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Schiit Magnius Headphone Amp

Discussion in 'Headphone Amplifiers and Combo (DAC/Amp) Units' started by Vtory, Aug 11, 2020.

Page 5 of 11
  1. shuto

    shuto Acquaintance

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    If anyone is able to compare this to the Drop Cavalli Liquid Carbon X, it would be much appreciated. (I believe someone else also requested this.)
     
    shuto, Aug 13, 2020
    #81
  2. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Different, not better.

    I can't seem to find my THX amp, I think I have given it away. Otherwise would have done a blind test. I may be able to do one with Heresy which I swear sounds different, despite both amps being at the top of the game in terms of measurements (the Magnius from XLR outs). I don't have time to wire up a fancy 4-pin XLR-1/4" phono switcher, so tests would only be level-match single-blind not my preferred double-blind.

    Will proceed with steady state sine measurements, but at more reasonable voltage levels, that is 0.550Vrms and lower.
     
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #82
  3. wadec22

    wadec22 Almost "Made"

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    it's an interesting comparison. you get the nicer RK27 and lose the 3rd gain option and 3.5mm jack. you save some $ but barring sound differences, use-case is going to make all the difference. I would be surprised if folks would want to move from THX to this. I could definitely see people buying this instead of the THX if they hand't already purchased.
     
    wadec22, Aug 13, 2020
    #83
  4. androxylo

    androxylo Acquaintance

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    Good stuff! Now I know you will eventually try it with speaker amp with Modius balanced -> Magnius -> Amp instead of your Goldpot. I'll be patiently waiting... thanks!
     
    androxylo, Aug 13, 2020
    #84
  5. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    That's what I started with when I made the error of assuming that the 5 second mute relay applied to the preamp outputs and left my speakers on when powering the Magnius up for the first time (don't do that, as it results in a loud thump).

    I prefer the sound of the Modius through the Goldpoint vs. through the Magnius. The Magnius does seem to tighten up a bit of the soundstage diffusion that I hear inherent in the Modius, but it also makes it more crispy sounding and the mids are less natural in feel.

    It's very minor and doesn't color the sound much, but the Goldpoint colors the sound even less (to the point that I can't hear the coloration).

    I was hoping to use the Magnius primarily as my IEM amp if I'm honest. I like using them from time to time for the isolation I get from the family while working from home (or coworkers while working from work), and I want something that's great with them. The Modius+Magnius combo is good, but not great with my in-ears. They're already just a tiny bit grainy in presentation and that that weakness is exaggerated with the pair.

    There are a couple of things that might hold me back from sticking with the Magnius even if I settle in with the overall sound: Most of my listening is via speakers, and the Magnius just complicates my setup needs for this purpose since I have the Goldpoint as an outstanding passive volume control. I also don't like having to turn off my speakers if I'm going to listen with headphones--I'd have preferred a preamp mute switch or something along those lines. The final bit here is just me being lazy, but I just know I'm going to experience periodic loud thumps because I'll forget to power this up before my speakers many times.

    The short version of my current impressions of the Magnius: Impressive for the price, a little lukewarm to my taste and current needs.
     
    Luckbad, Aug 13, 2020
    #85
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    330-ohm load measurements, balanced output. Low gain.
    Note results maybe different from other analyzers: AverLAB siggen isn't as clean as AP-555.

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -3dBu (0.548Vrms) into 330-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_11-56-54.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -10dBu into 330-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-2-1.png


    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -20dBu into 330-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-3-0.png
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #86
  7. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    30-ohm load measurements, balanced output. Low gain.

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -3dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-10-10.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -10dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-7-53.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -20dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-6-52.png
     
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #87
  8. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    330-ohm load measurements, balanced output. High gain.

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. High gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -3dBu into 330-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-13-11.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. High gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -10dBu into 330-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-18-55.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. High gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -20dBu into 330-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_13-59-35.png

    30-ohm load measurements, balanced output. High gain.

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. High gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -3dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_14-0-50.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. High gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -10dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_13-57-26.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Balanced output. High gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -20dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_13-58-20.png

    High gain has higher distortion than lower gain. It's typically the reverse. This was something particular I noted in the Schiit provided AP-555 measurements. Could this (the addition of pleasant second harmonics in a triode like pattern) be the reason why I preferred lower gain? Although this distortion in theory is not audible, can they point to behaviors in the transient response which current measurement methods do not cover?

    I also felt that the the lower gain had more expansive soundstage (not too sure*, need more listening time, but again this is typically opposite from experience). I know that @dBel84 had a Nelson Pass doodad which intentionally added even harmonics, and not just that, even harmonics at opposite phase, and that this supposedly this would affect what we heard in terms of soundstage (more open, more expansive). We don't know what the phase of the distortion here - that would be another topic worth exploration- but not now.

    Or maybe I dislike the sound of the TPA6120, and that lower gain (more global feedback) is taking more of the TPA6120's characteristics out of the equation. (Just guessing since I am not sure of the exact circuit topology).

    There is a lot we don't know about how measurements work and how they correlate to what we hear. Simple steady state sine waves seem rather limited.

    *"Soundstage" was assessed with headphones, hence we are really talking about "headstage". I'll plug in monitors to get a proper soundstage and report back.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #88
  9. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    This is the use case for IEMs, running single-ended output and low gain (x0.5). The -3dBu was included for the heck of it, just in case there are some DD IEMs which have extremely poor sensitivity. Some of the more super sensitive BA type IEMs would likely explode. Note that I've added a -30dBu (0.234Vrms) measurement for the IEM use case.

    30-ohm     load measurements, unbalanced / single-ended output. Low gain.

    Schiit Magnius
    Single-ended output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -3dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-55-4.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Single-ended output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -10dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-52-43.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Single-ended output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -20dBu into 30-ohm load
    upload_2020-8-13_12-54-5.png

    Schiit Magnius
    Single-ended output. Low gain.
    1kHz steady state sine at -30dBu into 30-ohm load upload_2020-8-13_13-0-15.png
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #89
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Approximate gains (output and gain setting)
    upload_2020-8-13_13-11-10.png
     
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #90
  11. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    This would be the best place to put deals: https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/the-deals-thread.87/page-129#post-313638. There are no hard rules, it's all context. Rules are meant to be broken when it's appropriate.

    However, I was on a roll and now I felt somebody put a stick in my wheel. :p
    [​IMG]
     
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #91
  12. shuto

    shuto Acquaintance

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    Sorry!
     
    shuto, Aug 13, 2020
    #92
  13. Raimei Templar

    Raimei Templar Friend

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    Thanks for your work and impressions! Is your preference for low gain true for both the se and balanced outputs? Curious if that makes a difference.
     
    Raimei Templar, Aug 13, 2020
    #93
  14. Poleepkwa

    Poleepkwa Friend

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    I was hoping that you would have the 789 for a blind test and comparison with Magnius, but I am sure someone else will get on it sooner than later.
     
    Poleepkwa, Aug 13, 2020
    #94
  15. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I either forgot to upload or accidentally deleted the 30-ohm low-gain tests for balanced output. There are up now.

    Let me check the measurements to see which has has more distortion so I can pick that one as my preferred. All kidding aside, I prefer low gain on both SE and balanced outputs. There isn't a big difference in how the outputs sound. While I can say with sighted tests that I think the balanced sounds a little bit cleaner, I wouldn't bet any money on a blind test. Their presentation in tone, timbre, transients, are the same.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #95
  16. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    As mentioned earlier, no one sees a need for THX 789 owners to jump ship, particularly if they are satisfied. And even if they are not satisfied, I would advise EQ, tweaks, a different DAC, different headphones as well because this is just sidegrading. SBAF used to have a phrase "mid-fi purgatory" (cycle of endless sidegrades). Thus I cannot encourage "entry-level purgatory".
     
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #96
  17. Luckbad

    Luckbad Traded in a unicorn for a Corolla

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    What was I hoping for? A clean amp for my IEMs that doesn't commit many sins, is enjoyable to listen to, and is overall fairly smooth. Oh, and something that punches above its price.

    Unfortunately, the Magnius does not meet those needs. It doesn't really punch above its price point in terms of how good it sounds (whereas the Modius does in my estimation). I suppose if you consider the Drop THX AAA 789 its direct competition, then it is a better value.

    The overall sound is a little too crispy for me. Edges are a little hard, mids are perceived as a little recessed. I find myself turning the volume down when listening to it because it can get fatiguing for me, and in fact caused a pretty nasty headache both last night and this morning (even though I listen at <80dB most of the time).

    It sounds slightly worse than the Modius by itself going to my monitors and is not great with my IEMs (exaggerates their faults). I prefer tubes with my HD650s as well, so there's basically no advantage to this over even the RME Babyface Pro FS strictly for IEM listening.

    I don't want to poop on any parades or say that the Magnius is bad by any means, but it does not have good synergy with my system and would needlessly add complexity to my setup.
     
    Luckbad, Aug 13, 2020
    #97
  18. econaut

    econaut Almost "Made"

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    Any thoughts on Magnius vs. Jot?
     
    econaut, Aug 13, 2020
    #98
  19. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Jot in a heartbeat. It's aged, and complaints about the lack of headstage depth are valid, but Jotunheim; early and later versions are way more involving and measure on par with THX 789 in terms of distortion and just a bit worse in noise.

    Was hoping that Magnius would be a Jot killer, but it's not.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2020
    purr1n, Aug 13, 2020
    #99
  20. Raimei Templar

    Raimei Templar Friend

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    I think the most intriguing comparison would be with the Geshelli Erish as that is the other exciting 200 dollar balanced ss amp. Magnius definitely has a better volume pot though.
     
    Raimei Templar, Aug 13, 2020
    #100
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