Planar Magnetics, are they all overpriced?

It seems planars are ridiculously price for the performance they give. (HEX,HE1K, Audeze etc)

Are there any planars that arn't overpriced in a p/p ratio?

 

HE-560 - worth every penny (IMO), especially at the prevalent used pricing.

 

HE400S and to a lesser extend Audeze SINE.

 

perhaps because they're made on a much smaller scale, i'd say LFF Enigma/Paradox/Slant and ZMF headphones have a pretty good price to performance thing going on.

 

HE400S is a favorite of mine, very good p/p.

HE500 was very good but isn't made anymore, can find them used though. Not so comfortable stock and build is so so but great sound.

HE-6 also but I've yet to hear one, probably end game headphone with the right mods and amp.

The HEK I think is bordeline good value for money... I'd like it to be cheaper but then when I heard it I instantly liked it more than pretty much any Audeze headphone I've ever heard (pretty much all of them except LCD-4). Does that make it good value or just the Audeze ones overpriced? Not sure...

 

More and more overpriced (flagship models). When HFM speakers releases, well, can't imagine the price. I know the designer of HFM (the guy who created Jade) is doing other projects, he is not always working for HFM now.

 

The technology put into planars may not be new but it is still not nearly as developed as dynamic drivers. Planar headphones and speakers thrive in a niche market, but there is no where near the demand compared to dynamics. Because of the smaller demand there has been less R/D into production process efficiency.

 

TOTL planars are most definitely overpriced. $4K for headphones that sound like ass? Thanks Audeze!

 

This.

What irks me most is how TOTL** headphones (not necessarily planars...) keep increasing in price over the years. From 499 to 699 to 899 to 1099 to etc. And now we see TOTL headphones for 2000-4000. What the heck is going on really. Inflation?


**Accessible TOTL - I won't talk about limited run ones.

 

I believe @Marvey has touched on this a few times. Personal audio is a much more nascent market than the speaker world, and with bastions of hype like HF out there to convince everyone that whatever new thing is the BEST THING EVAR, people are willing to pay increasing amounts in the misguided belief that anything that costs more must sound better.

Then of course you have the backlash to that, the nwavguy disciples who think that nothing over $100 gets you any real improvement, and would rather have five or six entry level/mid-fi headphones than one or two TOTL headphones.

 

Definitely. I can't say anything about the Abyss though. Never heard it or checked its built.
Hifiman and Audeze are built like crap and their sound doesn't make up for it. Never ever.

LCD-2, LCD-3 should cost less than a HD800. I'd say a HEK should be around the price of the HD800/S, not 3500€ of madness.

 

But you see, people are free to spend their money on what they want. It doesn't matter if it is due to hype, misinformation, willful stupidity, or some combination thereof; all that matters is that someone subjectively likes a headphone for it to be "worth" the asking price.

This attitude has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that companies from all industries continue to churn out crap for exorbitant prices.

The implication here is that a product is not overpriced if you can find a critical mass of people stupid enough to pay any price for it.

 

A T50RP mk3 could be a fun planar to play with. And all the mods that are out there to be done...

...and I think there's a $50 rebate currently.

We should probably get a tour of one of these going.

 

My unsolicited take on it, because I have a couple of minutes this morning. This topic is really just three problems in one and we have to work hard to not conflate them:

1. Quite a bit of the new development at the "high end" of the market has been planars, with very few stats or dynamic headphones being released.
2. Prices on the high end across the board are increasing at unacceptable rates. This is an industry-wide problem and not simply a planar headphone problem.
3. In the low budget area, the HD6X0 series represents such an extremely strong value in terms of scalability, reliability, and performance that it makes life hard for some planar magnetic headphones to justify their price.

There are plenty of planars that IMO are priced very well for performance. Without getting into modable vintage planars, I think the list is:

-- Most of Zach's (ZMF) headphones (especially the Vibro MKII and the Blackwood)
-- Most of Luis's headphones (with the 'starving students' being the best value)
-- Aftermarket OG Mad Dog 3.1-3.2s
-- The stock Fostex t50rp MKIII
-- The HE-400S and HE-560
-- Aftermarket HE-500s and HE-6s
-- The Oppo PM-2 (refurbs at $500 direct) and the PM-3
-- and the Audeze Sine

I think every one of these represents a solid value at their respective price points and form factors. Almost all of these have already been mentioned already in the thread as counter to the assertion that planars are all overpriced.

The middle of the pack planars in terms of price-to-performance are (again, IMO) the PMx2, the Ether and Ether-C, and the LCD-X and LCD-2/3. The HE-X sits on the border between this and the indefensibly priced. All of these headphones aren't bad by any means and depending on someone's taste preferences could be a person's favorite headphone. Some of them come with unique affordances -- the PMx2 has portability and ease of pairing, the Ether has comfort, the others have decent enough aesthetics at bare minimum. But from a cost-benefit place they have to compete in terms of value with both the HD6X0 and pile of strong value planars that already exist. This is a much harder case to make to consumers and to critics that make price part of their evaluative criteria.

The indefensibly priced planars are (one last IMO): the Abyss, the HE-1000, the LCD-4. There's a long, illustrious tradition of targeting the wealthy to bankroll new product development or formal innovation. Gustav Febergé understood it. Clement Greenberg understood it too. I think that these either don't represent enough in terms of either technological innovation, sound quality, or construction quality (see: Ohhgourami's breakdown of the HE-1000) to justify their price points even at the high end.

I think that consumers need to speak with their wallets and just have some f'ing standards. I think that megabuck headphones need to either do something extremely novel or be amazing sounding as well as display strong craftsmanship and durability/reliability in order to justify their ludicrous pricing. And we're sure as shit not there yet.

 

What do you guys think of the Audio Zenith PMX2?

At one point a few months ago (after having read some positive early buzz) I was considering an upgrade to my Alpha Dogs. I was actually going to ask about the PMX2 elsewhere because it seems there is very little talk about it now despite the early buzz. I guess if the early hype was legitimate it would certainly be a worthy candidate for a TOTL offering with a good P/P ratio?

 

Outside of a highly modded HE-6 off a good speaker amp, they're my favorite planar. Amazingly flat tonal balance with good technicalities and quick transients. Missing a little air and treble resolution vs other TOTL offerings and not quite as resolving as other TOTL offerings either. Best with a incisive amplifier like the Ragnarok or a Krell Klone.

The price stings at $1400 purchased straight from Alex, which is why I put it in the "middle of the pack" category. At $500 for the PM-2 + ~$740 for modification with Alex's velour pads, the price isn't quite as bad. I've seen 4-5 of them come up on the second hand market for ~$1000 and that's even better. The problem with the PMx2 is that it has to compete with the HD650, which is IMO quite similar sounding after modification (worse quality bass but more resolving/detailed). The HD650 pulls ahead with very good tube amps...but those cost quite a bit. (And no, I don't think that a Bottlehead Crack or a Valhalla 2 is enough to make the HD650 better than the PMx2). The PMx2 has much more modest amplification requirements and even sounds good straight from a decent smartphone.

I think that they'd be a very good upgrade to your Alpha Dogs, that's for sure.

 

Since you guys still haven't got with the program:

 

needs "moar" speakers