Sony MDR-Z1R Measurements Based Review

Discussion in 'Headphone Measurements' started by purr1n, Feb 14, 2017.

  1. pedalhead

    pedalhead Friend

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    Good to see I wasn't crazy when I heard distorted bass on the Z1R I had for a week. It's not always noticeable but, for example, on Fiona Apple's "To Your Love" (a muddy/tight bass test for me) it was very obvious and distracting. I could totally see someone enjoying these with plenty of music and never noticing it though.
     
  2. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Yeah, the drivers are similar but not the same as the Z7 or MA900, or at least so I thought when I tried them at RMAF and saw the parts display.

    I remember the sound at RMAF being bassy, but tasteful and not necessarily ultra-clean, with decent mids, and simultaneously dark and sparkly/edgy treble. It did not have the upper-midrange forwardness I heard from the Elear, nor was it quite as in-your-face and rough sounding. The Z1R sounded more refined to me somehow despite its issues. Certainly beautiful, very comfortable, and a tastefully fun sound, but one I'd hesitate to pay tons of money for.
     
  3. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    I'm on board here. The z1r is improved over the z7 in materials and sonic abilities, but it's still got a similar/house sound. It doesn't sound anything close to neutral, it's a colored and warm headphone. Ultra smooth and bass elevated if that's your thing. I don't see it being worth more than about $600, at least that would be what I'd be comfortable paying for it.
     
  4. WNovizar

    WNovizar Facebook Friend

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    Like I said before, Z1R is pretty much refined Z7, i.e more of Z7 strengths, with reduced Z7 weaknesses. Just right of my alley. I don't want to have this headphone at first, and planned to buy Eikon instead. But a pretty good deal seduced me (better deal than what you get from Amazon.co.uk), and have been my on the go headphones for pretty much everything, except EDM.
     
  5. Huhnkopf

    Huhnkopf Friend

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  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I'm rather a Sony fanboy myself, but that is 120% marketing bullshit.
     
  7. WNovizar

    WNovizar Facebook Friend

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    Please explain.
     
  8. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophileâ„¢

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    Not very surprising. Most of this kind documents (I mean.. not only Sony) generally explain difference, but hardly support refinement or improvement (neither well proven approach nor assuring measurements). Think that not every mod has positive effects. Some are even pseudo-science (see most high end cable manufactures). Big companies will never lie objectively (I assume so), but they can legally mislead readers subjectively.

    But I like some fancy marketing statements. In this respect, I like Sony's technical notes (I regard it as "marketing" notes tho)
     
  9. ButtUglyJeff

    ButtUglyJeff Stunningly beautiful IRL

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    @Marvey,

    Did you by chance try the Z1R with a Jotunheim? The Z7 was improved greatly in some areas, but the resonance in the cups were either more noticeable or amplified. If the Z1R doesn't have that issue, the pairing might be a treat...
     
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    I tried it out of the Jotunheim (but greatly preferred it from my custom 45 SET). No odd cup resonance reverb like on Z7. There is a subtle cup cavity reverb which reminds me of Z7, but it's muted and tastefully, likely purposefully done. Internal reflections are well controlled. In other words, I don't have an unhealthy urge to take the Z1R apart, and apply Dynamat and wool stuffing like I did on the Z7.

    Internal cup reflections can often be seen in CSD plots between 500Hz and 2000Hz after the 1ms point. We can see how the internal reflections of the Z1R are almost like that of an open headphone with earpads of minimal footprint.
    z7 internal cup reflections.png
    z1r internal cup reflections.png
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2017
  11. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    1. It's "technical note" based on an interview with the Sony Z1R dude, written by a blogger who doesn't seem very technical. I'm not even sure if the Sony dude is even that technical. These Sony corporate guys have fallen apart when asked detailed technical questions, like when the Z100 or ZX2 dude said replied "output impedance does not matter" when asked about it. These Sony guys talking about the product aren't the actual engineers. They are high-level corporate product management / professional bullshitters.
    2. Blah blah on neodymium magnets, special furnaces, Japanese dwarfs inside Mt. Fuji with hammers and anvils sintering the magnets into proper alignment for stronger strength. Sorry, neodymium magnets have been around for a while, and the if the magnet was truly that strong (or motor built properly), then we wouldn't see that oddball super high third order distortion in the bass. I wouldn't be surprised if this distortion is from the magnetic force in the motor being uneven while the VC travels along it.
    3. Blah blah blah on magnesium alloys, ringing, etc. Sorry, I've been using magnesium alloy drivers for a while, like the Seas W15CH. Also, why talk about speshal exotic materials and controlling ringing and energy dissipation when there is a massive 10kHz spike? LOL.
    4. The earcup / acoustic filter thing was interesting and legit though.
    5. 120K extension. f**k you Sony. Not even electrostatics have this kind of bandwidth. Also, DSD, Sony's hires format, specifies the implementation of a low pass filter to filter out everything past 30-50kHz (because it's all junk and noise inherent to DSD). Even if it's true, what's the point? May as well talk about penis length and bandwidth.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2017
  12. Bill-P

    Bill-P Level 42 Mad Wizard

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    That part about aluminum-coated LCP versus biocellulose cracked me up.

    It read like "yeah, they wanted to do it, but then they'd have had to pay extra to coughFostexcough, so the corporate said FUK DAT and told the engineers to come up with something else, hence all this mumble jumble"

    Fact #1: coating any diaphragm with anything, even pixie dusts, will increase its thickness and mass, not to mention you'll run into uniformity issues. All of which are unfavorable if you've been following the high-end headphone saga (refer to HiFiMAN's obsession with nanometer diaphragms)

    Fact #2: due to fact #1, I think aluminum-coated LCP is inferior to biocellulose in practice, and as such, this thing is definitely not better than R10. Equal, maybe, but I think R10 owners won't like Z1R, especially if Z1R has that FR.

    With that said, though, seems like they have invested a bit more time in fixing the oddities of Z7, which is a welcome improvement. Maybe they'll get it right with the Z1A Mk.II. :)
     
  13. Serious

    Serious Inquisitive Frequency Response Plot

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    Coating something will make it thicker and thus stiffer, but also less efficient. Sometimes the change in efficiency is significant, sometimes it hardly makes a difference. It really depends on how you do it and what you do.
    The other thing I've been thinking about lately is that hard diaphragms, like the metal diaphragms in the Elear and Utopia are pretty much impermeable, while I'm pretty sure that something like biocellulose and thin paper will let some sound through. This may not be good when trying to build a BLH with a widebander (which all necessarily have very thin paper diaphragms), but I think it's a good thing for headphones. This is especially true when the driver is 70mm and basically covers your entire ear.
     
  14. gandhisfist

    gandhisfist Aurorus Audio - MoT

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    I had a chance to hear the Z1R and compare them to the R10 and the Eikon at the Philadelphia Meet a couple weeks ago. Was able to compare it out of the EC Balancing Act hooked up to a Yggdrasil.

    I thought the headphone just lacked dynamics and sounded very flat, nothing had impact except the bass, where impact felt almost forced and seemed mostly to be a symptom of the exaggeration in the response. I also thought that the bass had really strange and very consistent imaging with the Z1R when switching between songs. Bass always sounded like it was coming from front center, but further back. I definitely heard the 3k peak with claps that sounded overly sharp and present. Also thought the Z1R had an overall distant quality to the sound. In some ways I think they achieved a Stax-like sound with the Z1R with the lack of impact and texture compared to the R10 or the EIkon.
     
  15. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Yup, the dynamics seem restrained. Running the headphone in another 24 hours so see if there's any difference. Sometimes the domes / surrounds need to be worn in a little bit.
     
  16. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophileâ„¢

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    Wow, those two are the headphones I really want to compare with my eikon! Envy you:cool:
     
  17. ButtUglyJeff

    ButtUglyJeff Stunningly beautiful IRL

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    Is there a gap between the ear cup and ear pad like on the Z7? Maybe a filler piece of foam in between?
     
  18. WNovizar

    WNovizar Facebook Friend

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    Thanks for your explanation.
     
  19. mypasswordis

    mypasswordis New

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    Not sure if this has been mentioned before, but could you check if the holes at the tops of the cups are bass reflex ports? If they are, it could be a quick way to tune the bass and decrease bass distortion as well.
     
  20. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Yup. Ports at the top. I will try some tuning.
     

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