Streamers in 2023 - Discussion, Impressions, etc

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by rhythmdevils, Feb 9, 2023.

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  1. Biodegraded

    Biodegraded Friend

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    Thanks for the clarification. Not that it appeared to be doing it in my system anyway, but nonethless it makes me feel a little safer!
     
  2. m.i.c.k.e.y

    m.i.c.k.e.y Facebook Friend

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    < 200 - Any Android box + USB Audio Player Pro app (UPnP renderer on)
    Using this setup before my present streamer. Paired it w/ a DDC and an external hdd.

    [​IMG]

    >1500 Audiobyte Hydra.HUB
    A Streamer, DDC, Upsampler, Format Converter, Reclocker (name it, got it)

    Was itching for the Innuos Pulse series. But at the end settled for the HUB to complete the stack. 3 things it got that is not found on other streamers: reclocker, upsampler, format converter. So don't need anymore a PC + HQPlayer for upsampling/converting.

    Example, now am playing thru BubbleUPnP in my NAS, a DSD256 file. HUB converts/Upsamples to PCM705.6K and sends it to DAC (VOX) via I2S.

    [​IMG]
     
  3. rfernand

    rfernand Almost "Made"

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    CA CXNv2: Overkill, has never given me any problems. Competent DAC built-in if needed. SPDIF out into your favorite DAC, no problem.


    Pi2AES: Pretty happy with it, using it with the balanced out to Yggdrasil. After complaining about having to restart it at least once a day in @rhythmdevils ’ Discord, I was convinced to use Ropieee instead of volumio. Haven’t touched it since I deployed it. Life’s good.
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2023
  4. Woland

    Woland Friend

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    Any properly operating streamer outputs the data. Some streamers have better timed signals than others because of clocks, buffers, etc.

    Yggdrasil and Gungnir have Adapticlock analysis and reclocking. So the streamer clocking is discarded. There's no potential improvement from exploring streamer options if your DAC is one of these and your starting streamer is decent.

    Almost none of the above applies to USB though!
     
  5. zottel

    zottel Friend

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    Oh, wow! I just discovered the OpenHome project page, including http://openhome.org/pages/use/#

    Basically, this is a free implementation of an OpenHome renderer and controller. So, on a Pi, e.g. with Pi2AES, it should be as simple as downloading that software and one of the mobile controllers, and you’re ready to go. Didn’t try that myself, but I’ll have a look if it possible to use that on my new Zen Streamer. If yes, that might be the end of my Roon subscription.
     
  6. HotRatSalad

    HotRatSalad Friend

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    I've managed to scrounge two pi2aes from friends and you'll have to bury them with me. I love that mercury has m2 slot .pretty damn sexy from a storage point of view for those of us that will never stream or use roon.
     
  7. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

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    One more comment I should have made earlier: I owned a Yggdrasil, originally A1 and upgraded to A2+Unison in 2018, for 6 years (10/2016-10/2022). There were bigger differences between sources and streamers before Unison, but after Unison, the differences have been really small, the kind that only my wife with her superb hearing can reliably discern. Until I sold it, I had it on S/PDIF from Pi2AES with a linear power supply, but the difference from USB was minor. I can't imagine that anything with WiFi beyond a Zen Stream or similar would make a noticeable difference to deserve the hassle and cost of audition.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2023
  8. iFi audio

    iFi audio MOT iFi Audio

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    That's affirmative, thanks!
     
  9. Herbert

    Herbert New

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    Short:

    I never got a RasPi 3/4 based streamer to RELIABLE stream DSD direct or DoP over I2s .
    It took me 5 minutes with Ifi Neo stream :
    And Bingo - DSD native x512 (I2S) ,..one hour loop from Synology NAS without any problem
    Qobuz 24/192 (BubbleUPnP) one hour playlist loop without any hiccup or problem.
    SQ : excellent

    My search has come to an end. Thanx Ifi.
     
  10. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I also found this Cayin iDAP-6. Annoying name because of the "I" and it's well, not a DAP. But it looks to be well made. Cayin seems to be upping their game recently, they've got a few new tube amps that seem very well designed and thought out. I don't know how they sound, but they see to at least have attempted to make them well with good parts.

    The iDAP-6 has wifi and all digital outputs. it would be interesting to test it out, but the Holo RED plus a wifi adapter is more tempting to me.
     
  11. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    Hmmmm if this is true, then why did I hear a clear improvement when I added a noise nuke to my Pi2AES feeding a Yggdrasil? And another clear improvement when I had the 5v mod done and a Sigma 11 LPS made for it? I don't tend to hear things based on placebo, I have no history of it. I have more history of hearing things that go against my preconceptions if anything, But who knows...
     
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  12. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Hmmm... With all due respect (genuine!) to you and your enromous audio equipment, everybody has a history of it. It's part of being a human.
     
  13. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I understand why you feel this way. It's just not my experience, honestly. But it would take too much history and examples all through my life to explain why. Not worth it, it's ok. :)
     
  14. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    I absolutely trust that you have a good ear, and that what you think you hear is, almost certainly, for real.

    Just, generally, I don't think there is a person, whether it is plain pills, audio, whatever, for who the placebo effect is not a thing. And it is not just a case of confirming preconceptions.

    I think that, where possible, testing against a placebo is a part of pharma research and testing. For a good reason.

    I'm not a blind test maniac: I'm not asking you, personally, to prove anything. Especially not to me personally.

    Escaping the personal... I do think that, in the general market at least, placebo has a place in the sale of these hifi-branded customised computers called "streamers." Just my theory.

    I'll be offline for a week. So absence of reply to anybody who wants to take me up on that won't be rudeness, it will be... absence. And by the time I get back, the world will have moved on. :)
     
  15. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    I just need to clarify that this isn't what I was saying, I would not say something so arrogant.

    My point was just that in my life, in audio and even in medicine, I find no pattern between my expectations and my experiences. But you would not be the first person to say "blah!" at that, and I understand why, so no need to explain. It wasn't meant to be a big topic, and I probably shouldn't have mentioned it, my post would have been the same without it. We can move on... :)
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2023
  16. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

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    Given your multiple reports of noise issues with different gear, I'd suggest that you are hearing the effects of different power supplies polluting your AC power in different ways.
     
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  17. Pancakes

    Pancakes Friend

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    This is correct. He put all his computers and phone chargers on an isolation transformer and a large chunk of noise issues went away. But not all.
     
  18. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    There's a surprising amount of anger in this thread - they're just components. Like anything else...
     
  19. George Hincapie

    George Hincapie New

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    And how is the SQ?
     
  20. gaspasser

    gaspasser Flatulence Maestro

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    This anger is sad. The objectivism/dogma/engineering in this thread is so weird for SBAF. I’m interested in finding more about why Pi2AES sounds different than Zen Stream. Why is there not robust discussion or impressions at SBAF about different streamers? I have to go elsewhere just to read non-professional reviews and I don’t know who anybody is. I ordered a Holo Red and bought an EtherRegen to play around and see if there are differences and maybe improvements. I plan on writing a few things up just to provide some content here. I know there are Friends here with experience with multiple brands of streamers that utilize ethernet and optical ethernet, however there seems to be a (reasonable) fear of talking about it in the open.
    Thanks for creating this thread @rhythmdevils

    I can empathize with your comments about expectations & experiences especially related to healthcare. As a practitioner I know the science but also experience has taught me that there is much more to it. Complex systems sometimes behave in ways that science can’t fully explain yet. This is why I laugh at the people who want to tout science/measurements/objectivism as their religion. There is more to this hobby and we should be open to the possibility that we don’t know everything. Bits are not just bits.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 19, 2023

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