Mechanical Keyboards...

Discussion in 'Geek Cave: Computers, Tablets, HT, Phones, Games' started by aufmerksam, Oct 1, 2015.

  1. aufmerksam

    aufmerksam Friend

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    This was often discussed in passing in the shoutbox, but I know many of us have thoughts and opinions on the topic. I also know reddit has a BILLION informations about this, but I know the way many of you make decisions, and would appreciate insight.

    I want to dip into this universe, but would love suggestions about where to start, since costs can quickly become high. I want tenkeyless, but need full navigation since I do a TON of document drafting. Saw this over at massdrop and it is appealing primarily due to cost. I appreciate it lacks many nicer features, but I just need something to try so I can see if mechanical keys are really my thing. Is there any major pitfall I am missing.
     
  2. velvetx

    velvetx Gear Master West/Vendor Spotlight Moderator

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    Let me give a little background about mech keyboards. The history and kind of cult following of them from the way I was told is that they are used primarily by programmers/hackers/web designers. The concept behind them is that they keys are very soft so it can increase typing speed. The keyboard is just the start of it if you really want to know more you have to get into the keys (cherry mx colors and more on the article listed below). Please keep in mind that the key clicks are somewhat loud but you get used to them and with like any new keyboard it can take some time to become adapted to them. Gamers have taken a liking to them and they now have become much more mainstream.

    http://www.overclock.net/t/491752/official-mechanical-keyboard-guide

    In regards to companies I would buy mech keyboards from listed below are the companies I know for a fact you should buy from:

    Das Keyboard - http://www.daskeyboard.com/
    Ducky Shine - http://www.duckychannel.com.tw/en/Shine_3_DK9008.html

    Companies to stay away from:
    Logitech
    Corsair
    Razer
     
  3. DrForBin

    DrForBin Friend

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  4. kapanak

    kapanak Canucklehead - Friend

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    I use a Filco Majestouch 2 Ninja full-size myself, and I would place Filco above Ducky in terms of quality and durability over time.

    If you are looking to use this primarily for typing, stay away from Corsair, Razer and Logitech and the like.
     
  5. No_One411

    No_One411 Fired by Jude

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    I highly recommend trying to find a tenkeyless keyboard. Get an external keypad if you need the numeric keypad for Excel input or something.

    Ergonomically more comfortable to keep the distance between your keyboard and mouse to a minimal.

    I've been swapping between a Das with cherry mx blues for typing and a Filco with reds for gaming.

    If possible, try to get a switch sampler, which gives you all the possible options to play around with. Honestly not a huge waste of like $20 if you can figure out which switch suits your typing style.
     
  6. dark_energy

    dark_energy Friend

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    yup, get the sampler kit. Most mechanical keyswitches are not what you think they are. Average force switches like Brown are softer than Thinkpad/Apple Keyboard keys.

    Edit. Try some keyboards, if you get the chance.

    IMO, linear keys are meh. I would save the extra $ and get a decant membrane instead like Apple Keyboard. From reviews, most are happy with Blue switches. But they do produce some extra clicky noise.

    I am using MX Browns, i wouldn't mind an other one with Blues.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2015
  7. Skyline

    Skyline Double-blindly done with this hobby

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    What's wrong with Corsair?
     
  8. velvetx

    velvetx Gear Master West/Vendor Spotlight Moderator

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    In my experiences they break and their customer service is really bad. I won't buy corsair products period anymore after having to deal with their customer service and warranty departments.
     
  9. kapanak

    kapanak Canucklehead - Friend

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    Okay I think that's just your experience. I might agree with you on peripherals warranty, but Corsair has perhaps the best customer service in the industry when it comes to RAM and Power Supply and CPU coolers.
     
  10. Azteca

    Azteca Friend

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    I have a Das Keyboard Pro for Mac, the last gen I think (now Model S). Works great.
     
  11. dark_energy

    dark_energy Friend

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    Logitech G502 and Corsair M60 are rock solid though. Dunno about the keyboards. I havent had any problems with Logitech. Had a rebranded, half assed PSU from Corsair, but everyone makes mistakes..

    Anyway, not a big fan of CM, but their Quickfire keyboards are solid. Minimalistic design, hardware programmable(no glitchy software here), nice simple and it works. I opened mine, proper PCB mounted key switches. Sturdy design.
     
  12. SoupRKnowva

    SoupRKnowva Official SBAF South Korean Ambassador

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    I like my two leopolds. One full sized with brown switches that I used for quite a while. But then I kept reading about topre switches and for the longest time I wanted to try them, but everyone said they were love me or hate switches and all the keyboards were too expensive. But then leopolds came out with a small, 66 key I think, keyboard with the topres for only like 110 bucks. So I snagged that to try them, and fell in love in like 2 days. Been using it ever since. Should probably snag a regular 10keyless topre keyboard now though, but I don't remember if the leopold had 45/55/ergonomic distribution of the keys...
     
  13. money4me247

    money4me247 Friend

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    Love mechanical keyboards!!

    I run cherry brown (tactile) switches on a Ducky Shine 3. Brown switches are a bit clackity so not ideal for those for those who need absolute silence. Added some cheap o-rings under for less noise, but love the typing and gaming experience with mechanical keyboards. A lot more precise and more reliable feeling as you can tell when the switches activate. I purchased a Das Keyboard Model S Professional with cherry red (linear) switches for my brother who requires more quiet set-up at work. A lot of his co-workers converted to mechanicals after trying out his keyboard. I would highly recommend both brands from my personal experience. Very durable products that is a pleasure to use for those who type frequently or game a lot. Either tactile or linear keys can be used from typing or gaming, really just personal preference. I prefer the tactile switches myself.

    I don't think you need to purchase a sampler kit at all. Just go to Best Buy or some computer store with a few different mechanical keyboards and clack down on the keys a bit to see how it suits you. Google the keyboard when in store to see the type of cherry switch being used. Things to pay attention to is just the general overall feel for typing/gaming are:
    • amount of force required to activate. cherry reds < blacks for amount of force to activate for linear switches. cherry browns < clear < blue < green for amount of force needed for tactile switches. More resistance prevents errors as you need to push harder, but less resistance feel less fatiguing to type on for a long period of time as using less force. Really just a personal preference type thing.
    • when the keypress registers
    • when the keys bottom out
    • if you like to have a little tactile feedback "bump" sensation with keypresses (tactile switches like cherry brown/clear/blue/green), or prefer the smoother feel offered by linear switches like (cherry red/black).
    If noise is a concern, likely the black/red switches will be a better option as the tactile switches will noisier in general, even non-clicky ones like the brown. If you are a heavy handed typer though, you will get a bit of "clacking" when you bottom out the key no matter what switch type. Can get o-rings to dampen the sound made from bottoming out or adjust your typing style.

    I would also highly recommend a tenkeyless set-up unless you work a lot with numbers. My brother is in finance and crunches a lot of numbers at the office so he requires a numberpad for more efficiency. His gaming is more orientated towards MOBA like DOTA. I like RTS or FPS games much more and feel more comfortable with the tactile feedback for my button presses. Really just a personal preference thing which switch type suits you the best imo.
     
  14. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    I've tried dozens of mechanical keyboards. As a game designer, I type a crapload and hardcore game. The absolute best mechanical switch for that versatility is Cherry MX Brown.

    I've used DAS, Ducky, and other 3 figure keyboards. I found that nothing is better than Cooler Master.

    I use this at home:
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B007V...ster+Brown&dpPl=1&dpID=41w5LgcIfcL&ref=plSrch

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B001...+low+force&dpPl=1&dpID=41IeqFwY6YL&ref=plSrch

    And this at work:
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00EQV0W02/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?qid=1443756965&sr=8-2&pi=SX200_QL40&keywords=cooler+master+Brown&dpPl=1&dpID=31r+ss6kN8L&ref=plSrch

    They've lasted for years of abuse and a child.

    Edit before someone with a $200 keyboard gets mad: others are as good as the Cooler Master Quickfire series, just not better. I had a $200 keyboard break on me years ago from playing FPSes too... enthusiastically. My CM keyboards have survived years of nerd rage.
     
  15. cizx

    cizx Friend

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    I've tried Cherry Blue, Brown, Green, Clear, Matias Alps Clicky, IBM buckling spring, Unicomp buckling spring, and Topre.

    I'd rank them like this...
    Great:
    Topre 55g (Realforce 87u)
    IBM BS (Model M)

    Good:
    Unicomp BS (Ultra classic)
    Topre 45g (Unicomp 104ug High Profile)

    Usable:
    Cherry MX Blue (Pok3r)
    Cherry MX Clear (WASD Code)
    Cherry MX Brown (Corsair K70)

    Not good:
    Cherry MX Green (WASD Code)
    Matias Alps Clicky (KB Paradise 60%)

    Cherry blues and greens lack the smoothness that I like about Topre and the tactility I like about buckling spring, but they're okay. Greens are too hard to type on, though, so unless you really hit the keys hard, skip it. They're supposed to have the same activation force as BS, but they lack the snappy quality of the older switches. I don't like them. Clears are like stiffer Browns, no click, but supposedly a bump. I can't feel it. I started with buckling spring, so none of the lauded tactility of the Cherry switches impresses me.

    I tried the alps switches because they were supposed to have a satisfying sound and feel, but they just felt and sounded chintzy.

    Topre is my favorite. At first I had a hard time adjusting. They're quieter than most of the others, and the feel is different, but typing on them is really enjoyable. I thought I'd like the hi-pro caps, but the 104ug feels decidedly less solid and satisfying than the 87u. I think this is the best switch for typing and pretty great for gaming. I haven't tried the Novatouch, which is a gaming board with Topres and takes Cherry MX compatible caps, but I've heard it's not as solid as the realforce boards.

    If you want and can deal with the (very loud) sound and can find one cheap, start with an IBM Model M. I got my first one for $5 about 12 years ago, and it's still going. If you want to spend the money, go with a Topre. If you hate it, you won't have trouble reselling it on eBay or geekhack. I have two 87us now. I'm done.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2015
  16. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    I didn't give Topre a chance. Typed for about 30 minutes then gamed for an hour and I was done.

    It ghosted during gaming because it was USB. That's a dealbreaker. Decided not to bother getting used to typing with a >$200 keyboard that ghosts (though admittedly even my short time typing on it was nice).

    If you don't know what ghosting is, it's when you're hitting multiple keys and one doesn't register. The CM keyboards have anti-ghosting in USB and zero with PS/2, as do some if the newer Topres.
     
  17. cizx

    cizx Friend

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    I only play MMOs, and I've never had a problem with ghosting except for the IBMs, but I think that's because of the ps/2 to USB adapter I was using.
     
  18. antifocus

    antifocus Friend

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    CM Quick fire pro or whatever it is called is a good start, then you choose it based on your personal liking.
    I personally hate KBTalking, and not fond of vortex, but their Poker is fine.
     
  19. aufmerksam

    aufmerksam Friend

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    This is all really helpful! I hoped this thread would be a dumping ground for thoughts, opinions, and questions. Good start!

    I don't really game anymore, and will primarily be typing. I already have a separate numpad that is wireless b/c when I am entering numbers into a sheet I want that thing sitting right in front of me.

    I should clarify I have read .9 shitloads all over the webs, and was pretty much set on mx browns (cherry or clone) or matias quiet click. I have a closed office, so sound is not an issue, except for my own irritation; I know I want tactile. After reading some of the comments here, I am re- curious about actuation force.Will brown be too light? The keys on the board I use at the office are about 58g, but its a chicle style membrane. I don't make too many errors, and when I do its from something like an accidental triple letter when double tapping. I am hoping that longer key travel and tactile feedback would address this more than an increase in actuation force.
     
  20. anetode

    anetode Friend

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    FWIW, MX Browns wound up being my faves from the Cherry sampler. If you'd rather have something heavier, there are MX Clears.

    [​IMG]
     

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