OFFICIAL: Massdrop Sennheiser HD6XX

It seems to me the HD6xx I just received is not as warm as the HD650. Some others on HF are noticing this too. I wonder if MD and / or Sennheiser tunned the recent batch of 6XXs differently. Alternatively, could the 6xx be a 660 now?

 

How old is your 650? I'm becoming more and more convinced that new 650s are not as warm as the old ones. Makes sense that it would carry over to the 6XX as well.

 

When I sold my five year old 650 earlier this year and replaced it with NIB from Amazon, I would tend to agree with you. My new replacement never sounded the same. The old pair did sound warmer.

 

I have a Silver HD 650 from Oct 2013 (India, Flipkart), have their been any revisions since then?

 

I don't have a 650. I just remember how they sounded when I listened to stock ones. I did have an older 650M I purchased from here, and which it sounded less warm than stock, but it was still warm.

I also recall listening to the MD6xx right before it came out at the LA meet, and it sure sounded the same as a stock 650, but I only had it for about 60 minutes under meet conditions.

I guess it would be nice to have a set of measurements comparing an older 650, a newer 650, and the 6xx. Might be moot to measure a new 650 if the 650 is discontinued. There are rumors.

 

@rtaylor76 and I compared old v. new recently and the impressions can be found in the "official" HD650 thread. I don't want to have parallel conversations happening, so I won't repeat it all here.

There are a lot of variables in play other than old v. new, but the differences were stark.

 

Massdrop just announced a drop for Cardas Clear Light cables, with options for length and connectors, including HD6xx or HD800, 2.5mm or Mini XLR, starting at $135

https://www.massdrop.com/buy/cardas-premium-clear-light-headphone-cables

 

I got my HD6XX a few days ago. I was expecting the following:
- Slight 'veil'
- Warm sound
- Weak bass performance as compared to my M1060's (modded)
- Narrow soundstage
- Intimate sound with great detail

So, my two cents on what I actually experienced. This is my subjective impression, running flac files and 320kbs MP3's through my Modi Multibit (SPDIF) and Vali 2 (Philips Miniwatt SQ e88cc tube). I directly compared it to my modded M1060's (Velour Brainwavz pads, fuzzor mod and paper towel mod).

1. Veil? What veil? Yes, treble is smooth, but by no means does it lack detail or does the midrange sound veiled. Also I don't really hear the bass distortion influence on the midrange. Could be the setup I use? I don't like agression in sound. At all. So I like it laid back.
2. Smooooth. But the imaging is top notch. Imaging, detail and clarity are all superior to my modded M1060's. No contest. They sound 'leaner' if you will.
3. Soundstage is narrower than my M1060's. But I don't mind it nearly as much as I expected. Vocals and strings are just shot into you brain (soft shooting though, absolutely non-piercing). The intimacy is really a unique feature compared to any other headphone I've heard (AKG K612, Fidelio X2, M1060). And the soundstage is still there! It was not as narrow as expected.
4. Bass performance is no match for the M1060. That planar extension and fast response is amazing. But I expected more roll-off to be honest. So in that sense, not bad at all. Bass is still there when it needs to be. I would like it tighter though.
5. Tonally, the modded M1060 feels like a warmer, almost bloated and more bass heavy version of the HD6XX. Which is weird... if you just look at the frequency response curves. I've found treble comparable and upper midrange equally 'forward' sounding at times. Especially whilst listening to The Pretty Reckless. But the placement of instruments and detail in the HD6XX is far superior. Background vocals and hihats on Fleetwood Mac - Rhiannon made that abundantly clear.

Concluding; my M1060's are now in my cupboard somewhere. Apart from bass and soundstage, they are no match for the 6XX. And I didn't mod the 6XX (yet). These are the most musically balanced headphones I've heard and from memory they sound less warm than the HD650's (mind you, from memory). This may also be because of the lack of detail I now know is present in the M1060's, which feel bloated to me now. If you only listen to Deadmau5 or alike; go for the M1060's. But in nearly any other case, the HD6XX outclass them. I don't really notice the slow transients often mentioned in the HD6XX/650, but that could very well be because my Modi Multibit/vali setup is laid back anyway. And I wouldn't want it any other way for now

Future plans? KISS mod the 6XX and get a Schiit Loki for more subbass in electronic music/gaming. Other than that; save for the ZMF Auteur ???

 

I ordered a replacement Sylvania 6sn7 tube for my Ember, it opened up the soundstage even more on the LCDs so I think they might do the same for the 6xx.

 

Just wanted to update, after about a week of use, I performed the dynamat mod with the KISS template (spider cage + foam removal, applied Dynamat only, no coin mod), but because I'm a bass lover I kept the magnet hole open (it is dampened by Dynamat, but I didn't use any foam). Here's my subjective results (same setup as before):
1. Increased bass response - This for me is the most drastic change. I don't think I need the Loki anymore to increase it further. There is more bass throughout the entire range.
2. Tighter bass - It tightened up a bit. This is exactly what I hoped for with the Dynamat! It just seems to decay a little more quickly, instead of lingering where it shouldn't. Still nowhere near the fast bass of the M1060 though. But good enough for most of my music selection minus the dubstep.
3. Slightly more grain in the upper mid - treble. I don't know what this is? Maybe because of the foam I left out? It gives vocals (especially female vocals) some more texture, but I'm not sure if this is positive or negative yet. It's definitely something I'll get used to though and considering the changes in the low end, this is really really minor. Don't mistake it for being a night-day difference. It's subtle.

Other than that, I don't feel a lot has changed. The headphone feels slightly 'faster' now with a little more grain, but definitely with elevated bass response. The increase in detail over the midrange and treble a lot of members here mention (at least for the HD650) is not something that stood out to me. Maybe if I had a more high-end setup or something less laid-back such as the Jotunheim instead of the Vali 2, that would be more evident? Or maybe the reports of the HD6XX being less veiled than the HD650 to begin with are true? I can't know for sure. But for me, it was about tightening up and increasing the bass a little and it worked. So in all; I am super happy with it! Hope this helps some of you with your modding choices!

 

Got the dekoni hybrid pads, tried it with both 600 and 650, same results more of less. I'm not good at describing sound but here are the difference.
-Elevated bass, got the bass of my modded 650 to the level of X00 with dekoni sheepskin pads, but extremely loose/muddy compare to 6XX stock pads.
-Vocal brought forward a bit with a warm tilt, I don't dislike it but the bass was f'ing with it.
-Treble idk I'm not sensitive.
-Collapsed soundstage compare the the already not-so-great one. Less air I guess.
Better stick with stock pads IMO. The dekoni ones aren't more comfortable either.

 

I got the 'elite velour' earpads, they're way more comfortable than the stock pads which are really stiff imo.
Has an increased bass presence. Not much else was changed though.

 

Anyone tried the Dynmat mod, but didn't remove the spider cage? I just want to tighten up the bass a little without changing the FR.

 

Finally got it, it's just as good for the 6xx as it for for the LCDs. And it's no wonder I burned my first one out so fast, most orgasmic tube ever (even if I've only had like 4 kinds ᐛ ).

 

Finally got mine. What f*cking veil? I've always been an ER-4/SA-5000/T1 type of guy. At least I thought I was. I had prepared some Aussie-Dollar Modded replacement foams because I though for sure I would want to do that. I've put the un-modded foams back in.

They're not as open and airy I'd like. But the coin mod didn't fix that, it just made the treble almost too hot. What the hell is going on?!??!? I'm 42 now, is this what happens as you get older? Or is the veil really a myth? Got them running from D30 DAC into Valh 2 and Lyr 2.

I've ordered the second skin. I feel like I'm going to have to do the full mod to the back. But I'm all thumbs, wish me luck!

 

It's not so much the cage as the rear foam that will affect low end FR. I removed my foam and left the cage in place at first. Didn't notice much if any difference after removing the cage, though it does allow for easier application of Dynamat on the magnet, as well as tailoring the amount of foam you want to put over the hole.

So you can go ahead and apply Dynamat as you want with both foam and cage in place. You just won't be able to apply any on the magnet (covered by foam), which will likely limit the amount of "bass tightening" you'll get.

 

Thanks!

So the Dynamat over the magnet helps tighten the bass?

Is the major effect on upper frequencies is the foam cut out?

Can I assume that cage removal and dynamat application will tighten bass without making the headphones brighter?

 

For me, rear mods didn't change mid/high FR. I think some have said that opening up the rear makes thing "flow better"(?) across the spectrum (from dotardic memory). IME if you remove the cage, put 'mat over the magnet (not too close to the hole) and other surrounding parts, and then put one or two layers of foam over the hole to control the amount of bass, you'll have tighter bass and less midbass hump.

Check the HD650 resources for pics of where people have put their 'mat.

 

Need some advise.

I bought my HD 650 Silver in Oct 2013 from India from Flipkart.com brand new.

Have there been any revisions post that?

Is the HD 6xx brighter?

Aakshey

 

I fooled around with pad swapping my heavily used 2016 HD600 and first batch, lightly used HD6XX. 600 pads appear only slightly more squished, but they feel less stiff on your head and sound different. BTW I assume the two sets of pads are identical, as that seems to be the consensus over at the 660S impressions thread. I did not swap around the foam pieces that sit under the pad. The two sets of foams appear very identical, even when held against a lamp.

When hearing HD600 with 6XX pads it gave me flashbacks of how it sounded back when it was new and its own pads were stiff. Here:

Disclaimer, the following are all subtle differences.

HD600 with stiff pads in comparison to HD600 with squished sonds more like:
-In general lean, analytical, sterile, boring; Dry in all frequencies; Slightly brighter and grainier, treble not as well integrated; Faster everything; More focused everything; Significantly better instrument seperation; Way more holographic bass that does not bleed into the mids; slightly more holographic mids, actually too holographic now and dominated by the slightly grainy treble.
-More out of head stage; Much better layering
-So fast it's boring and the opposite of musical. The other side of the same coin is godlike technicalities.
-A small, far away, barely audible ghostly flute easily cuts through the mix. Very black background.

Other way round, squished sound more like:
-Bass: warm, not-boomy-but-soft-and-flabby. At the same time with MORE punch. I don't know. It's just soft and punchy at the same time. It's like drunk, wobbly, warm. It's less-focused, less-holographic, flooding in from everywhere. Not black. Bass bleeds a bit into the lower mids, but it doesn't suck as it's somehow smooth and progressive. Still not as seamless (and again, holographic) as the stiff pads... but I kind of like the warmth.
-That same flute is now in a shallow swimming pool with noone swimming in it, but it has some low frequency wind generated wripples that ultimately bounce around and interfere with each-other. In other words, micro detail is still pretty sweet and mostly there, just not as clear, not as effortless. Not on a black background. Not handed to you on a silver platter like with the stiff pads.
-Treble is magically less grainy, especially around 18k. It's also a bit softer, less delineated and with less airy. I find this subjectively a better trade. Furthermore, treble now integrates even better with the MDMA, err, i mean HD600's upper mids.
-Mids are now even more forward, but not in the stiff pad way. The stiff pad way is holographic, transparent and uneventful. The squished way is warm, with ultra organic and engaging porn, err, i mean HD600 mids. Remember, the treble is also better suited to the mids, so that's the other thing that helps the mids stand out. Unlike the weirder bass to mids transition, the squished pads treble actually integrates a lot better with the upper mids, which I really like. Attacks are now liquefied sex backed up by a warm bed err i mean bass.

So basically the squished pads are softer, warmer and more mid-focused and thus work well for low quality recordings and also for agressive, ear-massaging music like dubstep, trap and wave. Stiffs are for analytical stuff like inner detail and spatial ques.
Guess who's music is mostly trap ripped from youtube and other modern compressed recordings. Thats right - me. And I feel like squished pads suit me better. Even with the worse technicalities, the more organic and more fun mids are a plus for most of my music.
Also, again, I only have wyrd-modi1-magni1, so maybe the warmer squishy pads have better synergy with the cold-sounding magni1.

HD6XX? Garbage both ways. Err. I mean the same differences are observed here, pick your poison:
Squished: warm + dark = sleep
Stiff: analytical + dark = anxiety + depression
Yeah, yeah, the HD6XX is not exactly dark... I hear it as: lower-mids-and-bass-focused + a bit "v" shaped.
Both: It's a gross HD6XX either way, so nothing fixes the 2-4k hollow-plastic-disjointed-veiled-nonsense. Veiled. Yes. Deal with it. Coin mod you say? I'm sceptical, because, again, the foam piece is the same. And the HD600 never sounds veiled. And HD6XX always sounds veiled. No equalizer cures it, but just treats it to mask the weirdness. Today I liked +3dB at 2283Hz Q=1 with it. Made it way less bad, but definitely still weird and unnatural.
Back to squished: Yes, the squishy magic does make the treble smoother and better integrated... umm... with most other frequencies, but 2-4k is still weird and ruins the otherwise super balanced sound by making it sleepy and unengaging.

Yes, I called HD6XX garbage... Compared to HD600, that is. In my own, purely subjective view, that is. I base it on this:
HD600 gets me 98% there. HD6XX gets me 90% there. But audio is about chasing the dragon, err, I mean the 100%. So 2% down from 100% is 5 times better than 10% down. (BTW Koss KSC75 gets me like 84% there. At least It's not veiled, so in a way it is better than 6XX, but it has other problems so I admit it's still worse overall.)

HD6XX is VEILED.
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I mean, happy new year, everyone! : DDD