Schiit Gungnir Multibit impressions

Another important point: You all have made an outstanding SS pre amp in the Freya S. From build to function to sound; It is outstanding. I love it, thanks.

Cheers,

Scott

 

Lol from your last DAC blind tests at Schiitr between DS/Multibit, the Yggdrasil is sweating. Can you imagine if you did a face off against Modi 3 and a fully warmed up Yggydrasil, and folks preferred Modi 3? Mike would keel over if he knew the results. The horror, the horror.

Anyway back to the honeymoon with the Gungnir...

 

Schiit's been rigged...but yeah I was kidding, the results aren't surprising either as you posted about them in another thread.

purr1n any idea why Schiit swapped tonalities between the Gungnir and Yggdrasil? Seems odd they would make their cheaper DAC harder to integrate into systems.

 

I have never heard the A1 Gungnir MB, but I don't think I could improve upon the A2 (which I assume is what I have) for less than about double the price. But that is just for my taste. When it comes to comparing DS and MB dacs, I would be surprised in any given comparison over a relatively short time if the DS option (assuming all else is equivalent, which of course it never really is) wasn't preferred by most listeners.

I think the strengths of DS implementations (good ones at least) are more immediately apparent to most people than those of MB dacs, especially for those who whose experiences of music have been mostly digital. For me, detail retrieval capabilities are more immediately apparent with most DS dacs than MB dacs, or NOS dacs for that matter. All (sorry) of that said, for me, Schiit's MB implementations have been the best of both worlds at their respective price points. But a new DS dac might come out tomorrow that sounds better than anything I have heard. All is in flux.

Out of curiosity, @RobS, why do you believe that the Gungnir is "harder to integrate into (a) system" ? And do you mean than he A1? Yggdrasil?

 

@Senorx12562 I haven't heard the Yggdrasil, or Bifrost 2, or Gungnir A2, so not sure if this is a Schiit MB thing, but for me the standout trait of the Gungnir A1 is the masterful subtlety. Perhaps this is why its not immediately apparent in a blind test like that (besides the shortcomings of the speakers, room, listening positions, etc.) because it reveals in a more delicate manner. It's like the experience I initially had with the HD650 because I was wondering what was so great about it. But the Sennheisers and Gungnir Multibit are slow burners. I wish I hadn't given up on the HD650 so early and detoured into planar land. The Bifrost Multibit had left a bad taste in my mouth (or ears) so I decided to go in a different path. But having a few different components together, I now understand why this headphone and Schiit multibit stuff are so beloved.

The system integration was something I've read purr1n and a few others saying about the cooler Gungnir A2 revision. It's why I sought after an A1 as it seemed to be a better fit, more forgiving, with folks saying it had a kind of slightly warmer/darker tonality and more euphonic but also working well with Valhalla 2/HD650.

 

I'm sure a lot of you guys are probably jaded and bored reading about another post on the HD650 and Schiit Multibit stuff. I hate to be the envy of fresh ears Lol. It's like how I get envious (and enthusiastic) of folks who see Blade Runner or Twin Peaks for the first time.

But seriously how do you guys get any sleep having Gungnir Multibits and Yggdrasils and vinyl in your systems? I've been up all night again just listening to one album after another. And then repeating those albums and songs. I don't want to stop. I'm tempted to put in my two weeks tomorrow, move in my parents basement and never unplug.

This little modest rig of HD650/Valhalla 2 that I've owned since February, now with this Gungnir smoked my former HE-6 rig. Scaling back? More like scaling up. I can't get over the resolution, it totally destroys the Convert-2 in detail. It's not even close. From Michael Jackson to Stones' Exile on Main St. to Al Green to Brian Eno to Public Enemy's Fear of a Black Planet to even f'ing Phil Collins. There is so much detail in even the dumbest pop albums recorded from maybe early 00s all the way back. Classical music, which I am no expert and not even a listener of, spooked the shit out of me with how music emanates from these headphones. I might have to start listening to classical and jazz to finally become a true audiophile!

And it's just so damn enchanting that I have no desire to pick anything apart or find flaws. I truly thought the Multibit stuff wasn't going to work for me after my bad experience with the Bifrost. But something kept nagging me to at least give the Gungnir a try. I'm glad I did cause it gives me that emotional connection I crave with music. I still did side by side comparisons between Gungnir and Convert-2. No ABX testing or anything like that. They actually do share quite a bit in common but detail, soundstage, imaging, and just sheer musicality, the Gungnir is the runaway winner here.

I was expecting the Gungnir to hit as soft as a pillow in comparison but it can hold its own. Doesn't hit like Mike Tyson but I feel it has just the right amount of impact and slam for me. Convert-2 is constantly pummeling you and that's the thing I don't like about the DAC compared to the Gungnir. Its always redlining, that's what I mean when it comes off as one note. To quote Neech - “The people told me, however, that the big ear was not only a man, but a great man, a genius. But I never believed in the people when they spake of great men - and I hold to my belief that it was a reversed cripple, who had too little of everything, and too much of one thing.” That's exactly how I would sum up the Convert-2. Definitely belongs in a studio as it was intended. Makes a lot more sense there especially with how weird that soundstage is. Sure as hell ain't worth the asking price of $2399. Maybe $1k. I dunno. But I'll take the money I sold from the Convert-2 and just get the Yggdrasil. See if its all that and a bag of chips. I'm super curious now since how much I enjoy the Gungnir. Maybe it won't be worth it. Waiting for the Unison to be added before I get it though.

Oh and the HD800 stock still sucks ballz for music, even with the Gungnir and Mjolnir 2 hooked up. WTF was Sennheiser thinking releasing that crap as their flagship? It does seem it has a little more resolution than the HD650 but it sucks the life out of music. Gross. Kill it with fire. For gaming it is wicked in how it can do this 3D effect and imaging is amazingly precise. But everything else no no no...

 

@RobS with speakers at least, Yggdrasil A2 ( never heard the A1) is even more resolving of low level detail and information than Gungnir Multibit. You get more atmosphere, more air, more plankton, more space, more natural timbre etc. Blackground compared to Gungnir Multibit A1 is significantly improved as well - the greyness is pretty much gone (although others have said there are “blacker” DACs out there, it’s not noticeable to my ears like with Gungnir Multibit). Soundstage is more expansive and open sounding, and is set back (less forward) compared to Gungnir Multibit, which I prefer. So technically, it’s a significant step up. There’s also more slam and dynamics, with Gungnir Multibit A1 sounding a bit softer (in direct comparison).

Tonally however, its different as well - whether it’s better or worse will depend on your preference and how it matches with the rest of your chain. Overall it’s brighter and more extended on the top end, leaner through the mids, and overall less warm with less midbass and body/density compared to the Gungnir Multibit A1 - but it doesn’t go too far the other way to truly cold/lean, it’s just more neutral I think. It does have more/stronger low bass however.

Initially I found it difficult to deal with the leaner mids that sounded less dense and full than the Gungnir Multibit’s, and the brighter overall signature, but I got over it. And I absolutely LOVE the crazy soundstage and sense of space and plankton it brings. If Schiit can improve on that in the next version it’s going to be a monster and an instant buy for me. If you think Gungnir Multibit is addictive to listen to, wait till Yggdrasil. I would wait until next year though to see what’s coming, unless you want to buy used in the meantime.

 

From Jason's post today:
2019, Chapter 19: Lucky 13
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...bable-start-up.701900/page-3673#post-15388698

This seems relevant:

"Unison USB for all. We’ll also be shipping Unison USB for all upgradable DACs in January. This means you’ll be able to get your Bifrost, Gungnir, or Yggdrasil upgraded to Unison USB. Bifrost and Yggdrasil do not require a trip back to the mothership or a service center. Gungnir needs to have its motherboard firmware changed, so it does have to come back to us, or to an authorized distributor. You’ll also see Unison USB on new production Gungnirs and Yggdrasils (probably with an option to go to Gen 5 for people using older versions of Windows.)
Both of these shouldn’t be too surprising; I’ve talked about these products before."

"However, those of you expecting a Gungnir 2 and Yggdrasil 2 in the mold of Bifrost 2 may be in for a shock. Linear extrapolation doesn’t always work."

 

So IOW Yggdrasil is God?

But thank you rlow for the comparisons here. I didn't realize how important the soundstage stuff was to me until I got the Gungnir in my speaker rig and compared to Convert-2. I just could not get over the "fun-house mirror" like effect from the Convert-2. And there's no sense of spatial depth or layering either. I realized I can't live without these two things. How resolving the Gungnir is of all these tiny bits of detail retrieved outta instruments and vocals, that give it more defined texture and adds a whole 'nother layer to recordings. It's the difference between music vs sounds. The Convert-2 is the latter. So even though the transients have this lifelike realism to them, you're not getting the finer inner texture of instruments and vocals, or the smallest of volume gradations. It's not resolving in that way. And thus it is harder to emotionally connect with music. If this is what is so called "plankton", then I get how important resolution is. The Gungnir you sort of get the suggestion if the guitar you are hearing is a Les Paul or a Strat or Flying V, etc. I'd laugh if one can point out the exact year the guitar was made using the Yggdrasil. Gungnir is hypnotic, the fact the Yggdrasil is even more resolving here blows my mind. If this is the logical step up from the Gungnir, I have a feeling this is the DAC I've been chasing all along. I'm going to get it directly from Schiit so I have a return period in the event I prefer the Gungnir more.

The concerns I have from reading your post are the slightly brighter sig and leaner mids, when it comes to having it hooked up to the Valhalla 2. Maybe you're splitting hairs here, but how folks described the tonality of the Gungnir Multibit A2 was the reason I avoided it (seems Yggdrasil A1 similar here) as it didn't seem to be a good combination with the Valhalla. However I did read the Yggdrasil A2 has more "wetness" in the mids that might offset the dryness of the Valhalla. I need a DAC that can do double duty for headphones and speakers. I'm doing the KISS mod this week soon to an old HD650 pair I have, and looking at the measurements it's still dark in the treble region so maybe the extra brightness might not matter. No idea until I get it in and have it fully warmed up.

Either way I'm super curious and waiting until Unison is added to the Yggdrasil before I buy. Thanks again rlow for your reply.

 

I’m getting ready to place an order for the Freya S, GUNGNIR Multibit,and two Vitar. Will the updated unit with Unison USB be available to ship within a week or two?

 

I don’t think anyone here can answer it . It’s better you reach out to schiit or drop an email to them
https://www.schiit.com/contact
they are responsive over email

 

The latest is that Unison will be available for Gungnir and Yiggy in "January."

 

You should read this...
2019, Chapter 19: Lucky 13

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/sch...bable-start-up.701900/page-3673#post-15388698
2019 Dec 30

(bold added)
...

"...Unison USB for all. We’ll also be shipping Unison USB for all upgradable DACs in January. This means you’ll be able to get your Bifrost, Gungnir, or Yggdrasil upgraded to Unison USB. Bifrost and Yggdrasil do not require a trip back to the mothership or a service center. Gungnir needs to have its motherboard firmware changed, so it does have to come back to us, or to an authorized distributor. You’ll also see Unison USB on new production Gungnirs and Yggdrasils (probably with an option to go to Gen 5 for people using older versions of Windows.)..."

So, if it was me, I'd wait until the Unison was ready to ship.

EDIT:
I realized I just posted this same thing somewhere, but didn't realize it was in the same thread above. My bad. But there it is again.

 

Felt compelled to reply to this, since I was shocked how similar of experience I had. I too had the RME ADI-2 DAC for about almost 6 months and was very pleased. Loved all the functionality and the remote since all of my listening is done out of reach of the dac with speakers.

Not content to leave well enough alone, I was intrigued to try out a multibit / r2r DAC and after lots and lots of reading, I thought the gungnir MB was my best bet, so I patiently waited for one to pop up used. Once found, I hooked it up to my preamp, carefully volume matched using the variable output of the RME, and was able to quickly A/B the two DAC's as they were being fed from a node 2i. At first I had coax going to the RME and Optical to the Gungnir Multibit, but then swapped to make sure I eliminated that. Couldnt tell much\any difference in the digital inputs, but the difference in DAC was pretty shocking to me. I wasn't expecting much change, but everything kray posted above is my exact experience.

I would go further to add that the RME presented perhaps a slightly deeper and more square stage. It was a little more difficult to pick out where instruments were in relation to one another. The Gungnir Multibit on the other hand felt like it brought the instruments and distributed them around me in more of a arc. It turned it into a much more immersive stage for my room and speaker placement. RME is slightly blacker but the Gungnir Multibit is more enjoyable. Also with a bit more slam and initiation.

While the RME has had zero use since then, I think I'll hang onto it for at least a little while to see if I want to use it in another room. It has such a great form factor with the bluesound node 2i (EXACT same footprint). Have since replaced the node for an pi2aes that brought me a bit more blackness and clarity.

 

I recently purchased a second hand gungnir mb which was originally purchased in 12/2018.
Let’s assume it worked perfectly before being sent to me. It will not turn on. No lights on or anything when plugged in. I used the same cable to my mjolnir, saga, and bifrost and it works on all of those so no cable or plug/outlet issue.

We are in contact with schiit support but any other ideas on what could be the issue? I do not want to take apart and void warranty.

 

It could be a damage from shipping. A transformer failure for example. Been there, done that. I don’t think you can do anything yourself, the device needs to be sent to Schiit for repair.

 

the dumb obvious things, do you have the switch in the back flipped up and did you check the fuse?

If it's the fuse, the question begs why was it blown? Probably worth a trip to the factory.

and just saw this
thanks. hindsight really is 20/20. At the time when I decided to buy it I was using it as a dac/pre straight to a power amp. Suppose I could have gone with a modi + cheapo jbl knob, but the remote, fewer boxes/connections, and a couple of the other features lured me in.

 

yes switch is flipped to on. No obvious issues with shipping box damage and packaged well. The other amp in the package survived no problem.
Well back to schiit once they reply.
Thanks everyone.