Hifiman HE-6

I would like to try out a HE-6 or HE-500 anyone got a pair to loan?

 

Thanks for the additional point of view Jozurr. I can get the euphonic vs neutral thing. That boils down to personal preference.

That said I wouldn't underestimate the role of the preamp. In the speaker world, preamps are definitely as important as the rest of the chain and they can fetch crazy prices for good components. Preamp-amp matching is also a thing, so I personally prefer to think about the chain as a whole. So it's possible you're missing on what the benchmark is able to offer, because synergy, or lack thereof.

Also depending on which version of the he6 you have, the extra low noise floor might not be completely resolved. I am sure the v2 simply can't, as it's far from being as clean as the v1.

In other words, the benchmark can be overkill, unless the rest of the chain is up to the task. Paired with a freya, it might be interesting to play with the output tubes for additional wetness/lushness. Not the way I'd personally take, as I'm after clarity and neutrality above all else, and prefer to let the music speak for itself.

 

It's not necessarily between euphonic vs neutral but more like musical vs sterile/analytical. With the AHB2 the "getting drawn into the music" or engagement factor just wasnt there for me and overall thin sound was a distraction. The J2 doesnt over emphasize specific frequencies and nothing sticks out, but it might not be dead neutral/measure the best etc. The question becomes, is that desirable?

Yes in an ideal world if the HE6 were somehow perfectly neutral (what neutral is, to be agreed on), then yes Id let everything be as transparent as possible. However all things neutral, the HE6 is a little bright sounding to me and thats why I feel the J2 sounds better to me. The treble is very extended, but never sounds hot or sharp. It's an achievement in itself.

Yes the AHB2 is a very powerful clean sounding amp, but I am comparing it against the J2. The J2 isnt as powerful (doesnt matter at all here because its still plenty for HE6), but no other amps Ive heard really sound like a J2 and the synergy is extremely wonderful. These are two extremely good amps and probably better than the limits of what can be done with the HE6, and yes it comes down to a matter of preference in the end.

 

What type of he6 do you have?

 

modded 6 screw version

 

At the moment, I prefer my AHB2 without a preamp and connecting directly to the dac and using the on-board volume control. It feels like things have "snapped into place", for lack of a better phrase.

 

Wow that is almost the same as my chain Yggdrasil>KCT Preamplifier>J2>HE6 (Open grills), and I concur! The J2 sounds like a clean tube amp.

 

That's what I thought Jozurr. That's definitely the bottleneck here.

Doesn't change the fact that out of all impressions (at home listening, not noisy meet) of the ahb2 from trusted members around here, you're the only one to think it's thin and clinical. Something is amiss.

 

And that sounds bright?

 

I bought a stock unmodded 6-screw HE-6 in good condition for a very good price today. It will come with both pleather and velour pads.

I don't have any Vegan pads (Audeze no longer seems to have these for sale independently) or Blutack to work with right now. At this moment, is the best--and only--mod I could currently do to improve its sound removing the grill and the disc underneath completely, along with using velour pads?

And speaking of grill, how about simply removing rhe disc underneath and putting the grill back in place? How does it compare to removing the grill and leaving the driver exposed? If there is not much difference, I would rather have the grill on, since not having anything at all means no protection.

For example, I still keep the grill on for my modded HD650, although I did remove its foam disc underneath.

 

@songmic What amp you planned to run it with? You still got k1000 right? I think that's pretty nice excuse to grab a nice speaker amp.

 

Mjolnir 2. It has enough juice to make the K1000 scream to ear-splitting levels, so why not the more efficient HE-6? I'm sure it would sound better out of a decent speaker amp, but it's not something I could currently afford.

 

Out of the AHB2 to me, yes. I find the J2 better in that regard.

 

It's pretty simple guys, Jozurr ( also myself) personally find a stock HE-6, and even most modded HE-6 brighter than we want. For me, HE-6 nails the bass and mids with the right mods but the treble above 10kHz just keeps on trucking giving a nice air and ethereal quality to the sound but IMO it's not natural sounding like good speakers especially since with speakers treble is attenuated by distance to your ears where with headphones it's right there.

I found a mod combination that works for me personally adding highly customized materials and damping to suit MY personal preferences.



If I didn't have extensive mods I probably wouldn't use them. They're just too bright compared to my speakers and HD650 (also modded).

 

You could either call that something being amiss, or have multiple opinions on an amp, with people having different preferences and hearing things differently.

There is a reason everyone does different mods to the HE-6, some going as far as doing the fuzzor+vegan to tame the treble on the HE-6 down. Yes if I had the fuzzor+vegan pads on the HE-6, then the AHB2 might not sound as bright because those mods bring the treble down significantly but those mods kill the sparkle on the HE-6 for me more than I'd like so I'd rather hear the HE-6 more out of the J2 which still sounds very clean but never hot.

 

Cskippy and Jozurr, nobody here is disagreeing with personal preference. What we are calling out is the fact that it is not presented as such. A newbie looking to get the proper amp for his he6 will get lost and this is not what we're looking for here. Here is the deal :

= Not useful

= Useful

This place is not a collection of opinions, there are other forums for that. This is a place where people state their preference within a common frame of reference, so we can get good information. Nobody will call anyone out for liking a warmer/brighter sound, but they will be called out for using big fuzzy words without proper reference. Especially when this is about a known piece of gear, reviewed / owned by long term trusted members who know each other well.

With a lightly modded He6, it's entirely possible that a neutral amp will let the He6 treble peaks go through. But that's not the amp's fault if the headphones are bright.

 

Some people correct the treble by modding the phones, others by using an amp that already has better synergy so you dont have to do that on the phones, why do you feel the first is better than the latter?

When you say it is not presented as personal preference, what do you mean? The details of my chain are stated, so are the mods, and all posts are prefaced by how that sounds to me. In the end someone having a different opinion is also a "preference".

Nobody has faulted the amp here, only the synergy with the HE6, which is what this thread is about isn't it? We arent judging the amp here for its capabilities in general. You can read reviews all over the internet for it. Does the synergy work well with the HE6, sometimes yes, but I feel the J2 is a better amp for it by default.

You can agree with it based on information provided about the chain and having said that I owned both of them and compared them side by side before forming an "opinion" or disagree without having heard either. Parroting isn't too healthy.

 

It's not, and never was about amp vs mods. It's about clear point of reference.

How would you feel about someone saying that the gs-x isn't bright, because through his headphones, tonality is perfect ? You'd likely think that something is not expressed properly, because I don't think there's anyone here who'd argue that the gs-x is anything but bright. It might suit some people, within the constraints of their chain, but its characteristics don't change.

Also, from my previous answer,

Lastly, if you haven't actually caught that, I do own the ahb2, as well as Armaegis and Negura (X2), whose amp had a lengthy stay at Ohhgourami's place. So we all have a good idea how it sounds. It also replaced or went toe to toe with some references (EC studio and Ohhgourami's giant Krell namely).

 

Received the HE-6 (6-screw) today. This is the 2nd pair I've owned, having sold my 1st pair (4-screw) years ago when I felt it hadn't been a good match with my then speaker amp. Dunno why, but the 70W amp clipped with HE-6 before reaching optimal volume levels for listening.

With no Vegan pads or Blutack available, I only did the simple mod of removing the grills and the cotton underneath completely. I thought there was a layer of disc underneath the grill that could be detached from the grill so that the grill could be put back into place, but turns out they are stuck together as one. Like @ohhgourami's mod, I preferred removing the grill as it made the soundstage more wide open and less veiled, at the expense of leaving the drivers exposed without protection and a slightly brighter sound.

Surprisingly, the Mjolnir 2 I had on hand wasn't so shabby, in fact it performed surprisingly well for a sub-$1K amp. Although I would be able to squeeze out more performance with a uber speaker amp, I think I would be hard pressed to find a better amp for HE-6 than Mjolnir 2 in its price range. I've read that some people prefer Mjolnir 2 to Rag for HE-6 due to the former's warmer and lusher sound which mitigates the HE-6's brightness. I've never heard the HE-6 off a Rag, but the Mjolnir 2/HE-6 didn't really sound too bright for me. My all-time favorite headphones are HD650 as I can't stand brightness, but the combo was acceptable to my ears. Maybe running warmer tubes helped.

Now, having come from the likes of K1000 or HD800 driven by DNA Stratus/EC ZDS/ECP T3, the HE-6 doesn't offer the wide open and spacious soundstage of the former 2 even with its grills and cotton removed. But in terms of soundstage depth, I feel the HE-6 isn't so shabby. It is also less fatiguing than HD800, albeit not as so as HD650. What I also like about the HE-6 is that it is a genre master like the HD650. The K1000 and HD800, while being great in their own terms, catered to certain genres. Throw anything from classic and jazz to contemporary pop and rock, the HE-6 excelled in everything.

I suppose this is the advantage of being an orthodynamic headphone, but the HE-6 was particularly strong in the bass department for a headphone that is generally considered by some to be bright. The bass was tight, hit deep and hard. I guess it's not a fair comparison, but the bass extension was much better than my K1000 (which is a bass-heavy unit) driven from the same amp. Not having owned any planars for so many years, I think I forgot how bass could sound so good.

One thing that surprised me a bit was how inefficient the HE-6 is. Sure, everyone knows that, but looking at the figures on their spec sheets, I expected the HE-6 (nominal impedance of 50 ohms and sensitivity 83.5dB/mW) to be noticeably easier to drive than the K1000 (120 ohms and 74dB/mW). Strangely, although Mjolnir 2 could easily drive the HE-6 to loud levels, I didn't feel the HE-6 was any more efficient than K1000 on the same volume knob. I don't know why, maybe there are other factors at play here, but now I understand the HE-6 notoriety for moar power.

These are my subjective comparison of the 3 headphones in several departments. I'm using Mjolnir 2 for K1000/HE-6, and ECP T3 for HD800. Note the K1000 is stock bass-heavy and swiveled more than halfway, the HE-6 is grill-less and using stock velour pads, the HD800 has SuperBAF and SuperDupont mods equipped.

Resolution: HD800 > HE-6 > K1000
Soundstage width: K1000 > HD800 > HE-6 (not really a fair comparison since the K1000 drivers are physically distanced away from the ears)
Soundstage depth: HD800 > K1000 > HE-6
Treble extension: HD800 > HE-6 > K1000
Bass extension: HE-6 > HD800 > K1000
Genre master: HE-6 > K1000 > HD800
Fatigue-free: K1000 > HE-6 > HD800 (the K1000 is brighter than HE-6 but is less fatiguing because the drivers are farther from the ears)
Comfort: HD800 > HE-6 > K1000 (the HE-6 is heavier than K1000 but doesn't torture your temples like the K1000 does)

On a side note, listening to HE-6 has made me even more curious about the Code-X!