Star Wars: The Force Awakens [SPOILERS ABOUND]

Discussion in 'Random Thoughts' started by mtoc, Dec 20, 2015.

  1. lm4der

    lm4der A very good sport - Friend

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    As a movie/film fanatic, I have a stupid motto: "You haven't seen the movie if you haven't seen it twice". This is important because often we go into a movie with preconceived notions about what to expect and what we think we are getting. Thus on first viewing, we often judge our experience of the film with colored lenses. Once you know what the film is trying to do, the type of ride that the film is actually trying to take you on, you can rewatch the movie and judge it based on its own goals/merits, instead of what you thought the movie was going to be.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2016
  2. mtoc

    mtoc SBAF's Resident Shit-Stirrer

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    Actually almost all directors have to watch their own films more than 20 times during the prodution.
     
  3. Za Warudo

    Za Warudo Acquaintance

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  4. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    Haven't seen it. But you do have Slaughterhouse-Five which seems somewhat similarish in some ways based on the summaries (read Slaughterhouse-Five a few months ago):

    [​IMG]

    The book is from 1969 though. La Jetée is older and perhaps more focused. Slaughterhouse-Five is a bit complex and perhaps also not easy to digest. But I would love to see this kind of more thought into making a sci-fi movie.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2016
  5. Colgin

    Colgin Friend

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    "La Jetee" is pretty awesome. Have seen it many times, but not in recent years. I also really like the La Jetee-inspired "12 Monkeys".
     
  6. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    TFA should have been a gangsta-funk musical. The the scene where Kylo wrecked the machinery around him, Kylo could have broken out into a soliloquy "Ain't No Fun".

    Finn should have been portrayed by Eminem. After the slaughter of the villagers: "f**k this shit. That's fucked up man."
     
  7. AustinValentine

    AustinValentine Friend

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    If it can work for Hamilton, it can totally work for Star Wars >.> <.< >.>

     
  8. Chris F

    Chris F Boyz 4 Now Fanatic - Friend

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    I love Star Wars but overall am a bit meh over the whole thing

    The bad:
    - the plot was predictable to the point of being nothing more then a caricature of scenes from the first three - this effectively renders the movie to "meh" level because there is nothing new
    - the Han/Leia/Kylo thing was garbage - no development, awful acting (mostly Fisher), just plan bad

    The good:
    - Costumes, action scenes, world design all epic - they should have shot the whole damn movie in IMAX cause that one scene was amazeballs
    - Soundtrack was awesome, John Williams is the man

    Anyhow, I see what they were going for and I think they succeeded but my patience for re-worked scenes from the originals is all up. They really need to bring something original in the next one.

    I'm gonna go out by leaving this here:


    You can see where Williams drew a little inspiration and the sound quality is epic. :) (about 100K for that analog rig at current market prices)
     
  9. imackler

    imackler Key Lime Pie Infected Aberdeen Wings Spy

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    So...did anyone know that the director Juassic World, that pile of dinosaur excrement, is supposed to direct Episode IX? I know they like making money...but that movie was so, so bad.
     
  10. subjectivelysuperior

    subjectivelysuperior New

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    http://www.geekwire.com/2015/photos-inside-one-of-the-worlds-most-advanced-imax-movie-theaters/

    I've yet to watch Star Wars for the second time, because one must watch movies twice to catch more things, but that's where it'll be ^. Most likely this week. 2x 4K projectors and six 600-pound speakers and eight more “effects” speakers. Intros to any movie includes a space launch and man it sounds like you're right there in Florida watching on of the Apollo missions go up.

    Back to Star Wars. Sad to hear the director of the next one is going to be another money churner guy.
     
  11. AustinValentine

    AustinValentine Friend

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    Will this result in a scene with John Boyega riding a speeder on the Forest Moon of Endor accompanied by three Ewoks each mounted on a Nexu?
     
  12. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Watched Empire Strikes Back with the kids last night. Gotta hand it to Director Irvin Kershner. He did a such a great job directing and holding together a cast of shitty actors and bad lines. The Darth Vader clenches fist thing in his appeal to Luke to join him is awesome. My daughter fell asleep (again), but my son loved it and wanted more!

    One question or comment, and I assume this was done partially in humor. When Leia, Luke, and Lando hyperspace away from the Super Star Destroyer at the end of the movie, you can sense through Vader's helmet that is is royally pissed off. Vader turns around (cut shot to a nervous Piett's face - Piett thinking he might be Force strangled too like Needa before him); but instead Vader simply walks past him. A little bit humorous... that Vader was sooo pissed off this time that he didn't even want to bother Force strangling anyone.

    I guess the question is why didn't Vader Force strangle Piett? I would love to hear your guys' thoughts.

    P.S. The idea of that Super Star Destroyer is awesome. Better than the Death Star. It deserved a better fate than kamekaze A-Wing dude crashing into the bridge.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2016
  13. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    Possible Vader was pissed off, but he seemed to me troubled and conflicted in that scene.

    He obsessed about getting to his son personally and make him an offer. An offer that needed consideration and time.

    It is obvous that in the end there is a change in Lukes attitude towards Vader, and the other way around. It is clear that Vader would prefer Luke by his side, than continue being Palpatine's bitch. It was to be expected. Unavoidably this also produces an possible avenue for Vader to reconsider his position. Vader seems to become proud of his son, and starts to value him to a point that his egocentric quest for power looses ground inside of him. A dark lord should have one priority, and that priority should be himself. There is no room for someone else there.

    I would imagine that just as Luke goes into a "WTF do I do now" state, so does Vader. And this IMO, along with Piett's getting out of Vader's way in a bad time (unlike Admiral Ozzel and Capt. Needa) saves his ass for the time being. In a non-conflicting state, I would have expected Piett to be executed on the spot w/o Vader even bothering to look at him on his way to his quarters.

    To me, Piett's survivial at that moment seems to emphazise that a change is indeed happening in Vader. A change that Luke seems to have detected and wishes to exploit.

    The plot is not perfect. But it's not that bad IMO.

    As far as super start destroyers, the imperial navy needed more of those and forget about "Death Stars" pipedreams.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2016
  14. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    That is an excellent analysis! Indeed Luke was in a "WTF do I do know" state. After being rescued, Luke was Force conversing with his dad.

    V:"Luke"
    L: "Father."
    V: "Son, come with me"

    (Luke disconnects the Force telephone)

    L: "WTF Ben? Why didn't you tell me? I mean WTF?"

    (Falcon closes up on SSD)

    L: "It's Vader"
    V: "Dammit Luke, stop hanging up. It's your destiny. You know it's true."

    (Luke disconnects the Force telephone again)

    L: "Dammit Ben? Why didn't you tell me? I mean WTF dude? That was a total dickbag move for you not to tell me."


    Back on the sub-topic, other arguments:
    1. Piett was actually competent. He got the Imperials to Cloud City before the Falcon; and he got his troops in place for Vader to execute his plan. Piett even had his people disable the Facon's hyperdrive, although it can be argued that they should have done a better job so R2 couldn't repair it.
    2. Vader's mission was complete (making contact with Luke). Whether Luke got away or not wasn't crucial, although it would have been preferable to have him captured.
     
  15. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Most improved member; A+

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    Worst part of the special edition is Vader has to phone the ship to bring his shuttle like a 14 year old at the mall calling his mom. Empire evokes emotion though visuals like movies should though. Peter Suschitzky shot it and there is no pew pew pew cartoon battles.

    Vader succeeded in turning Luke towards the Dark Side though. He didn't have to kill Piett as Piett didn't f**k up. Yoda tells the audience and Luke is in all black the beginning of Jedi walking around like a gangster threatening to kill everyone and then killing everyone. Yoda dies considering Luke another lost cause who is using the force for his own benefit. Luke goes to meet the Emperor to save his father by killing the Emperor. The only reason Leia is his sister is to give him a reason to attack Vader. It's still much better done than Lucas's "ANAKIN WAS ALWAYS A PSYCHOTIC MURDEREROUS (sic) LITTLE BITCH"

    The audience's attitude towards Vader changes when we see he is just some bald, scarred 50 something guy who has to sleep in a oxygen pod. The hologram scene with the Emperor shows who's really boss as the Emperor makes people kneel when on the videophone. Vader is just his number one thug after Tarkin kicked it.
     
  16. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Never thought about that, but Vader did push Luke toward the Dark Side didn't he? Makes sense with Luke wearing black in ROTJ.
     
  17. Colgin

    Colgin Friend

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    After seeing TFA (I liked it, go sue me), I bought the latest Blu-ray set for all 6 earlier films (could not figure out how to get the de-specialized editions downloaded and burned which is what I really want). Watched what I call "the original Star Wars" and TESB with my 6 1/2 year old. He has tons of Lego Star Wars sets and knows a lot of factoids from friends who have seen the movies/cartoons, but had not really absorbed it so it was still pretty new to him. He loved Star Wars but was really taken with TESB (although I did condition him a bit by saying it was the best film). Even though he had heard before that Luke was Vader's son (hard to keep that a secret this many years on), it hadn't really sunk in, and he was WTF (not those words though) for that reveal before recovering with "oh, I already knew that".

    Looking forward to re-watching ROTJ and less so re Episodes I-III (although I enjoyed II and III in theaters at the time).
     
  18. purr1n

    purr1n Desire for betterer is endless.

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    Thanks for sharing. Exact same situation here. My son learned about the "I am your Father" thing from Family Guy. He was super enthralled with TESB and is looking forward to ROTJ this weekend.
     
  19. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    I don't think Luke turned to the Dark Side. To me that would require Luke to consider his interests above anyone's and pursue them relentlessly. Yoda was just not giving too much of a shit. It happens when one grows old.

    A Dark Side Luke would have nuked Jabba w his sister, Han, Chewy, and Lando inside, and not give two shits. All this to take over Jabba's interests and carry on furthering his position. A Dark Side Luke would have secretly joined forces with Vader even before paying a visit to Jabba and somehow blame the loss of his "friends" to the Emperor, while Vader would have divided the Empire by going against Palpatine himself. Luke would then take command of the rebel forces and join forces with Vader to destroy the Emperor's remaining loyalist. Then joined Luke-Vader faction would eventually destroy the Emperor and indeed rule the galaxy as father and son... with the eventual outcome of Luke killing his own father at some point in time.

    TFA is not bad. But it lacks depth IMO.
     
  20. OJneg

    OJneg The Most Insufferable

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    In short, I get the sense that Vader is in a very different place after he discovers his son alive. I think the encounter with his son on Bespin is the first step towards Vader's eventual redemption.

    Looking at Vader's motivation it does change over the course of the trilogy. I'm not totally read up on all the EU lore that follows Vader's story in between Episodes 3 and 4, but I know it involved a lot of hunting Jedi stragglers and stomping any systems that opposed the Empire and other general maliciousness. Vader makes the transition between Dark Jedi and Sith (there's a big difference) during this period. But that doesn't really explain his motivation for why. (Outside of Anakin's new political and philosophical views that are lamely tacked on in Ep.3..."mah nu Galactic empire hehehehehe"). It's implied that Palpy is stringing Vader along with promises of power and the ability to bring back his loved ones. Vader believes if he learns all of Palpy's Sith witchcraft secrets, he can bring back the ones he loves (Padme, mother, all of the toddlers in Episode 1) and live in some Nexus shangri-la for the rest of eternity. So that at least sets Vader's motivation for the time being. He needs to be a good lapdog for Palpy in order to get what he wants (eventually).

    At the same time Vader is no fool and I'm sure he's familiar enough with the Rule of Two to know that his master does not have his best interest at heart. Vader is certainly powerful enough to overthrow Palpatine in the classic Sith fashion, but there's no end-game there. He's not cunning enough to rule an Empire and would probably have a Senate rebellion on his hands (unless he does some Saddam-esque purges like he always wanted, which would make ruling a vast empire of multicultural systems even more of a downward spiral). And even if he does succeed he's still all alone in the galaxy. I think learning that his son is alive gives Vader the window of opportunity he's been waiting for. Any shred of trust or loyalty that Vader might have had in his master is out the window. He's been holding a lie about something Anakin holds dear beyond all else. And now that his son exists he sees a new future for himself. One where his legacy can live on beyond him.

    So to (finally) address the point directly, I think it makes a lot of sense that Vader wouldn't strangle the CO at that point. If the writers made him do that it's like "hey old vader back to his shenanigans again!". That's what rage Vader does when he has nothing to live for and needs some outlet for his Sith rage. That's not our Vader anymore. Instead he looms off back to his regeneration chamber to brood on what has happen. The encounter with his son has changed Vader's plans like I said, but it's also changed his attitude. I think the encounter with his son has reminded Vader about Anakin of old, and therein made him doubt what he's doing. Subconsciously, part of him might even be relieved that his son could get away and that "light" still has a chance at victory.

    Anyway, that's my interpretation of the scene. I didn't even remember but it's a great example of well crafted story that lies underneath the surface. Which is why ESB will remain the best Star Wars movie until the series gets competent writing/directing again.
     

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