General Speaker Advice and Recommendations

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by shotgunshane, Mar 7, 2017.

  1. zottel

    zottel Friend

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    Not sure if that would be worth its own thread, but I thought I'd try here first:

    Background: I recently stumbled over the Cabasse Pearl speakers and saw that they are able to play test tones and configure their internal DSP accordingly, in order to get rid of room modes. And I heard that this worked remarkably well in their room at the Axpona.

    My own Dynaudio Music 5 does something similar (though on the fly while playing music, no test tones here), which ... makes the situation better than without, but is far away from complete room correction. I also once had a B&O Level here which I sent back because it's much too expensive for what it does, but as far as I remember (I was an absolute audiophile beginner then), it did at least do a better job at room correction than the Dynaudio does.

    Also, I read then that even more expensive B&O systems do lots of sophisticated DSP stuff that even makes it possible to define several listening spots in a room and switch between them and get a good stereo image at each of the spots with a simple click on the remote.

    Now, my questions:

    What do you think about such DSP solutions? I know there are very different opinions in the audiophile community, but what are the opinions here? (Search for "DSP" doesn't work, and with some browsing I couldn't find a thread.)

    Do you know of any Active Streaming speakers besides the Cabasse Pearl that do such DSP stuff? Do you think they are any good?
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2022
  2. AdvanTech

    AdvanTech Friend

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    DSP can help, but you can’t overcome physics. Your speakers are designed to work within certain parameters. If your DSP adjustment is strong enough to push your speakers way too hard in certain frequencies to make up for nulls in your room you’re going to significantly increase distortion levels or, even worse, damage them.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2022
  3. zonto

    zonto Friend

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    My thought is that DSP is like the icing on the cake, but one should really address as much of the room mode/null issues as possible with placement (of both speakers and listening position) and acoustic treatment first.
     
  4. yotacowboy

    yotacowboy McRibs Kind of Guy

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    I think DSP is certainly useful once you know what the problem is that you're trying to fix. You oughta start with a good measurement of the system in situ, then start with affordable room treatments/room setup/placement. You shouldn't be asking DSP to fix that 20db null followed by a 13db boost 80Hz later up the frequency response. Your amp and speaker will turn into 20% distortion monsters trying to do what your DSP convolution is asking them to do.
     
  5. dmckean44

    dmckean44 In a Sherwood S6040CP relationship

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    It's marketing. Almost no one is going to have a room where that feature actually works well.
     
  6. Lingering Sentiment

    Lingering Sentiment Acquaintance

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    Thank you everyone for the insight. After mulling over everyone's advice and taking more time to look at the setups posted around here, it's clear that I'm going to need to be creative in putting together a system at my price point. I looked at the Stockholm but I think I'm bored of the idea of a soundbar at this point, it will be more fun to "experiment" anyway. I'll just be patient and see what I can find on the local used market for speakers. Mostly likely I'll end up with a Vidar/Aegir for ease of resell if necessary, and skip the Saga for now and use some Schiit I have laying around (or just get a Sys) for volume control. Hopefully I'll come up with something that I feel is worth the money.
     
  7. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    I recall reading somewhere that one can compensate for unwanted peaks, but to compensate for a real null, infinite amplification would be needed, and something is going to blow.

    There's a great idea for a cartoon there, featuring an audiophile and a demolished house. Pity I can't draw!
     
  8. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

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    Does anyone have experience with Klipsch Heresy 2 vs Forte 2 vs Forte 1?
     
  9. bixby

    bixby Friend

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    I had the forte 1s for a few weeks, but never had the Heresy in my home. I have not taken to the Klipsch sound even with the upgraded units like I had with Crites horn driver and xover upgrades.
     
  10. bixby

    bixby Friend

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    re: DSP. I used to be in the never EQ camp. Now, I would not live without DSP for EQ......... AFTER you get the room basics sorted.

    Some room problems DSP cannot correct as they can create new problems. Bass nulls is an example. You may fill one in with EQ and another peak or null at another frequency usually is the result. But once you get a room and speaker placement fairly well sorted, DSP EQ can be helpful to get the response closer to the ideal or your ideal curve. It is not a magic cure all.
     
  11. Poleepkwa

    Poleepkwa Friend

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    DSP works well for " tilting" a frequency response to better suit the room. However it is no quick fix. Speaker placement and room acoustics plays the dominant role. Floorbounce can be a real issue.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2022
  12. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    All ears are not equal. And less so as we age. EQ has a place there too.
     
  13. crazychile

    crazychile Eastern Iowa's Spiciest Pepper

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    Yes. F1 vs F2, the F2 had a little smoother midrange and I think it played deeper. I want to say that the F2 may have used a bigger woofer or passive radiator. Some people thought H2 had better midrange over F2, but I never noticed much of a difference. H2 is pretty limited in bass. It starts to roll off pretty quickly below 60Hz or thereabout.

    The original tweeters on all of these are noticeably rough with most SS Class A/B amps. Crites titanium tweeter replacement diaphragms are mandatory as well as a crossover rebuild. You dont have to use Crites crossovers, you can do a rebuild yourself for about 1/3 the price.

    Edit: The F1s I rebuilt last year sounded REALLY good with Freya S and Aegir.
     
  14. iFi audio

    iFi audio MOT iFi Audio

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    Yes, that is quite essential. A rug in front of speakers and some rangom objects on the front wall can make a staggering difference.
     
  15. bixby

    bixby Friend

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    And do not forget the ceiling. Took me 40 years to at least try some damping on it, aside from some echo tunes or simple corner type trap pillows.

    Just a quilt from wall intersection to ceiling and out about 4+ feet into the room and 6+ft wide. Does a really nice job, although the current speakers are quite a bit more directional than the last.


    20220702_202738.jpg
     
  16. iFi audio

    iFi audio MOT iFi Audio

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    I have to say that it makes your room a bit more comfy :)
     
  17. Vansen

    Vansen Gear Master (retiring)

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  18. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    I think it's something spammy :)... But all ideas should be considered.

    Drywall is probably out for physical reasons. it wouldn't have the resistance against knocks and bumps. But what are its acoustic properties?

    I think it would be just wonderful.
    ...ThadInteriorConstructionCo.


    Come to think of it, it isn't up to much at stopping noise between rooms.
     
  19. JayC

    JayC Resident Crash Test Dummy

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    Couldn't you put some Rockwool behind the drywall? That would work i assume
     
  20. zonto

    zonto Friend

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    You missed the plug for Jessica Clark's Therapy Services below. Perfect speakers for that, apparently...
     

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