Sennheiser HD660S Speculation

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by Junki, Oct 8, 2017.

  1. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    Yup. The one and only. He likes the cans quite a bit me thinks. He did a dedicated equalizer for them as well.
     
  2. Ringingears

    Ringingears Honorary BFF

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    He has plans, I believe, to make a filter for them for the Kameleon EQ down the road. I suspect he would like to measure a pair under better conditions as he was in a dealers shop for these measurements, before he designs the filter. And yes, he does seem to like them. I don’t think he’s saying to move from the 650 if you already have a pair though, if I read his impressions right. Grain of salt on all this.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  3. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    LOL! I'm browsing through Solderdude's reviews. He is quite nice with manufacturers. Some things I would bitch and moan about, he is more forgiving. Way more forgiving.

    His Kameleon is an interesting concept. I wasn't aware of it until now. I know he was looking into analog equalization. He offers small modules to equalize different headphones. It's a kool concept.
     
  4. Ringingears

    Ringingears Honorary BFF

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    Yes it is. In fact I have a prototype of the filter and a little amp he made for the old black driver HD650’s I own. Does some very nice things to those cans. IMHO. It doesn’t go very loud, which is great for the way I listen. As such, it is hard to really hear it well under meet conditions. I’ve brought it a couple of times, but it couldn’t do justice to those cans with all the noise as you can’t really crank up the amp.
     
  5. jowls

    jowls Never shitposts (please) - Friend

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    It’s interesting that a completely different driver can (apparently) measure so similarly. Perhaps the enclosure has a hell of a lot more to do with the result than I had previously thought? I wonder what an HD700 driver in an HD6XX would measure like...
     
  6. monacelli

    monacelli Friend

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    Looking at Solderdude's frequency response plots and comparing them to Tyll's measurements of the HD700, the similarities jump right out at you. The mini-notch around 4 kHz being a prime example. The HD660S frequency response very much looks like that of a better behaved HD700. Note that I am comparing measurements from disparate systems, which is somewhat dubious.

    Here's a handy comparison for reference (along with Jude's measurements which look badly over-smoothed to me):

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Ash1412

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    I remember Floyd Toole stating that the bigger the room the less it affects the sound source/driver. Since the size of headphone enclosures to their drivers are relatively small compared to speakers in a room, I'd say they might make or break a pair of headphones.
     
  8. Steakface

    Steakface Acquaintance

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    A less polite version of the HD650! As hard as it is resisting the hype... I think wait for more reviews. Thank you all who have taken the first leap though.
     
  9. westermac

    westermac Friend

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    I would hardly classify anything on this thread thus far as hype (though there was some spirited debate on Common Core), more cautious pessimism tempered with a healthy dose of corporate skepticism and general kerfuffling.

    I love this place - really helps me keep my spending under control. HD600? Magni 3? Yup, I'm good.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2017
  10. Junki

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  11. chakku

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  12. Arun Kumar

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    Interesting review from solderdude. It will be interesting to compare it against a kiss modded HD650.
     
  13. Ice-man

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    I wonder if they'll be an influx of 650's for sale on HF? I'll keep both for now, but it could be a good time to pick up a pair of 650's gently used. They could turn out to be "better" than their successor. ;) Hopefully Senn will be shipping these out quickly and we'll all know in about three days or so.
     
  14. jowls

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    Gently used HD650’s? Old news... Someone is selling a gently used HD660S already.

    https://www.head-fi.org/threads/fs-ft-sennheiser-hd660s.863618/
     
  15. Ice-man

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  16. 93EXCivic

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    I hope there is a big influx of HD650s for sale (preferable with lower prices). I want to build a HD650K to compare against my HD600.
     
  17. powermatic

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    I'm not really familiar with Solderdude so I've got no context for his reviews, but lines like this from his listening impressions relative to the HD650...

    "Mids are slightly cleaner and realistic sounding with ever so slightly less ‘clarity’ perhaps. Mids sound a little cleaner and more ‘dynamic’ and perhaps a bit ‘cleaner’."

    ...aren't exactly confidence inspiring. I guess the takeaway is that the mids are both cleaner, and 'cleaner'? But less 'clear'?

    Looking forward to reviews from @Tyll Hertsens, @Marvey , @ManyOthersHere.
     
  18. Skyline

    Skyline Double-blindly done with this hobby

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    @powermatic I think that was just a typo/mistake. He's not writing for a publication after all.

    Solderdue knows his stuff.
     
  19. Junki

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    If you ever visited the SBAF's HD650/M Compendium, which as of this reply is the only stickied thread in the Headphones forum, you should see as the third item below Quick References Solderdude's Sennheiser HD650 treatise, a 13MB PDF where he empirically evaluates the HD650 and its many variations.
     
  20. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    LOL! There are indeed issues with Solderdude's review. Mine are probably not much better.

    But in summary I think what he said in that write-up is that there is not much difference between an HD650 and an HD660S. He felt the bass was better defined on the HD660S (I have my reservations about this but time will tell). About his mids discussion, I decoded that the mids were more forward on the HD660S and the cans were more lively (more apparent treble) as well. I would say the HD660S almost seem like an HD600. Note that while the HD6x0 are very consistent, there might still be product variation.

    Where I mainly disagree with him is in his assessment of distortion. I don't see a big difference between his HD660S and HD650 samples. In fact, I just don't see it. It could be product variation of whatever. They are too close IMO.

    Where I do see a difference is in impedance and price. Sennheiser pulled this shit many times before:
    1. HD580 is released in 1993. Basically a dynamic version of the HD90 which was released in 1991.
    2. HD580 "mo bettar" Jubilee edition is released in 1995. Difference: Cup pattern and price.
    3. HD580 Jubilee edition is renamed HD600 and is formally released in 1996. Difference: Color scheme and cheaper HD580 is discontinued (EDIT: As pointed out bellow, it wasn't discontinued in 1996, but the writing was on the wall).
    4. HD650 is released in 2003. Difference: Color scheme, mosquito fart difference in sound signature, and price.
    5. HD660S is released in 2017. Difference: 150 ohm driver, mosquito fart difference in sound signature (?), and price.
    To me it's more about justifying price increases on the "legend" here.

    As for the naming convention, I think it all started with the HE90. To me it sound like "High-Definition Electrostatic" of the 90's. Then made a dynamic version in 1993 named HD580 to position it next to all their dynamic "high-end" cans. Shortly after they made the cheaper HE60 in 1994, which sold for $1500. Then came the Jubelee HD580 in 1995 and so on. The nomenclature of the HD600 seems to fall more in line with the HE60 nomenclature. Then came mosquito fart price improvements with anything HD6x0 nomenclature.

    Here is a great time line post in HF: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/headphone-history-timeline.821423/

    The first were the HE90 and the HD580. The HE90 giving the ghost long time ago, and somewhat being "reborn" through the HE-1060 (Orpheus 2) which is way more pricy.

    It's a business.

    Based on this history, I think Massdrop's HD6xx are a great opportunity.
     
    Last edited: Oct 25, 2017

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