General Auto Chat

Discussion in 'Cars, Motorcycles, Boats, Airplanes Talk' started by Maxvla, Sep 26, 2015.

  1. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Likes Received:
    993
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Rubber lines in good condition provide just as firm a brake pedal as SS lines. And rubber brake lines are basically 100% reliable. You should probably change them every 10 years or so, but if you let them go for 20 years they'll almost certainly still be fine. And if they're not, the typical indication of trouble is pretty benign: a pad starts to drag because the rubber hose has swelled enough to restrict fluid from being pulled back away from the caliper, or the pedal gets soft (and flushing the fluid doesn't fix it) because the hose has started to weaken and balloon.

    In the USA alone, people drive 3 trillion miles per year with rubber lines. Most drivers have never ever replaced a brake line, and yet you never hear about catastrophic failures due to manufacturing or design defects.

    Stainless steel lines, on the other hand, are only installed on an infinitesimally small fraction of cars, but if you read any auto forum you'll see that they fail all the goddamn time.

    And they fail with no warning, because the Teflon hose inside the steel braid doesn't gradually swell, it just suddenly cracks. Or the crimped-on fitting -- the only type allowed by the US Department of Transportation -- just blows off the end of the hose. Or the hose is the type with an external support to prevent it from flexing right at the fitting, but the support isn't installed correctly so the braid flexes at the fitting and frays, then cuts through the Teflon. Or the hose twists or kinks as the wheel moves, in a way that wouldn't be a problem for rubber hose but which fatigues the SS hose until it fails. Etc.

    For a racecar that's never driven on the street, DOT-approved lines aren't necessary, so you can use real aerospace-style SS lines with two-piece Aeroquip-style fittings. And if you inspect them and/or replace them every season, those fancy lines will work fine. But if you drive on the street, it's my opinion that you should use the OEM rubber lines because:
    1. They almost never fail.
    2. They usually give plenty of warning if they ever are going to fail.
    3. They won't disqualify your insurance claim in the very unlikely event that they do fail.
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agreed, ditto, +1 Agreed, ditto, +1 x 1
    • List
  2. penguins

    penguins Friend, formerly known as fp627

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2018
    Likes Received:
    3,451
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    SouthernCA
    Are you saying that once again the gubamins managed to mess things up with poorly thought out and implemented regulations??? What a surprise.

    In all seriousness now, the answers makes sense. Great risk > small reward for daily driving.
     
  3. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Likes Received:
    993
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Yeah but no.

    Even though a properly assembled and maintained Teflon brake line made with Aeroquip's reusable fittings is "better", a Teflon line made with crimped fittings is safer from user error -- e.g., dumb humans can't accidentally loosen it. There are a lot of dumb humans, so the government's decision here is overall probably the right one.
     
  4. Tchoupitoulas

    Tchoupitoulas Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2019
    Likes Received:
    3,711
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    PA
    Time to ditch the Hummer and upgrade to the Rezvani Vengeance:

    [​IMG]

    "Military Package" for the win:

    Bullet proof glass and body armor
    Underside explosive protection
    Smoke Screen
    Military Runflat Tires
    Thermal Night Vision System
    Reinforced suspension
    Electromagnetic Pulse Protection
    Ram Bumpers
    Optional explosive device detection
    Bullet proof vests and helmets


    Electrified Door Handles
    Siren and Horn Options
    Strobe Lights
    Blinding Lights
    Intercom System
    Magnetic Dead Bolts
    Gas masks
    First Aid kit
    Hypothermia kit
    Pepper Spray Dispenser


    [​IMG]

    It includes body armor!

    [​IMG]
     
  5. netforce

    netforce MOT: Headphones.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,111
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Perfect for taking your kids to school or the impeding zombie invasion.
     
  6. Kernel Kurtz

    Kernel Kurtz Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    May 19, 2018
    Likes Received:
    1,680
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Winnipeg, Canada
    Seems like it might fill a niche in toys for the uber rich. I'd rather have a McLaren but in reality, I won't ever have either.
     
  7. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Likes Received:
    993
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Almost anything is affordable if your priorities are screwed up enough.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agreed, ditto, +1 Agreed, ditto, +1 x 1
    • List
  8. caute

    caute Lana Del Gayer than you

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2022
    Likes Received:
    1,990
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    The Deep South
    While the überrich class has been chiefly responsible for the looming climate crisis—and while the some of the media still deny it or if not outright ignore it, try to soften the most sober of prediction models—the elite members of that class are snatching up bunkers in NZ, buying up tons of generators, solar panels & ammo, building superyacht "arks", or more quixotically, trying to make space a thing in order to try and escape the worst of it, meanwhile boutique car manufacturers looking to cash in on the lucrative doomer frenzy be like:
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023
  9. netforce

    netforce MOT: Headphones.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,111
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I am dumb, bought new brake pads and just arrived yesterday, brought it to local shop for them to install and found out I ordered the wrong size rear pads. Went back to the website and realized I didn't click the drop down menu for right size. Derp.

    Least I was able to replace the front pads and the rears still got good life on them.
     
  10. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Likes Received:
    993
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Ugh, that sucks. One of the (many) reasons to let your mechanic buy parts instead of trying to save a few pennies by buying them yourself.
     
  11. netforce

    netforce MOT: Headphones.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,111
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Yeah was a bit of a learning experiencing for me. Me and him chatted for a little bit after and I think after I burn through these pads will just talk to him about what he has that will be good for me.

    Lesson learned, also on my end, double triple check my orders haha
     
  12. mediumroast

    mediumroast Facebook Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2021
    Likes Received:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    EST
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2023
  13. Kernel Kurtz

    Kernel Kurtz Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    May 19, 2018
    Likes Received:
    1,680
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Winnipeg, Canada
    Yes, many if not most of today's supercars are built of carbon fiber. I though eventually that would trickle down to cars that most people can afford, but it looks like that is not going to happen very fast, if at all. It just does not lend itself to production line assembly as well as steel or aluminum. BMW has put the idea aside for now.

    https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a22170531/say-goodbye-to-carbon-fiber-bmws/
     
  14. mediumroast

    mediumroast Facebook Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2021
    Likes Received:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    EST
    Yeah.. The Car market is one big competition for the common denominator. Thats why you do not have the manuals anymore. I imagine that the "creature comforts" and new tech bling bling is going to buy over potential clients instead of putting some more sporty but "harsh" equipment in. I guess, the sports stuff is actually quite expensive too. The regular mid-class car is quite cheap mass produced stuff. Well the chassis and platforms Do advance so now the common denominator is slighly higher than before. Well I do think that the BMW sporty sedans are better than the common go from A to B carts, in terms of drivabilty etc. Well.. Another example. Lexus CT scanned their LS's and GS's chassis for weld defects.That's why these cars have a price tag. There is something to it.
     
  15. mediumroast

    mediumroast Facebook Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2021
    Likes Received:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    EST
    Sweet sounds

     
  16. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Likes Received:
    993
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Carbon also doesn't really help meet mainstream car requirements. That old article about the 12C accurately describes some of the benefits of a carbon monocoque, but it doesn't say anything about the disadvantages: the noise (it's as boomy over normal/rough roads as you'd expect a super-rigid giant bowl shape to be), the fact that it's basically impossible to repair, the extra burden it places on the rest of the car to absorb energy in a crash, etc. Not to mention carbon fiber's high cost / low availability, its limited ability to be formed into complex shapes, the awkwardness of grounding electrical components to it, etc.

    Steel and aluminum are better, and likely to stay better, for mainstream cars.
     
  17. mediumroast

    mediumroast Facebook Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2021
    Likes Received:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    EST
    Patrol 4x4 with M57 (ST3) engines. There is something satysfing seeing these things go.

     
  18. mediumroast

    mediumroast Facebook Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2021
    Likes Received:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    EST
    Yep thats the thing.. Even for race and kit cars.. You get some tubes bent.. they can be bent back or replaced easily.

    I was actually wondering.. How do they get some chassisy nice and stiff and others are soft and mushy. I guess its the geometry and forming proper support structures.. I thought some chassies use aluminium alloys for extra rigidity but this seems to be not the case. The F10 BMW seem to have very nice rigid body . I asked a friend he said the E60 is similar so the have done something right there. These "common" Japanese sedans tend to have mushy chassies.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2023
  19. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2019
    Likes Received:
    993
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    You're feeling compliance elsewhere, not torsional rigidity of the chassis.
     
  20. mediumroast

    mediumroast Facebook Friend

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2021
    Likes Received:
    104
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    EST
    Well.. there is something fishy with some cars. I think the mushiness comes from the rigidty of the chassies.. Well the reviewers talk about rigidty.. What am I feeling then? It cant all be the suspension.
     

Share This Page