Focal Clear

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by The Alchemist, Nov 15, 2017.

  1. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    Huh? What's up with the Utopia and Elear having the same amount of bass? And very similar FR up to 2.5kHz? That must be a weird coupler.
    And then the Clear either has 5db or even 10db more 2kHz going by either the non-defective or defective channels?

    Also as I see it these measurements have 4db less bass than is realistic? It's all a bit odd: https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/
     
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Solderdude might be using a more absorbative foam or felt lined coupler or something that has a more lossy seal. Maybe this "collapses" the bass response measurements that would otherwise be less similar on other couplers.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
  3. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Anyway...

    Anyone (Friend or Contributor, or rando wanting higher status) want to take the initiative to talk to Jason Lord at SourceAV so I can get a one week loaner? The Force tells me I might actually like this.

    Solderdude's measurements are a nice starting point; but I'd like us to have our own.
     
  4. drgumbybrain

    drgumbybrain Science Nut

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    I think its a valuable thing to like your own penis. Makes life a lot easier. Freud was indeed right. Now back to Focal Clear...
     
  5. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

    Pyrate BWC MZR
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    I think it's the other way around. There's a pic and a description of his measurement setup down the page on the site that I linked. Thick wood and closed cell foam. I think it's more likely he's getting too good a seal with the Utopia, so that the Elear and Utopia pads pretty much have the same amount of bass on his coupler.

    The Utopia and Elear FR looked quite a bit more different on his Elear or Utopia measurement page. It just seems he picked the two channels that matched the best here.
    For now looks like Elear with a bit more upper midrange. I hope there isn't more energy at 2kHz, but in that regard I trust Jude's graphs more, which actually had less 2-3kHz than the Elear relative to 1kHz. Lower treble closer to Elear than Utopia? Meh...

    measurements at 12:12

    All of these measurements are weird to me in that they look closer than they actually sound. I wonder why that would be the case with the dummy heads. Maybe the dummy head isn't as close to the real thing as we think?
     
  6. Aeron

    Aeron Facebook Friend

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    @Marvey, I completely understand where you are coming from, my Post was indeed as diffuse as a mouse fart, and as useful. However, Oh Great Sarnac, would you not say that spewing about something which you’ve never heard is almost as useless as my nebulous subjectivity?

    Yes I’m a complete, and quite ignorant rookie in these parts, so I do appreciate the edification on appropriate, or immensely inane posting. My limited time with the Utopia and Elear made me hesitant to point out the errors in the assumptions I was reading. I hear you loud and clear Sir, pontification by Noobs is frowned upon, but friends of the Crown may fire away at will, even when they have similar gravity as aforementioned mouse fart.
     
  7. chakku

    chakku Friend

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    I think the 'you need to listen/own these to judge them' mentality needs to stay on head-fi. It's just a convenient copout to dismiss any opinions that don't fall in line with your own because it's not that easy for some to simply drive over to the big wonderstore that conveniently has all the headphone models ever on display for listening in quiet, isolated rooms.

    I firmly believe most people here are capable of looking at a frequency response measurement/CSD of the K812 and knowing they're going to be a bad time. Measurements may not tell the whole story but they can certainly tell a good one.
     
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    "Friends of the Crown" have experience with measurements and may see patterns that may have correlated to specific sound phenomena with other headphones. I am not too familiar with Solderdude's measurements. I actually think he is slightly deaf, or at least we don't hear the same way. (I mostly said this to piss off Ian Craig - I actually think Solderdude is a pretty cool - but the sadistic side of me loves it when I see Ian Craig go apeshit hyprocrite).

    Now just because you find measurements of limited use doesn't mean that Friends of the Crown don't. In any event, with me personally knowing Luckbad and others (who commented on measurements), I understand the context of their statements to be not fully authoritative, but rather speculative. We are not measurement extremists here. Sometimes its fun to speculate first based on measurements, and then listen later. It's a good way to determine how measurements correlate to aspects of sound. Personally I have said nothing about the Clear other than I think I might like it, and this based on @%20 Oddity's subjective impressions.

    If you find transducer measurements of limited use, then you should not be here. There is this place called Head-Fi.org

    Finally, it is not Crown. I am not King. I am Dictator.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
  9. Aeron

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    That’s a lovely opinion, but it is just that an opinion. Frequency charts are quite useful, especially when their are multiple sources that can be compaired and corroborated. Subjective experience is the other half of the equation though, personally, no matter the product in question relying on a single source (that would include my nebulous post) in judging the merits of that product is, well, wrong.

    Oh, the reason I took a long hiatus from Head Fi, was the petty bull shit fan boy garbage. I’ve enjoyed what I’ve read so far on SABF, but I’m hoping it isn’t the dark side to HF’s exuberance, the same cliquishness but the yin to HF’s yang.
     
  10. Aeron

    Aeron Facebook Friend

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    You are misunderstanding my intentions, I’m not completely dismissing objective measurements, what I am “dissing” is forming a “hard” opinion based on a single set of measurements. Additionally, I wasn’t attempting to insult @Luckbad, if I did so I apologize. I’ve read many of his posts wading through the threads, and he obviously is quite experienced and knowledgeable.

    Your position as the Captain of this Ship is noted, aye aye Sir and I’ll accept my flogging like a man and shut the hell up until I learn a t more about the site and earn my stripes.
     
  11. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    @Aeron I actually do want to hear the Clears. I like hearing any headphones I'm able to get on my ears, I just start with low volume to avoid razorblades.
     
  12. The Alchemist

    The Alchemist MOT: Schiit - Here to help!

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    I am receiving a pair of Focal Clears and can post my impressions. As Marv pointed out brilliantly, my opinions are only subjective as I do not have measuring equipment. I can only offer my personal opinion on them. What I like or don't like may differ from one person to the next. I am supposed to receive them tomorrow so I will post after getting some hours in with them. I am a little concerned about the earlier post about channel imbalance. Was the channel imbalance measured on both SE and Balanced equipment and/or headphone cables?
     
  13. Aeron

    Aeron Facebook Friend

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    I noticed that we are R2R aficionados, I’d love to hear your EC7!
     
  14. drgumbybrain

    drgumbybrain Science Nut

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    Have sent him a polite email about this subject. Hope to have a response. Peace
     
  15. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    The Clears essentially don't do enough to entirely fix the weird and/or bad aspects of the Elear and Utopia and yet seem to sit well enough in the middle to likely satisfy plenty of folks that don't worship at the altar of either of those or the HD650 already.

    In other words, worth checking out, hope we can get a loaner, but don't get your hopes up unless you were looking to slightly dial up from the Elear or slightly down from the Utopia. Then again, one could make the same argument about the HD600 and 650, and one of those was long-term listenable to me while the other was not. The world often operates in shades of grey mixed with LSD and poop.

    (I found Clears closer to a brighter and more coherent sounding Elear at some random RMAF setup, whereas Utopia was still its own bundle of specific oddity to me. I did A/B/C tests with all of them there.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2017
  16. VincentS

    VincentS New

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    Hands Hi - when you have heard these are they always with the stock cable or with upgraded cables?

    Thanks
     
  17. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Uhhh...don't think cables are going to be a big enough factor here to warrant mentioning when discussing relatively large differences between headphones, but if you must know, they were all stock.
     
  18. TonyNewman

    TonyNewman Validated by Tyll removing Utopia from WOF

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    That is not unique to HF, but alive and well at SBAF also. Less so, for sure, as SBAF is much more tolerant of divergent views than HF (i.e. not whored out to the sponsors / advertisers like HF).
     
  19. PacoTaco

    PacoTaco Friend

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    That's the strength of being a community as opposed to an advertisement platform.
     
  20. I_want_all_the_tacos

    I_want_all_the_tacos Friend

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    I spent some time at The Source AV earlier this week and listened to the Elear, Clear, and Utopia fairly extensively to compare. I think the Clear very much does have the same Focal house sound and falls pretty much between Elear and Utopia in terms of performance, but much closer to Elear. It isn't nearly as resolving as Utopia. If you don't like the other Focals you will probably not like the Clear as well.

    Compared to Elear, I found the Clear to have a tad less bass (but more than Utopia), and is much more even in the upper mids/treble. That mid suckout in Elear makes Elear feel more V-shaped, so by addressing that Clear basically becomes more tonally correct as solderdude talks about in his review. I think that refinement up top is also why some people have noted that Clear might be more laid back compared to Elear and even Utopia, but it is still more punchy and aggressive compared to something like HD650. But it isn't nearly as warm, smooth, and lush like HD650. And I still feel it stays in that really dynamic and visceral vibe that Elear and Utopia have. I personally really liked Utopia a lot but can't justify the price. I think the Clear is priced appropriately with regards to its siblings, especially given the nice case and extra cables. I wouldn't mind owning one in the future as a complement to my other headphones (mostly HD800, HD6XX, Auteur, and Atticus).
     

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