The Two Channel Advice Thread

+1 on the AudioEngine if you want something simple and straightforward. I have a pair and they sound decent for what they are.

If they end up going the passive speaker route, AudioEngine also make a small class AB desktop speaker amp that might be worth looking at:

https://audioengineusa.com/shop/amplifiers/n22-desktop-audio-amplifier/

I've never heard this amp, but I would probably opt for it over a cheap class D. I believe it also has some positive reviews out there if you Google.

 

Would you say the MB42x is worth saving over the PB42x powered version?

 

I bought the mb42x because I already had a small amp. However my amp is not great and I'm already looking to upgrade. If I could do it again I would just get the PB42x.

 

I have an old set of PSB Stratus Bronze floor standers and I'm trying to plan a LR 2.0 system to supplement my BH Crack/HD600 rlg. Initially I was thinking Saga/Vidar for the speakers... However, since eventually plan to upgrade the Crack at some point, I'm wondering whether I would be better off going Mogwai SE so I can drive both the Bronze and HD600 off the same amp. DAC would eventually be a Gungnir Multibit.

The bronze are 4 ohm, 92 dB sensitivity, so they are easy to drive (I used to drive them with an old Denon integrated that is now long gone). From a music preference standpoint, pretty much everything except country is my genre of choice, but focus primarily on jazz, classical, classic rock and singer/songwriter type stuff.

Thoughts?

 

Looks like the Mogwai SE is only rated at 3 watts into 8 ohms. So not a ton of power there for speakers. Also they specifically state it has "8-ohm loudspeaker taps" and do not rate 4 ohm power. Also I'm going to bet the PSBs are not as efficient as they are rated either, based on typical manufacturer ratings (which tend to rate a few dB higher than actual). Not sure the size of your room and how loud you like to listen, but to me it sounds like a gamble. I would certainly check with A&S before doing that to see if it can actually drive 4 ohm speakers well.

Saga and Vidar are a great combo for speakers (I have been hugely impressed with them across a few different pairs of speakers so far) - you can't really go wrong there IMO. Tons of power and transparency. If you're not tied to tubes, Ragnarok would likely fit the bill if you're looking for something for both speakers and cans.

 

I completely missed the 3W into 8 Ohms on the Mogwai... I'll talk to them about whether they can drive 4 ohms, but even then it's not much power. Thanks for catching that...

 

Interested in Freya as a preamp for active spekers.

Looked for comparisons of Ragnarok and Freya, used the Super Search, but did not find any in this application.

Could someone with experiences or thoughts on the sound differences between these two help? Hopefully this is the right thread for this question.

My current setup is Auralic Aries - AES - Yggdrasil - XLR - Ragnarok - XLR - Genelec 8050+7060 in an acoustically treated room.

Wondering primarily if Freya would be a more capable amp than Rag in digging out details and/or enhancing the blackness and clarity of soundstage, where I think I may be perceiving a bit of the haze or greyness attributed to Rag and Yggdrasil. Or if there are other sonic differences.

Primarily looking to using the Freya with the JFET or LISST. 6m cables from preamp to speakers probably prevent using the passive mode, and I am not quite ready yet to go down the tube rabbit hole.

Saga seems to be praised for the clarity and details over Freya, but I need to use balanced cables due to all kinds of electrical crap manifesting variously as hiss, hum, or pops with unbalanced amps and cables I tried.

Planning also to upgrade Yggdrasil to the new analog stage, with the same goal.

 

Ended up coming across some Sony SSCS5 speakers for cheap at a nearby goodwill for myself, and I'm curious how the micca's or dayton's would compare. The Sony has three drivers, which isn't exactly an apples to apples comparison, but just curious about the major differences. My friend is bass sensitive, and I'm worried these Sony's might be a bit much for him. (149 a pair plus amp brand new).

 

edit: decided to just buy more records instead

 

Have lived with Saga, Freya and Rag for a while and been able to do sone preamp comparos. Saga is my fave and most transparent, but if you need balanced I’d say Freya all the way. It’s far more capable as a preamp imo. Less of its own signature, less circuit in the way = more transparency. The 6SN7 gain stage is pretty linear with just a bit or richness to give away the fact that its tube. JFEG buffer is fine but the real stars are passive/tube stage. LISST is whatever unless you need gain. Remote control is nice, more ins/outs is nice, smaller case is nice. Go freya for sure.

From least to most favorite:
Rag > LISST > JFET > Passive > Tube

Which surprised me because I usually like passive the best and find most tubes too colored.

 

Thanks for sharing your experiences! I am definitely leaning in the Freya direction based on the assumption it would be more transparent than Ragnarok.

 

So after a long period of not sitting down and actually listening to music, I finally got the 2ch/ headphones set up after the move. Was able to squeeze in a whopping 30 minutes to listen to the speakers. This is the first time I've listened to the Freya and Nighthawk that I scored from Vansen. It sounded... less than impressive. I doubt it's the Freya/Nighthawk - listening with headphones was noticably better than what I had before. I don't think my new (temporary) place may be suited. The living room is facing the street (loud) and I'm above a restaurant (loud). The ceilings are also stupidly high, which I'm sure is affecting the sound. I was considering upgrading my speakers (currently Elac B6), but now I'm thinking it might be better to wait until I can buy a home and be somewhere more permanent.

So I guess the question is - is it worth it to upgrade to a big boy headamp (Cavalli Liquid Carbon to something like ZDS/AF) and delay a big speaker purchase for possibly a few years? Headphones obviously don't care what environment they're in, but can't match speakers in most respects. I figured the $3000 or so would be better spent on speakers but I don't know.

 

what are your speakers?

 

Elac B6 Bookshelves

I should mention that I had them at a previous place and remember them sounding better, but maybe that's just in my head. This was before Vidar/Freya/Nighthawk.

 

probably a placement issue. if that same setup sounded better in another room, try to place around the listening position and speaker placement. that may help!

 

How much can the electronics chain change the soundstage for a speaker system? My current speakers presented a very wide sound stage when i auditioned them at the dealer, but its not as wide at home (although they are in a much smaller space), is it just down to speaker placement, room treatments? or would the dac/amp choice make any significant different (current chain is roon, aries, Gungnir Multibit, freya, MF A5cr power amp)

 

Different rooms will change the sound much more than different decent electronics.

 

While the magnitude is bigger it's ime not a apples to apples. Acoustic space dictates certain aspects of sound more, like size, symmetry, air etc while electronics change other things (image articulation, depth) or same things differently (fake air, geometrically disproportional stage and such).

With well tuned high end system I'd personally take uber dac or uber amp before uber tuned acoustics.
I hate the deficiencies of electronics more than that of acoustic space, I can kind of get used to mediocre acoustics.

I used to be room treatment nut, no more.
Even so, when you want to know what your speakers are really capable of try them outside in large open space when there is no wind.

 

You listed your electronics, but what speakers are they?

If the dealer room was very different in its size and configuration, likely that is the main factor affecting soundstage, but certainly electronics can make a diff. If they were running all tube amplification for instance, that can have a big impact, although Freya will have some of that tube staging at least.

I would start with trying to optimize your room just for speaker placement, angle and seating position, not getting into room treatments. Treatments tend to tame bad frequencies rather than widen your stage.

I found actually pulling my speakers a couple of feet more into the room (and pushing my seating positioning back accordingly) made a big difference in staging, as well as the "toe-in" and separation between the speakers can make a huge difference.

 

Thanks, the speakers are the larsen 6.2 I didn't mention them as i've already done a bunch of experimenting with their placement, and conventional speaker placement wisdom mostly doesn't apply, given their design.

The room at the dealer was much larger, and were demo'd with a sony CD player and Parasound amp, nothing special, no tubes. I've been using the Freya in jfet mode, I'll dig the tubes out and try those again.