?

    I saw a post from @Marvey about Rostropovich Bach Cello Suites, saying it was well mastered.

    Yes he was my teacher and his direct descendant in line, David Geringas is my current teacher. I have to say most everyone in the music community don't think very highly of his bach recordings. Its actually one of the least recommended recordings to listen for students. I won't go and tell others that their hearing is wrong if they enjoy the recording. I'm on a plane with my cello and the lady next to me started a conversation with me. She told me her favorite cellist was Misha Maisky.

    I think any competant cellist/musician would puke at the thought as he plays in very poor taste. I've actually met Misha Maisky and played for him........anyways I didn't feel the need to educate her...because she enjoys it. I am not going to go out of my way and hunt her down to tell her opinion is shit.

    You need to grow the f**k up, and stop thinking your opinion is god over everyone else.

    You haven't even heard the equipment.....so as I see it, I am more qualified to share my opinion over it until you do.

    I don't expect people to take my opinions as fact.....because I cannot definitively say it will ever be. Hearing is subjective and above all, everyone should be respected as human beings. There is something called common courtesy. I took the time to describe what I best can in the sound in ways you never do....on forums saying things like "piss poor" sound in one or two liners.

    (Note from @ultrabike: duplicated post from the DAP discussion to give context to this thread)
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 19, 2017
  2. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    Did you just imply that two instruments sound similar just because they're expensive? That's akin to saying that all the speakers at THE Show should sound similar just because they're over 100k.
     
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Kind of on a tangent here - I'm just curious - don't read this negatively:

    Did you give her other suggestions? The Rostropovich Bach Cello Suites came about because we had a battle of the musicians thread in Changstar between Rostropovich and Yo Yo Ma on the Bach Cello Suites. (Haha, I arbitrarily picked two diametrically different styles). What do you think of Yo Yo Ma (personally, I can't stand him and his super ghey flourishes on material like Bach's - his style seems best suited for television commercials for German sports sedans). Also can you explain to us layman why Misha plays in poor taste? As for the Rostropovich performance in the recordings of the Bach Cello Suites. What is wrong with them precisely? Was he past his prime, like Horowitz in those late piano performances (or Sinatra, Elvis, etc.) when he should have just retired and stopped playing? Made too many errors? Sloppy in some parts? Uninspired and hackneyed because he was asked to play this way too many times in his life?
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2017
  4. Cellist88

    Cellist88 Friend

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    That wasn't even the point of my argument...it was his attitude problem.

    Ok for example can you tell a difference between a steinway b and a d? Given you even know what they are without googling it

    Most people can't tell the difference between a Yamaha, a steinway, a Fazioli and a bossendorfer....because let's face it you aren't specialized in that field.


    Quick answer a Concert D is better. Steinway makes many Concert Ds...and they will sound like a steinway and similar but all sound different. Within steinway the two variations are hamburg D and new York D. It's because the two factories on different Continents. Will it sound like a steinway? Yes. Do they sound different? Tremendously. Now can you see how subtle it gets? I could probably tell you all the differences, but it's a waste of time because that isn't the point. Even within a certain pool of steinway hamburg Ds, all of them are different.

    They are all priced the same.

    The new elbphilharmonie asked mitsuko uchida to choose a concert piano for the hall. She rejected of all them.

    They are all priced the same. All stradivarius violins sound different regardless of if they were made in the same period etc. They are all in the millions. Some are 9 million. Some like the lady blunt are 14 million. Both gorgeous and sound nice, but there are differences.

    So yes....even within the same price range it sounds similar yet different and it is subtle but not so subtle. I don't think even an enthusiastic classical lover is qualified.

    A Spiro core string on the c string is different than a larsen magnacore c string. They sound great, but I doubt most people have ears sensitive enough to pick out the difference. They are the same cost.
     
  5. No_One411

    No_One411 Fired by Jude

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    People don't like Misha Maisky cause he romanticizes the Bach Cello Suites.

    To an untrained ear, they probably enjoy it a lot more than a traditional interpretation.
     
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    That's just like pianos. You can get two middle-end Yamaha pianos made in the same factory around the same time, and they could sound quite different. We just don't know what goes into the soundboard, the grain, the density. Same thing with guitars. And get this: same thing with vacuum tubes. Of the same make from the same factory around the same time.
     
  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Oh, so he suffers from Yo Yo disease? Or like Itzhak Perlman romanticizing Mozart to the point where I want to kill somebody? Where I want to say: please dude, just stop with the fancy shit.
     
  8. imackler

    imackler Key Lime Pie Infected Aberdeen Wings Spy

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    What do you all think of Monk's Bach Cell Suite? It's the only I own but I'd like to try another.
     
  9. Muse Wanderer

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    My man for Bach cello suites is Pierre Fournier.

    No romantic rubato rubbish, all melodic lines are crystal clear, dances are lively and inspiring. His sarabandes are simply sublime.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2017
  10. Cellist88

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    Yo Yo Ma is quite a pop star. Most people think he is the greatest cellist alive...I would call him the most successful because of all the things you say. Its more about the show then the content. His sound almost sounds like a viola and I can't stand his facial expressions when he plays. He has mastered the art of this melodramatic sound that is slightly sensual. At first it piques your attention, then you realize it everything sounds the same and it feels like you are eating a stick of butter. Its repulsive. I do have to give him props for popularizing cello to the modern world. Because of him, much like Pablo Casals, we have a lot more people who are aware of the existence of cello.....although i ran into some chinese parents in san francisco who wanted their son to start cello, but didn't know who yo yo ma was? I wholeheartedly agree with your german sedan analogy.

    Mischa Maisky used to be a phenomenal cellist when he was younger. He had a fire to him and he was naturally talented. I have respect for him because he was a nobody when he showed up to tchaikovsky competition. He got to the finals without political intervention....back when competitions were super rigged. Rostropovich asked if he could not pass him to the final, because he wanted to give him a prize the next competition 4 years. Jury members didn't allow, and because it was rigged so he got 6th. He also had some traumatic things like being at a working camp for 18 months. He is talented, but he plays like a pig. He is actually worse than yo yo ma and really looks likes a sick goat playing on stage. He doesn't play necessarily in tune, he has no respect for the music distorting it however he wants. His sound is not beautiful anymore, and he plays with so much tension and aggressiveness. He is worse than yo yo ma when it comes to bach suites. Listen to his bananas in his bow, rough string crossings, that really shitty uneven vibrato....its just nothing bach.

    Rostropovich always feared bach. I mean he loved bach but he rarely performed them because of his fear. Much like why he didn't play Elgar Concerto a lot. He said....well Jacky(Jacqueline Du Pre) plays it better and probably always will, so I don't want to be compared and play it.

    He recorded them very late in his life(you can see the DVD), but at that time, he wasn't at the peak of his powers. It isn't necessarily romantic, but its very labored and played very much in forte most of the time, like a soloist would play with an orchestra volume. It isn't a matter of bad playing, or intonation here and there. I just don't think when you listen to it, it gives insight into bachs world and shows its beauty. The polar opposite approach to bach is Anna bylsma.
    I don't agree with the performances but It seems strange for us to criticize, because he was probably closer in lineage to bach. I know alot of people says Pablo Casals plays bach strangely, but who are we to say? He is actually couple generations down following the lineage of the cellist who worked with bach.

    Rostropovich was amazing at so many things, but he is still human in the end. At least for Elgar and Bach....what a relief.

    As for the lady, I smiled and told her that I just saw him play Dvorak Concerto at the Berlin Comische Opera, because of a friend. I told her it wasn't my cup of tea and that I prefered a different style. I didn't say anything negative, but suggested that she listen to other artists and I gave her recommendations. She received it and asked if there were other interesting pieces I could suggest. I was actually happy that she was a fan of cello and loved classical music. Its hard to come by these days as I get questioned if I'm carrying a guitar on my back.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2017
  11. Cellist88

    Cellist88 Friend

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    I grew up listening to his Dvorak Cello Concerto, Kol Nidre CD. Just i find his old fashioned noble soun with his left hand articulation wonderful. He was known to be a position system freak.... playing scales in thumb position in the upper position.

    Itzhak Perlman is just a douche. I don't know what to say. I was at Juilliard for precollege, bachelors and masters and had to see him in his power chair. Funny story is I saw him and Dorothy Delay racing each other outside of old Juilliard for fun. He is not a very nice person. I heard him say once that asians will never be good as jews because our fingertips are not circumcized. He was sitting in a graduation ceremony, and while hte president was giving a speech, he got a phone call. just picked it up and started talking. The president stopped and walked over to him and asked if he could take it later, and he was like no no no this is important and proceeded. Well good for him. ><
     
  12. No_One411

    No_One411 Fired by Jude

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    Well, just tell them "I'm carrying the sexiest instrument on my back because you put it between your legs and it vibrates."
     
  13. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Interesting. Now that you mention it, it was sort of like the original Schiit Gungnir DS DAC!
     
  14. Muse Wanderer

    Muse Wanderer Friend

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    So is Pierre Fournier your favourite cellist for JS Bach?

    I also love the viola da gamba renditions by Jordi Savall (and anything else he touches really.)
     
  15. No_One411

    No_One411 Fired by Jude

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    About as painful as Maxim Vengerov's facial expressions when he's playing.
     
  16. Muse Wanderer

    Muse Wanderer Friend

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    Not as painful as Lang Lang on the piano though. :eek: Lang is absolutely horrifying.
     
  17. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    We need a battle of the facial expressions thread.
     
  18. Cellist88

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    I don't have any favorites for Bach because it is a very personal thing. Anything that is informed and not dry is great. The hard and beautiful part about bach is where to place yourself between subjectivity and objectivity. It is both and both have to be present or else it isn't bach. I am fine with any individual that shows a deep understanding and honesty in their music. There is now a whole field in music called historic music performance where people use historic instruments, gut strings, concave bows that can't sustain, with no vibrato. I can't say I agree with this approach. Sure it is interesting to know how it sounded in bach's time, but my thought is.....if Bach had seen the possibilities that we have now, wouldn't he be delighted? Wouldn't he wanted some vibrato and marvel at the steel string's ability to have much more resonance and dynamic contast? As long as the music making is good, Bach will be communicative. If Pierre Fournier is the one for you then great! I respect all artists and their effort to understand and represent something as it really isn't necessarily tangible.

    Lang lang is also a very talented individual. He has a monster technique and facility to do anything on the piano. Just ends up his fault is poor taste. If you ever happen to see his score, you'll realize all those movements you hate are written and scripted in his part.

    On the note of bach, I'm not sure if you guys like the Chaconne for violin. Historians inferred that Bach wrote it after the death of his wife. We probably hear the piece as just a chaconne(passacaglia, variations over a bass line) or bach, but someone took it one step further to see how it would have been for people to have heard the chaconne. Within the piece are many choral fragments which were played in worship services regularly. Someone analyzed it and found all the choral fragments and juxtaposed them with voice against violin. I think its quite neat and brings a new meaning to the piece.

     
  19. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I see Bach as the ultimate grandfather of heavy metal music. It is not Bach unless there is this feel, this essence of metal. Du Pre captures this, perhaps in an early Judas Priest metal ballad kind of way. Yo Yo Ma certainly does not.
     
  20. Cellist88

    Cellist88 Friend

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    Du Pre is for sure a rocker. That's the first time I heard that thought of bach being associated to heavy metal music. For me, I think he's the father of military music. You realize that anything that sounds remotely military(even in film scores)always uses counterpoint and fugue because somehow it sounds hardcore.
     

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