Please help SBAF USERS..Deoxit and other good Rig maintainace the inside story..

Discussion in 'Modifications and Tweaks' started by Middy, Apr 10, 2016.

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What maintainace do you do on your setup

  1. A Nothing A Dust If My Auntie Is coming over

    82.4%
  2. B a good clean and refit cables

    5.9%
  3. C IPA HEADPHONE plugs

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. D All connections contact cleaner

    5.9%
  5. E Anything I can take apart with a drew driver I love it

    5.9%
  1. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    The cable I had before was a bit loose.
    The fancy one has a solid grip, I knew I wouldn't get the internal boost I got from doing inside my Amp. It was a bit of fun doing the cable, I am a bit boring and fastidious. So me doing this cable I wanted a 100% starting point before I judged if it made a difference or was in my head.

    I think a better earth is the key..

    Please jump in with thoughts and ideas.. everyone..Good bad but be honest...
    I'll try and keep the thread going but wanted more guys and gals on SBAF chipping in.
    What they do.. nothing to plug polishing...
    What works for them, what doesnt. What to buy, what's snake oil...
    Then make a simple Wiki for SBAF and googlers looking for honest advice...

    Psychology wise I'd be happy if in my head it seems better, even if it's cost or effort involved..but I wouldn't pass this as good advice. There is a degree of grey area were some things do work. I hate the conman taking advantage of well meaning people for no real return. But if I can say in all honesty it did have an effect... and it helps others. Especially cheap or free..
    Deoxit and IPA verse a Furutech cable...

    Thanks Thad for the advice and thoughts..
    Honesty and fun is all I want or its just me procrastinating.....

    Cheers

    Dave
     
  2. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Oh sure! And I'm all for DeOxit :)
     
  3. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    A bit cheeky taking this from CA on the intona thread but I am waiting for JJ to kindly do a resistance article.

    It's not to prove a point but to give some evidence that cables, connections are worth making an effort getting them at their best...
    Hopefully for very little cost but see what else can be done..... My piece is inside the RIG..... but all connections all add to the whole... Jump in if you agree/ disagree. Or have an idea....
    I have just bought this so this caught my eye..
    I hope it works £200.....


    Originally Posted by kilroy [​IMG]
    In use, should the Intona device be closer to the source or theDAC?

    If a DAC does not need the 5V line, should it be cut-off at the source, or does it not matter? (My DAC does not, and I block it at the server.)
    Do not cut-off the 5V line. Most devices use this as VBUS detection and they will probably to not work without. The 5V coming out of our isolator is as clean as it would come from a linear wall wart.

    In gerneral, look at the contacts in yourUSB cables' connectors. They become dark with time, especially when pulled off and on a lot. Gold plating is very thin and may scrape off. This leads to higher impedance and affects signal quality. USB is prone to errors here because of its nature alternating differential and single ended signals.
    Maybe I will do some eye diagram measurements with different cable lengths and aging connectors when there is some time left. This may show some insight from a scientific point of view.

    -Daniel
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2016
  4. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Computer Audiophile. I don't go there. I value my sanity. I certainly don't see it as any kind of authority. Once, long ago, perhaps but... well, that was long ago.

    Having said that (and meant it: audiophooling the computer is one of the things I most detest in the modern audio world) it can't be all wrong. USB: just another set of contacts. Could, perhaps, be kept clean. Yes.

    Once again, beware... Most audiophoolery comes from some idea, which may have a grain of truth in it or more, and extrapolating it into a problem than not only potential exists in maybe-dubious theory, but absolutely always happens. Except it doesn't.
     
  5. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    I agree mate....evidence of one isn't even a theory..... I might have just been lucky with my OPPO.. It's the only reason I can suggest a cheap fix as if it doesn't work. It's no great loss for $15. But a big gain if it does.
    IFI IPURIFIER 2. And the INTONA soon, as an admin here suggested it.... My last tweak.... As I am getting dragged into the audio foolery....as this extra detail is addictive... Keep me on the straight and narrow Thad E....
    I just wanted to add something positive to the community...... Cheap and effective...
     
  6. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Well, Middy, my biggest problem in audio now is the thing that can never be corrected: age-related hearing loss that's getting quite bad. I'd pour snake oil in my ears if I thought there was the slightest chance!

    I have an ifi headphone amp, and began with a positive view towards the company and its products. I might even have bought more if it had not been for an absurd hype-fest thread on Head-Fi which completely put me off them. But I'm prone to prejudice against marketing men and their horseshit. Thing is, it doesn't always mean that the company produces a bad product.

    There are some theoretical things I have learnt, and some practical things I have experienced and analysed, almost too late for my "critical listening" days which are now over as my hearing is so very far from flat (don't sob too hard: I can still hear lots of the music, and EQ helps a lot).

    If you want to hear detail: listen for it.

    Seriously. When someone says "just listen to the detail that this component brings out," you will be listening for detail, you will hear detail.

    Another thing is that, whether we pursue audio as a seriously intensive hobby, or are just buying a new amplifier because the old one fell to pieces, we have to do some comparative A/B/etc listening and testing. Never mind the whole sighted-testing-bias stuff, which is all very real, there is something much simpler going on. Listen to the same piece of music multiple times. Do you hear it the same every time? No... your brain would die of boredom if you did. You will (should?) hear differences.

    Still... what to do (as they say in my part of the world).... For starters, if we do not take the anecdotal experiences of our selves and others then, at least, we don't have much to talk about. And what's the alternative? Is science really way ahead of our ears? Almost certainly yes. But is any practically-possible measurement that we can achieve way ahead of our ears? Quite probably not.
     
  7. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    Sorry about the hearing issues my freind natural but not great in this hobby.

    Not many people buy their 4 year old a 50k system with 100k speakers so they appreciate The teletubbies
    In DSD.
    I am new to the hobby relatively but as I am hitting 45 next year splashed out what I could afford as most do before my next audio upgrade is hearing aids...
    Now I spent my money, I do what the main audio market is...small spends to make what you have better by getting around the wife... Most can't save for 3 years and get the Amp Dac listed of the best list here.
    The BYBEE trap I call it, is.. its only $80 so why not.. then you hit ...yes it works because it does or it works because I think it does.
    Mr Bybee gets his money regardless.

    Me taking the connectors to the limits of what is reasonably practical is my small part in best practice verse Ad men hyperbole were $80 dollars here and there adds up to nothing but wasted time and money.
    Then the next issue can be picked up here by someone else and prove without the hype train driving it that it is worth the money...

    Intona and silver grease then it's back to finding good music....

    Keep smiling brother

    Dave
     
  8. drez

    drez Acquaintance

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    I found a couple of divices useful for cleaning contacts: Interdental brushes and cotton wrapped needle noise pliers.

    That ESD stuff is a concern - I have not always followed ESD safe practices but hopefully nothing damaged. I used to use wrist strap but these days the soldering iron is no longer on desk permanently so didnt use for last computer rebuild. Anyway hopefully nothing happened, I did not notice static nor discharge.

    I haven't tried the furutech liquid lately. I suspect it needs periodic replacement so might reserve for USB rather than necessitate constant maintenance across system. I presume deoxit would be less need for cleaning and reapplying.

    Yes there is problem to isolate effect of contacts. My system changes in sound substantially day to night. Also hot to cold. I mostly try to do what is "correct in principle" in the cases where listening comparisons are difficult.

    EDIT: I have tried the Furutech Nano liquid contact enhancer. The net result is apparently more efficient transmission of electrical energy - a richer more dynamic acoustic and more tonal colour. Low level details are less thin and grainy. can hear rrrrreally deep in the mix. Initial slight thickness is gone after a number of hours.

    EDIT2 spoke too soon on some things
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  9. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    Thank you Drez for taking the time. It's building up a general picture from the community. The pipe cleaners I got from EBAY are awful. You can't have fluff shedding when you clean your teeth...

    I risked the Silver Mapleshade Cilclear contact grease.
    The furutech stuff was a little pricey for my tastes but seems to be a little mix of DEOXIT gold and the CILCLEAR.

    I just got the INTONA I had to use another old printer cable to get it working x2. Yes I did deoxit the contacts...... Expensive but has improved sound depth... I'll give it time before reviewing.. Just wish the Silclear would turn up..

    Cheers for your tips and impressions much appreciated.
    Keep them coming..

    Dave
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2016
  10. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    Even if you do nothing throw in a post and say hi. It isn't all about tips or techniques but a general picture of the community's habits.

    Extreme- too I never thought about it before!

    What benefits one can benefit all and is it worth it. ...

    Keep smiling
    Dave :p
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2016
  11. drez

    drez Acquaintance

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    Apologies I spoke too soon. The initial thickness is now gone afterna number of hours, and what's left is just to be honest improvement across the board.

    I seem to recall that this contact enhancer behaves like this from previous applications. Very strange, but it works.
     
  12. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    Just got a 20" Wireworld CHROMA AB. Brand new factory fresh gold plated...
    For my intona usb (you need 2 only had an old printer cable...)
    I give it a once over while the wife's watching soaps... IPA then red deoxit...
    Not so factory fresh it as seems..
    Apart from residue black tarnish.. No way for me to see if it's made the slightest difference...but does highlight that new isn't really new just as it was after final production... Not perfect.. Amps Dacs connections are the same... cheap to make sure they are clean.. just a bit of effort...
     
    Last edited: Apr 23, 2016
  13. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    Need more people moaning or agreeing...
    It's turning into a SBAF blog....
    If I am lucky I might get an advertising gig on telly endorsing Make up, hairspray and deoxit...
    Bloody Cilclear still not turned up.... but just did the last madness experiment... and silver soldered the push fit wires from the Toroidal transformers all 15 crimps... A balls ache and I forgot to swap extensions to keep the earth. So when the soldering iron was turned on i shocked myself...:headbang:

    So much for my health and safety advice...
    At least the fuse tripped... Death or a broken OPPO HA1.. I prefer death..:piratemug:TBH... I'll see if it still works after..... My chinese food with the wife....:rolleyes:
     
  14. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    Thank god it worked.... I was going to use the training school at work to do this with a microscope , pro smt irons and ESD environment... Not the kitchen table and my old iron non temp with a large tip...

    Even sanded 2000 grit the pins...
    Silver solder flowed quite nice really, tinning the wire and crimp

    I'd already IPA + Deoxited I had to soak the heads in IPA before soldering and after fluxing.

    The other connectors are too small with my kit. A third of the power leads size...

    Sound....There is a bit more clarity and shimmer with the test tracks I use.
    Not worth getting an electric shock for..
    More Holographic sound stage on top of the INTONA /IF IPURIFIER 2.....

    I soldered the Earth crimp and retinned the tab with silver solder. A bit rough but went over it with 1500 Grit and a touch of gold Deoxit.

    Only one more test when the CILCLEAR silver comes. Dope the pins and earth screws. Nearest I can get to removing the plastic push fits and hard soldering the wires direct... Nice to push the OPPO to its potential without replacing parts..

    Just wish someone could hear it other than the 'clean that mess up ...wife'....She did say Why did you electrocute yourself with a straight face....

    So far so good...
     
  15. BioniclePhile

    BioniclePhile The Terminal Man - Friend

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    Sounds like you need to start DIYing some stuff from scratch rather than trying to make your Oppo better. I bet you'd have more fun making something yourself. :p
     
  16. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    It's ironic I work in Aerospace electronics. I work on PCBS worth £10,000. Units worth £100,000...
    But a multimeter is just a fancy set electronic chopsticks to me. Resistance is fighting the Borg and a trans-sistor is a cross dressing sibling....

    Diy Audio's Coris on the OPPO HA1 thread, the mods he is doing is fantastic. I could do them as I am a trained in soldering just name the parts and we're to fit...but it's his side line...

    There are diy projects and kits on there...

    I have changed my mind after soldering crimped wires on the transformers. It was worth the effort....

    You can't describe any kit really to many factors and personal views. In the end it's a general concensus of the positive, hype trains give that..
    Going on holiday excitement.... but it might be rubbish when You get there...

    This has been like finding an old Jaguar in a garage.

    1 it still works....
    2 A polish and shine it's looking good.
    3 A service and it's running great..
    4 After market Mods
    5 A tune up its running like a beast..

    The soldering worked or my hearing is getting better.....

    Just the Mapleshade Cilclear silver grease to try . The hard work is done just a touch of high octane fuel....

    Some superlatives and a lot of mixed metaphors.

    I am happy as Larry. .. and I didnt break anything.....

    The sound now is just out of this world every aspect of the sound reproduction...

    This can read across I am sure..
     
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2016
  17. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    Everything you do improves the sound. Doesn't that make you just a tiny, tiny bit suspicious?

    If I were you, I'd sign on with a psycho[-acoustic] analyst for a couple of years, and see how things feel after that...

    Or... yeah... DIY... You like tinkering and soldering. Can't argue with that!
     
  18. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    I was trying to disprove a guy in work,with the fancy power cable.. That didn't do anything I could really hear.

    The Wireworld usb AB, nothing again with that.. Went for it to see if the short usb 90ohm STD does anything.. A shame it was £25...

    I am going to town to prove one way if it does or doesn't... I get the amount of cash or effort employed could affect a balanced view and wanting it to be true.
    To be honest Thad E that could be true I can't see the woods for the trees...
    I do pride myself on being an honest guy with little ego. To me there is more emphasis were I could just make out detail or nothing before. That is with galvanic isolated usb INTONA.

    I still think anything not hard soldered together is a potential weak point in the chain. It doesn't make sense that the hardware is analysed to death. Cables/peripherals swapped and upgraded.
    But with habit and a guarantee you never touch internals.
    Earth plane, contact resistance, I don't know?
    If anything I've found along the way helps just one person that enough for me...

    I'd love someone with a real TOTL Yggdrasil A2 to see if there is a change.

    When the cilclear comes I will dope the pins in the chain and inside. Then that's it...
    No more experimenting..... I had the silver solder as a freebie. I have the stuff for an after market ether cable. Haven't figured out the pin out for a balanced 4 pin yet...

    I do think total cleaning and flowing the joints helped. Ultimately someone will have to try the internal deoxit or soldering...

    Cheers Thad for keeping me honest, I do appreciate it...

    Have a good week matey.

    Dave
     
  19. Thad E Ginathom

    Thad E Ginathom Friend

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    You take my interventions very well and in a very positive spirit! I've been made unwelcome on another forum for posting far less.

    It's just... as you'll gathered, I believe in applying even more critical thought to my own experiences than that of others. On that basis, I recommend the same to others.

    One may think of a hundred tweaks and modifications. What is the likelihood that all of them would have an effect and that all the effects would be positive. I reckon you'd be doing well to score 5%. And, if that 5% is seriously genuine, then all the rest was worth it just to achieve that.

    Patently, I'm not there: I cannot deny any of your results.
     
  20. Middy

    Middy Acquaintance

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    On here I've used my system as an example , with in essence some basic experimenting.
    Opinions of all types are welcome, just wish there are more of them from SBAF.
    It's a terrible hobby to gain insight into others opinions. I think most of us just hope for the best when new kit arrives, as we can rarely try before hand.
    So many variables it's almost impossible, as with cleaning I can only state what I know in my mind is true as honestly as I can.
    What I am trying may have little or no effect for others or impossible because of warranty issues. Cables and interconnects maybe....
    I hoped to get a wide range of practice and theory's and try them out.
    I will do the Cilclear and do the Wiki so if people want and the admin here like it... It's a basic starting point for others without spending a small fortune...

    I do appreciate your posts Thad, so thank you for coming along with this thread and adding to it.

    Cheers
    Dave
     

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