Pro audio power amps

If you ever buy a consumer amp, I feel like you'd like a D-Sonic amp with 1500W per channel
http://www.d-sonic.net/

 

very interesting looking amps. i would probably love to mess with those and give it the ultimate test-run if i had the money. be interesting testing other class d amps too since the crown xls 2500/2502 is only class d i ever used and kept around since i found it a very good amp itself. i probably would like the d-sonic amps. also i'm not always bout power. i got mainly into more power cause speakers found and were sold cheaply to me from my friend who manage to find a guy who had a full storage unit filled with old theater gear..the bass bins and subs are reason for big power. i used small re-built tube power amps that i loved a lot before for mains but due to pricing and maintenance i drifted off and strayed way from tubes recently.

 

The only audiophile/audiophool amp that powerful I know of is from Boulder, with a price that will melt your brain. If I ever get such inefficient speakers that I need that much power, I think these little amps would be the way to go.

 

I've actually got a Carver PM-1.5 sitting around. The fan is too noisy to use it in a home setting though. It does seem to punch above its weight class, or at least pushes up there without feeling strained. I didn't notice any type of grain to the sound; if anything it felt perhaps a touch too smooth.

There was a local guy selling some Amazing Platinums for a stupid good price a couple months ago (maybe 2/3 of typical). I was kinda tempted, but alas I hesitated and they were snatched up.

This thing has been sitting in the classifieds for a while which is intriguing...
http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649252780-8channel-hypex-ucd-uc180hxr-amplifier-amp/
There aren't that many 8-ch rack mountable amps out there.

 

i think the carver m1.5/2.0 and stuff were like older models and then switched over to pm600/750/950 or something right? i don't know really since i never dabbled into carver gear but, just reading up bout the pm series and tfm series there seem lot of hate for the bob carver guy it seems. i guess there is reasons. i don't know. i just know the tfm 24 i heard even though it's supposed to be like budget/cheaper end of carver gear was an excellent sounding amp that was not expected....

the pm600 had no fan. it was purely passive. i know some complained bout it but, it seem to do good. it could just be not being balanced hook-ups i didn't have it on and of course it could be starting to become out of spec and might need bias checked on it or something... i probably give it another try if he doesn't mind loaning it. we could probably swap amps for week to get idea on how it works on each other system...but, the 1.5's and 2.0's do seem interesting.

he plans on coming back soon too. i told him i drag out the larger altec horns and to see how he likes it.just it's a pain and takes good bit of time of re-arranging and setting-up. he always been interested in altec stuff since supposedly people kept telling him no klipsch...should check out altec when it comes to horns. he thought the little altec model 14's were super smooth but, i told him so before coming over lol.... maybe next weekend i go to his place to check the fuss about the carver amazings. i met two people who owned pair of carver amazing platinum and funny thing is, both are name bill haha..weird. must be trend secretly happening i don't know of...


that hypex looks interesting but, i wouldn't need an 8-channel amp unless was doing surround sound. i was thinking though at one point since i have so much crap, bout opening up own weekend type theater like my local library. have movie vote selections and admission be whatever feel like paying or something... maybe one day haha if i ever buy an old church,church or, warehouse to use as a house...

 

you could quad amp 2 speakers with 4 way crossover

 

hey, there you go! using your noggin. i never thought of that and passed my mind completely but, yea, that can be possible.

 

So been reading up a bit and reviews on the XLS drivecore 1002 say the fan doesn't even come on. Seems like a good choice looks and options wise, i like the x-over settings if i ever want to mess with a sub or tune down the low end. Only a bit more expensive then an XTI and with that one i have concerns about fan noise.

Will let you guys know how it goes, thanks for the help and advise

 

Nonsense, who has 4-way speakers these days? Clearly the better choice is a 2-way quadraphonic speaker set.

 

probably mean xli. xti is more pricier than the xls and require a computer or tablet with usb capabilities and windows to work the dsp in the band manager software. xti's too are only balanced xlr. no single ended connectors..


the xli i believe is psu temp controlled so on there the fan should only kick on when needed but, it being class a/b amp with linear supply the fan might kick on even at idle since it can get bit toasty sitting around...but, that's only from experience from older crown a/b amps... the xli using a torodial it might run tad cooler maybe. all crowns i had were iron core transformers which ran hot cause how frinkin huge they were for the power out that was needed so lot of that was dissipated as heat idling away.

i never used the first model of the xls series so can't say. i just know it has slightly less s/n compared to upper end models but, that's bout it. i have a xls 2502 which is top model and always loved it. originally got it for subs but, was surprised on how it sounded when i drove pair of large altecs off of i had at time. now it does full-range duty driving pair of altec 511b/808-8b strapped on top of jbl 4648 bass bins using pair of strapped jbl 3160 crossover boxes and sounds great.

i know some still poo-poo class d stuff but, i always found xls models great sounding amps. had 2500 and now 2502...only difference between the both is select-able sensitivity, led shut off, 12v trigger, added bandpass filter, and extended the low-pass filter down to 30hz on the drivecore series 2 besides the cooler xti like look to the design...

yea, it being class d it will run really cool. in normal situation fan will never run really. it only ever ran when i pushed hard 1ohm nominal sub loads and even then the spl was so high that was incapable of hearing anything. it can handle heavy loads not a problem.

 

Yeah i meant the XLI, those names got a little confusing at 2am after reading up about amps the whole night hehe.

I had some good experiences with class d amps as well, namely a Pioneer SC-2023 receiver that put out 7x190w without breaking a sweat, driving 87/88dB speakers. Right now i have these speakers http://www.xtz.se/en-old/products/speakers/99-25-MKII-Center converted to bookshelf by rotating the tweeter otherwise they're the same as the normal bookshelf version. They are about 88dB and won't dip below 4ohms i reckon that should be fine right? Noise floor wise. I will run balanced so that should lower the noise floor as well i think, unbalanced is 6dB lower afaik.

Also bought some nice stands, B&W STAV24 S2 with some blu-tack. Gonna be a good weekend if it all gets here on time

 

If they're 88db then even the xls 1002 will be quiet or so on very insensitive speakers.

I believe the pioneers used ice power modules which are known to do great but. Never used them myself. The xls is different beast and is a simple but, well design class d. It's all discrete except for the high priced texas instrument chip for the dsp front but, its set before the amp stage.

People will tell you it is digital and has non bypassable dac which is bs. It's all analog design and there is no dac built-in to the power amp. The texas instrument chip only programmed for the active dsp functions and temperature detection for the psu. It uses no digital to analog conversion. Just putting that out there just in case someone tries telling you that.

Yea, 4ohms is very easy load. It'll have no issues and run cool.

 

Thanks for confirming about the noise floor, but if it still ends up too much i will swap to a higher end model.

Hadn't even thought about the dsp tbh but makes sense that they wouldn't put in a double conversion.
Can't wait to hear how it handles the low end on the XTZ's. I think it's gonna be really tight with that Moffat bass from Yggdrasil. Right now it is a bit uncontrolled and boomy with my old poweramp and ghetto speaker stands. But tuning a speaker rig takes time. That's why i like having those dsp functions.

Yeah running cool is always a plus when it comes to placement.

 

@Rex Aeterna are you sure there is no ad/da conversion inside? I mean for the dsp to work there has to be right? I'm kinda worried that my Yggdrasil is made useless, it honestly sounds like I downgraded dac's with this amp. Sure low end is allot tighter but Yggdrasil multibit magic seems to be gone. It is quiet though, i only hear a bit of hiss with my ear pointed at the tweeter at 1foot or less. Fan is also quiet.

Edit: Crown support confirmed it, i might send it back. I hear a certain gritty crunchyness i associate with delta sigma dacs.

 

from far as i tell, no there shouldn't be. only when crossovers are active inside the amp or limiters are. it should shut off completely on stereo bypass/bridge/y-input...some of the crown support can be wonky sometimes. some claimed that the xls used built-in subsonic filters and even several crown employees but, at AVS guy actually went out and measured them flat down to 5hz before rolling-off. to this day some still believe that urban legend.

anyhoo, i never had much issues with the xls 2502 and never heard any of the grittiness/grain you mention. worked fine on me but, who knows. i never used a Yggdrasil before or any other form of dacs except some cd players and receivers with bur-brown and circus logic dacs besides my echo audiofire 2 which is some ak4020 chip and always preferred my echo. i just been using nad 1000s(euro model of the 106) preamp since only preamp i have now via xlr connectors and just my echo as main source.

 

Well the multibit schiit thing is something you have to hear to understand, it kinda spoiled delta sigma dac's for me. Anyways wheter it does conversion or not in the end it doesn't matter. The first thing that bothered me was the sound and that is also the most important.

Please understand i'm not mad, upset or anything really. Just a fun experiment, i can get a full refund so i'm nothing out of pocket

 

No its perfectly understandable and I get it. I just was saying it shouldn't unless dsp was active. That's all. There was problems with uninformed crown employees of the past even though crown products are top notch in reliability and performance from my experience but, that's what happens when have harman corporation over watch what crown does. Just was saying though. Never offended or offense taken at all. I don't know everything.

I use nothing but, altec horns and altec compression drivers and never used ribbons at home or on current stuff. One day I take my xls 2502 and interface to either my buddy to test out on his carver amazing platinums or my other friend and test it on his rebuilt magnepan mg3'a which are ribbon panels and see how it sounds.

 

Well i did go through the menu and i couldn't find any setting to disable the dsp so i just made sure there was no processing. Either way build quality seemed good, like i said it did everything well, support was quick too but just the most important thing was lacking in my setup. Maybe it was a synergy thing, room acoustics, placebo.. you name it.

But you do have a higher end model and perhaps there is more to this s/n roise ratio thing. It must come from somewhere perhaps they saved some pennies and it affects sound quality. I think i read a post stating that one the more expensive models the dsp is on it's own pcb.

But yeah try out some ribbon's, perhaps i can try out some horns some day

 

yea. the 2000/2002 and 2500/2502 was told to use better parts,more durable mosfets and, a more updated texas instrument chip inside for the dsp functions. i'll pop open my xls 2502 one day and look inside. i only opened it open when i bought it cause i always like open cell screen filters in my amps that use fans but, never bothered giving it a good overlook. the xls is lacking a filter and of course my xti 4002 did so i use some cheap 50 cent thin black open cell air conditioner filters you get in a giant pack at wal-mart and cut some pieces to place inside. it helps keep out hair,dust and, other crap from getting inside..

i can't say since i never used the speakers,set-up or room before so can't say. i defiantly will someday especially since i know people with them now and they swear by them but, my one friend was floored by the model 14's and their smoothness and i used his amps on them. now he's trying find a pair lol but, complaining they're insanely hard to find and extremely expensive cause value on them keeps going up and complains about the damn japanese buying all the stuff up lol.

horns is love/hate thing. to be honest i always despised and hated horns and favored silk domes over anything. some reason i went to friends to check out pair of altecs cause always been curious on them when was younger and first hi-fi of the holy grail i heard people talk about besides some jbl's i heard of so, i had to see the hype. i was floored by the midrange smoothness of the 511b/808-8b combo he had and i bought it on the spot lol. was even better when got it home. large altec horns and their drivers are what i choose as an exception so far and broke my prejudice of horns. the large baby cheek bi-radial horns that are naturally strapped on top of jbl 4648 bins are not so bad either. i have some EV hr9040's sitting around too but, haven't got round using them but, supposedly they're don keele's known best design and what made jbl what they are nowadays with their everest and k2 series. horns are a weird and difficult thing to get into cause lot weren't well design and lot people just throw stuff together and don't know how to implement correctly especially proper throat angling and proper crossovers.

 

Cool will be interesting to see what you find in your unit. Yeah those filters are a good idea, i never use a pc without filters anymore, way less hassle cleaning. Especially if you have pets.

Interesting take on horns, i wish had the room and funds to try a pair. Or know someone who has a good setup with horns but alas... Maybe some day

Having never heard them i have no reference point, those Japanse seem to know what's up though hehe.