USB Nervosa Thread Decrapifiers, pro interfaces, and bears oh my

I also think it's reasonably clear... There are some physical technicalities to grasp to make full sense of it, I guess.

This is also not what my post is putting into question. It's not about whether or not it's bit perfect.

My point is that the transmission of digital data over a physical layer is not quite the exact science some want to believe it is. As I said, there is *more than* just bits in a digital audio signal. I'm not talking only about the digital effectiveness of it; there's also the fact that everything still has to obey the laws of physics. Nothing is happening on a vacuum.

If I do hear differences between dacs, decrapifiers, cables, etc., and there is still space for a reasonable explanation that doesn't necessarily clash with current knowledge, I think it's worthwhile to have an open channel of discussion about what should and shouldn't be reasonable expectations for a process no one has full knowledge of.

I do expect some people to disagree and call me delusional, whatever. I'm not here to please anyone. But I find it bizarre that some folks do not want to open such channel as if we already know the whole truth. We don't.

All I'm saying is keep an open mind and don't make the mistake of presuming that "science" is above or defines reality.

 

Here is a link to managing digital wow & flutter, wander and jitter respectively:
System Synergy - Special Sound
At this level of bit stream transport management the dominating differences are DAC implementation and DAC output stage. Of course electro-acoustic transducer and synergy with amplifier will have orders of magnitude more effect.

 

@kkl10 it is a bit-perfect representation of the data. Emphasis on the terminology here.

It is not the whole information, clearly - timing issues such as jitter are very real engineering challenges with all packetized digital protocols, not just usb; toslink and spdif are not immune.

Dirty power, and it's effects on the bus-powered part of equipment and possible bleed-through to the rest are unique to usb, since its the only powered bus in wide use for audio, but are also real-world engineering concerns for any bus-powered device on any such powered bus.

People who deal with power-over-ethernet device design could tell stories, I bet.

But there's no mystical component to it - power coming out of a computer is dirty, full of rf, the voltage varies depending on the load on the processors, and bad cables can make it worse - but not really better, the spec for 2.0+ usb cables doesn't leave much room for filtering, let alone physical room in the connectors.

Jitter is set by the usb chipset clocking, all ports connected to the same chip in the same machine have the same jitter issues, and cables affect that not at all, ever.

In order for that to happen you'd need a wizard that magically makes your cables longer & shorter by many many orders of magnitude.

There's definitely space for optimization, but be aware of the real world limits of what does what.

Personally I find that unison and other good usb solutions like whatever @soekris uses in his dacs are more than good enough, and improving on it is so expensive you might as well get a good rpi streamer like a pi2aes or Digione signature and a good psu, because improving meaningfully on a USB source for a pc involves buying a separate USB card, and a thunderbolt enclosure, and a linear psu for that enclosure, and for that money you can get a streamer, psu, and a few days of holiday somewhere nice, or a bunch of records.

 

Perhaps there is some molecular level at which we could be said not to know how steam engines work. But they are well enough understood. Computer systems and associated communications are the steam engines of the current day. Of course we know how the damn things work. Faults and all.

There are other posters on this very page who are very well able to talk about this technology and engineering, including where it may go in the future. They don't need unicorns or mystical unknowable.

Have fun in your universe.

 

You mean all digital communication is unreliable? Stochastic process is used interchangeably with random process.Wire resistance is random? Voltage on the wire is random? I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

Also, keep in mind, that our brain can recognize patterns were are none and decipher noise as audio cues. So I would not be surprised that the noise shape is main part of "mystical power".

 

I removed the WYRD from my main chain after discovering the DAC in the Bifrost 2 was not USB powered (thanks SBAF) and put it in front of my Ifi Micro BL in my second chain. It was nice since it could power/charge the micro but upon taking it out I noticed it was adding a veil. I have not noticed a difference other than the veil being lifted on the micro since removing from either chain.

 

Using MacBookPro 2016.
Sound out thru USB-C - what to choose?

1. USB-C connected to iFi idsd black (to HIFIMAN Edition X V2)
2. USB-C to 3.5 headphone jack (to IEM JVC HA-FDX1)


44.1kHz, 48 kHz or 96 kHz?
16-24 bit

Mostly listen to Tidal Hifi, some FLAC-files and more seldom SACD.

What option to choose for me to get best sound?
Or is it automatic fix in some way?

 

Searching for an USB-C bluetooth device/dongle (for Mac) that can transmit LDAC to a bluetooth headphone.
Google does not help me..

Is there any (preferably small) blueetooth device/dongle that can do this for me?
..and is there a similar product as a dongle to iPhone XS S (lightning connection)

 

I do have a question on some weird issues I'm having in my audio set up. My source is typically Tidal running on a Mac Mini (late 2014), sometimes I use Audirvana on the Mac with my music stored on its internal hard drive. My DAC is the Convert 2 and I can connect the DAC in one of the following ways:

1. USB from Mac to Convert 2.
2. Thunderbolt out from Mac to AES 16e to Convert2 (AES in)
3. Pi2AES (with Volumio) connected to Convert (AES). My Pi and Mac Mini are connected on the same wireless network.

No issues with the first connection.

For case 2, I find that Audio Midi (on the Mac) automatically upsamples to 24/192 regardless of the song - 16/44, 24/96, 24/192 etc. There are no other options shown in that app. I try to change the rate on the Lynx Mixer software to no avail; it is always mirrors Audio Midi and I cannot change the rate in Audio Midi.

I have a similar issue with Pi2AES that is better suited in that forum.

In all cases, I use the Word Clock in the Convert and switch sample rates manually. Any thoughts on what I could be doing wrong?

 

Shanling M0 should work.

For an iPhone, try Apple's Lightning to USB Camera Adapter MD821ZM, and connect to Shanling M0 (you'll also need a USB A to USB C cable).

 

A friend of mine told me that the music apps like Roon, Audirvane and JRMC, only have control over USB for exclusive* digital out. When you use optical or thunderbolt (on the older Macs), it is governed by the Mac OS, hence the MiDi stepping in and resampling. Some of the newer Macs utilize the USB-C port for thunderbolt. So I am not aware how that works.

Edit: My friend says that Thuderbolt should behave just like the USB. So I am not sure what is causing the resampling when you are using Audirvana.

* Exclusive - The music app determines the output digital stream based on the in-app settings and is not determined by the MiDi

 

I know you are responding to a question regarding a mac, but I do not believe that it works this way in Windows. If I use optical out via jrmc on a W10 pc, I can still set jrmc to play at the native sample rate of the track, or have it resample on the fly to any sample rate the pc is capable of transmitting to the dac (some are limited to a max of 96k, at least one will send up to 192kHz) and the dac is capable of playing. This is true regardless of the settings in the W10 audio control panel. At least that is what jrmc says it is playing.

 

New voodoo?

Lector Strumenti Audio Grounding Box
Lector Strumenti Audio's new Grounding Box (€4700 including two cables) is based on the company's big Aamorph low noise capacitor built within their laboratory. The unit features large copper plate and a round disk made by copper fitted over pillar on top plate. The grounding capacitor is isolated by aluminum box and closed by silicium pills for to reduce humidity. Grounding Box offers a supply with very low noise ground (GND-Earth) terminal for optimal interface with your audio equipment. The product comes supplied with five terminal ground connectors that have internal passive electrical circuits to reduce ground loops. Lector Strumenti Audio says that their Ground Box provides a great improvement with ideal grounding terminal connection to produce better resolution, lower residual noise, and an overall cleaning of the audio spectrum. Groundig Box's casing is made with real wood 2cm thick, with an overall dimension of 30cm x 35cm x 16cm (LxDxH). Additional cables are ~€175 and Spike Kit is €50

 

Kinda like the Entreq stuff only 'spensiver.

I wonder if folk who actually buy this type stuff ever do anything to treat their room or overall room freq response?

 

I would think someone spending this much on a ground loop issue would have already spent money on a power conditioner, which should have resolved the group loop issues, right?

 

I never heard a ground box, but I suppose it has to affect the sound. I mean, a house/apartment and the audio gear/speakers must be properly grounded from the start, introducing another component that does the same thing may cause a sonic change, it will probably homogenize the sound and make it appear smoother but in reality less resolving and dynamic. I've noticed that most people liking this kind of stuff generally has speakers with metal drivers or rooms with large glass windows, maybe the supposedly warmer sound is a welcome addition to those kind of setups if one does not want to change the speakers/amp/source?
Again, just a crazy theory, but it certainly makes sense to me.

 

Ground boxes in general sound great. Listen to Diana Krall Glad Rag Doll ( Edition Deluxe) around 1:24 . You can hear the sound of her right thigh rubbing on the left thigh. Very exciting and no way you can hear this shit without a ground box with the price tag of at least $4-$6k.

 

It is not for your everyday obvious ground loop really, it is, at least in some of the propaganda I have read, all about a clean ground plane and in some cases a single point of ground, kinda like star grounding in an amp or other component.

Now, I will say I did hear what a ground choke can do on the AC input of a tube preamp. Heard the before and after and it was audible and better imho. This was on the AC input to the pre. But it was only about $5 if I recall.

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Schurter/DENO-25-0001/?qs=A5k8bsa1loDfpdVSyZOXZg==

 

No, that would require some work and maybe some knowledge. What they have instead is their bank account, that's it.