Massdrop RDAC Airist Audio R2-R DAC

Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by purr1n, Jun 4, 2018.

  1. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

    Staff Member Pyrate BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    89,771
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
  2. dmckean44

    dmckean44 In a Sherwood S6040CP relationship

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2016
    Likes Received:
    1,425
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Peoria, IL
    I'm curious about this too.
     
  3. ButtUglyJeff

    ButtUglyJeff Stunningly beautiful IRL

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    I'm also curious if any three of our "DAC Triumvirate" tried to run this DAC with any mobile devices (iDevice with CCK or Android phone's digital out)
     
  4. Torq

    Torq MOT: Headphone.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2016
    Likes Received:
    8,193
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    I haven't, but I can this evening.

    I'm inclined to doubt it'll work with the CCK, however, as the USB input is galvanically isolated - and that means the side that talks to the source is (necessarily) powered BY the source - which usually means it won't work. The unit shows up in your USB devices list before you power it on (which is another dead giveaway).
     
  5. Clemmaster

    Clemmaster Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,268
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You got this wrong: @brencho is Archer, not James Bond.
     
  6. brencho

    brencho Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2015
    Likes Received:
    7,978
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    LA
  7. ButtUglyJeff

    ButtUglyJeff Stunningly beautiful IRL

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,637
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    Thank you as always. I appreciate your efforts and expounding.

    If you have any powered USB hub (like a Wyrd), may I request that you include that in your test? It's sometimes enough to fool your iWhatever in to accepting your digital destination.
     
  8. Bill-P

    Bill-P Level 42 Mad Wizard

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2015
    Likes Received:
    4,801
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    All I've ever seen at @brencho is coffee. If he has booze, he sure hid 'em well!

    Anyway, this DAC gets my seal of approval as well. I've actually been waiting a while for it, but now the lid is up and it's finally out!

    Yesh. This > Modi Multibit for me, easily. It has the same-ish tonality as Modi Multibit that I can remember but if memory serves, it doesn't have the slight shout / harshness in the upper mid, and it sounds cleaner in the bass. I don't like Bifrost Multibit at all so... that's that.

    |\/|
     
  9. Torq

    Torq MOT: Headphone.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2016
    Likes Received:
    8,193
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Results from testing this:
    • With the standard CCK cable you simply get the "attached accessory uses too much power" message.
    • With the Lighting to USB 3 adapter you do not get the power message, but the RDAC is not recognized at all. This is true with, or without, power applied to the adapter.
    • With a powered hub, known to work with some other DACs in this configuration, the RDAC is not recognized at all.
    In this case "is not recognized" means it does not show up, at all, as a selectable sound output device.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2018
  10. Clemmaster

    Clemmaster Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,268
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Can you measure the current draw with your lab PSU?
     
  11. Torq

    Torq MOT: Headphone.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2016
    Likes Received:
    8,193
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Can do - might be a day or so before I get to that, though.

    Annoyingly, this is something I actually already did, and thought I'd logged it, as I did it before trying the iFi iPower 5v (where it's rated at half an amp less than the stock PSU).
     
  12. Torq

    Torq MOT: Headphone.com

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2016
    Likes Received:
    8,193
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Seattle, WA
    Amp Pairing - Complements & Synergies

    One of the things that I’ve seen mentioned quite a bit in various write-ups of some of the existing “Massdrop x” series products, is the desire for a form-factor matching source to stack with them. Given how impressed I was with the Airist Audio R-2R DAC, I decided to buy a couple of these units and see how they performed when paired with the RDAC.

    RDAC-and-CTH-and-LCX.jpg

    In this case, I purchased the Massdrop x Cavalli Tube Hybrid directly via the “Massdrop Made” ships-from-stock program. The Cavalli Liquid Carbon X is not currently available via this program, so I wound up buying one used from an existing owner.

    Massdrop x Cavalli Tube Hybrid (MCTH)

    It’s fair to say that this little amp quickly endeared itself to me. I’m definitely a tube-guy when it comes to headphone listening. I tried the MCTH with a variety of sources and headphones to get an idea of its overall performance. But, since this isn’t an amp-review, I’ll limit my comments to how it pairs with the Massdrop x Airist Audio R-2R DAC.

    RDAC-and-CTH.jpg

    In short, this was the most enjoyable pairing* I found with the RDAC absent moving up to something like the iFi Pro iCAN. The slight warmth and bottom-end weight that I got from the MCTH (using the stock tube) complements the super-pristine signature of the RDAC almost perfectly, and the end result is a very balanced and enjoyable listen.

    The deftness of the RDAC’s bass delivery isn’t lost here, yet the weight and mass of a performance definitely benefits. I do not consider the RDAC to be light in the bass; it’s pretty neutral, but perhaps some attention/focus is drawn elsewhere by the sweet mid-range and treble. Pairing with the MCTH adds just enough low-end emphasis to balance that out, without robbing the overall sound of that sweetness.

    The sense of air and space I got from the RDAC is further enhanced when paired with the MCTH. Ambient cues in live venues/recordings seem more apparent, string pluck and tone becomes even more addictive, and the end result is extremely compelling.

    With some tubes, it’s possible that the innate sweetness of the RDAC might prove to be a bit on the “sugary” side of things. That’s obviously down to personal preference. I found that, at least with the stock tube, that this particular pairing was greater than the sum of its parts.

    Perhaps it’s a “natural synergy” (I find similar kinds of symbiotic effects pairing Yggdrasil with Ragnarok, for example), or maybe it’s the tube-effect, but either way I’m hard pressed to come up with a better, more enjoyable, source/amp combination for the price.

    Well worth listening to as far as I’m concerned – and this particular combination will find a place by my big picture window for when I want to listen and still enjoy a pretty view.

    Massdrop Cavalli Liquid Carbon X (LCX)

    This was my first exposure to any version of the “Liquid Carbon” amp. It was quickly apparent that, unlike with the MCTH, this unit is best listened to via its balanced output. This applied regardless of whether the input was single-ended (as with an RDAC pairing) or balanced. So that’s how I used it.

    RDAC-and-LCX.jpg

    There’s a small, but immediately discernible, increase in apparent tonal weight when listening through the LCX, coupled with a more notable elevation of bass-weight. Bass-speed came across as being “quicker” than with the MCTH, but perhaps with a slight shift in textural conveyance. This resulted in the open, super-clear, rendering I got natively from the RDAC coming across as being somewhat thicker overall.

    As with the MCTH … this resulted in the slight focus I was putting on the RDACs mid-range and treble producing a more balanced and cohesive end-result.

    Raw resolution didn’t suffer (actual resolution might actually be higher), but I felt with music that contained a lot of light, rapid, deft treble content lost a little of its sense of space and sparkle. Similarly, the scale and space of a venue, in live recordings, came across as being smaller … as if the walls have gotten a bit closer.

    Beyond those changes, the LCX clearly lets the mid-range/treble “sweetness” of the RDAC play through and still has a distinctly pristine sound vs. other similar DACs, just with a different spin on the weight of what’s being presented. Not better, not worse … just different.

    Which of these two would I choose?

    That's a question which, for me, actually had a very easy answer ... until this showed up (on loan for a few days) yesterday:

    RDAC-and-ZDT.jpg

    Beyond saying I find that the RDAC/EC ZDT Jr. is a lot of fun to listen to, details (and a comparison between the three amps) will have to wait until I get to do a bit more listening with it (and try some other tubes in the EC ZDT Jr), so for now I'll answer the question in the context of just the MCTH and LCX:

    If I didn’t want to deal with tubes and was pairing with headphones with a “lighter” or “thinner” sound, then the RDAC + LCX combination would be an excellent way to go. As things stand, for me, I maintain a slight preference for the RDAC + MCTH combination. It winds up being the best combination of preservation of the traits of the RDAC I enjoyed the most, and which made it such an enjoyable listen, as well as a tweakable (via tube rolling) way to fine-tune that.

    Beyond that, I've found that all three of these amps, paired with the RDAC, and the HD6XX, HD800(S) and, interestingly enough, even the HD660S* are really good with these combinations. And the RDAC + MCTH + HD6XX is a lovely setup for under $800.

    ---
    *Heresy though it is, and inevitable tarring, feathering and taking away my Marmite that will ensue as a result of that statement, its the most enjoyable I've heard them**.
    **Not that this is a reason to buy them, especially if you have HD650/HD6XX available or can snag a pair.
     
  13. Scubadude

    Scubadude Almost "Made"

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2016
    Likes Received:
    332
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Pretoria, South Africa
    6 June in South Africa already and I see the drop date is now "Coming soon". I hope the design ownership furore does not derail what looks like a really good deal.
     
  14. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

    Pyrate Banned
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I guess that means there was enough of an issue to postpone the drop. It was supposed to be live today. I was still interested in buying despite the drama.
     
  15. Linkgoron

    Linkgoron New

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2016
    Likes Received:
    42
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Location:
    IL
    The drop is now active, the date was always 6AM PT.


    Estimated ship date is Dec 18, 2018 PT.
     
  16. soekris

    soekris MOT - Soekris Engineering

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2016
    Likes Received:
    954
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Denmark
    Delivery Dec 18, 2018 ?? Massdrop / Airist are welcome to contact me, I'll be happy to design and deliver a plug compatible module with same sound and functionality but better specifications, at a lower manufacturing cost (the pictured board use some unnecessary expensive parts) in good time for Dec 18, 2018 shipping, and not hampered by rights as I own my designs :)....
     
  17. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

    Pyrate Banned
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Sorry, got my times zones mixed up. These LONG wait times are pretty tough to take for "gotta have it now" audiophiles." I have to admit that it weighs in my decision making process. Two or three months is one thing, but end of the year is another.
     
  18. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

    Pyrate Banned
    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    So, expensive parts are a bad thing? :rolleyes:
     
  19. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2016
    Likes Received:
    2,750
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Calgary, Alberta
    Home Page:
    For the impulsive buyer to later impulsive seller?! :eek:
     
  20. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2017
    Likes Received:
    3,758
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Jackson, Mi
    If I already have Modi Multibit + Eitr is this a meaningful upgrade? Seems to be some disagreement on how much better the RDAC is than the Modi Multibit. I'm considering ordering this and picking up a MCTH for a nice second stack.
     

Share This Page