System Synergy - Special Sound

Awesome, thanks, that's useful. If these do better than entry-level 300Bs that's all I need to know

 

So I'm spending time with my kid's setup tonight. He's away so I get to enjoy his system. Hard to believe this is a budget system because these components bring much enjoyment and my head is definitely bobbing. The dac plays with the Piety exceedingly well and it feels like being in the space where the Stones are recording. Pretty much magical.

CDT to MHDT Paradisea+ to Magni Piety to JAR580 (black silk).

Friggin wonderful fluid sound for CHEAP! I bought this DAC for $200 and threw some new caps in it, amp was $150 and my man @Azimuth sold me the CD player for the cost of shipping essentially. Sennheisers ain't expensive so all in all this is an extremely enjoyable system for not much money at all.

 

Gotta get the younger generation hooked. You’re doing a better job than me. Glad to see that CD player get some use and well appreciated. It was well worth it to send it to you for him.

And before it left, I remember testing it with Piety drift out of the CD player and was quite enjoyable. TDA1541 chip in that CDP.

 

Total is $3,103.24.

Forgive the SPC cable, I returned it the day after I got it and re-terminated the actually-good stock Audeze cable with a Neutrik XLR connector, funny how much a cable can affect sound quality... Also, don't need the USB cable listed, that was just for testing the DAC in the LAuX, but did come in handy when my PiHAT—actually, the culprit was Volumio, no need to sully @Michael Kelly's stupendous achievement with his Pi2AES—stopped working suddenly. The A1 is a gorgeous-sounding DAC via BNC, not so much from what I suspect to be gen2 USB (the seller didn't know the USB receiver either, also I was so hot to trot in getting an A1, I definitely overpaid).

The Pi2AES just makes everything sound better—cleaner, more articulated, well-defined, forward, 3D, I could go on and on, but the delta between BNC from the Pi2 and raw USB, straight from the DAC was so massive, I honestly couldn't believe my ears, USB was flat, muddled, the bass so ill-defined it sounded actually one-note; the difference was like being at the actual recording session and listening via a pair of excellent studio monitors (BNC) to listening to FLACs or worse from a pair of headphones missing entire certain parts of the FR graph. Well-worth the relatively small investment.

Start this by saying I have not heard a lot of gear, so comparisons, even generally, are not my strong suit. This is mostly about the synergy and how the setup makes me feel. Chain is Pi2AES > [BNC] > Gungnir A1 > [XLR] > Liquid Gold X > [XLR] > LCD-X (to be RD-X'ed when the magician @rhythmdevils starts production).

I actually have him to thank for my entire chain, I heard his RD-X via the same exact chain at the Schiit Audio Show in Austin this summer. I lusted after every component, everything just works, the LAuX is so effortless and natural in its presentation that it feels like you're getting a good peek into your DAC rather than listening to a colored amp. I suspect this is why the internal AKM DAC is so distasteful to most people, the amp lets you see into the DAC, and that DAC, well, it does convert to digital, but that's about all I can say about it.

While it's a stellar amp for Audezes (link to the LAuX impressions thread to really hear about the synergy between the LCD-series and the Liquid Gold X), I think the Gungnir A1 is actually my favorite piece, it's the one I paid the most for, and although I wish I had waited, I would buy it again at the same price. It renders a warm, punchy, resolving sound that is at times, with the right tracks, sublime. The level of microdetail is nothing short of amazing, the way it renders the room/stage as well, is something that I never take for granted—its staging prowess is taut without being in any way one-dimensional, with a depth and fullness that almost allows you to feel the surroundings of the recording. It's an uncanny, almost spooky feeling.

The LCD-X speaks for itself both as a value proposition and an excellent example of a planar. I strongly dislike the "ethereal" sound of some planars, which the LCD-series has none of, but is just as fast and nimble, there's meat on its bones, rumble, and pinpoint imaging—it almost feels as if you're listening to music from the bottom-up, from the low end to the high, even without EQ, the LCD-X manages to impress with its smoothly layered presentation, richly-textured bass and lower midrange, and plucky thickness.

 

I thought I'd show off a system where the components have great aspects but serious flaws, and by working around the flaws there is tremendous synergy.



What you have above is:

- Walkman WM-ZX2. An astonishingly great sounding DAP whose flaw is an underpowered CPU and old OS making for an awkward interface.
- Benq Trevelo S. Mini electrostatic speaker with a mediocre internal DAC, narrow sweet-spot and limited volume.
- Laptop source with all the usual issues around interface to audio hardware.

Achieving Synergy:

- Bypass the WM-ZX2 interface by running a UPNP client "UPnPlay" so that it acts as a streamer / DAC into the Trevolo S
- Set the Trevolo S in the right environment - as a nearfield speaker pointed at the listener.
- Send FLAC or Tidal from the laptop to the WM-ZX2 over WiFi. In this case, using Audirvana.

Why Synergy?

The electrostat provides extraordinary detail for treble and upper mids. The ZX2 is an ideal source to provide that detail.

 

NOS - 300B - HD800-JAR delight


This system is providing an amazing journey through my ever expanding library.
My sincere gratitude to Jeff Zhu, Craig Uthus and Jupiter.
Also to Tim at Kitsune and all those responsible for Linlai Global E-300B.

 

@atomicbob do you use those Goldpoints typically or the volume control on the Studio B? (Or something else?) Have always meant to ask you when you post these photos.

 

I typically set all amps for unity gain, 0 dB. Then I use the Goldpoint stepped attenuators for level control. This allows me precise control over listening SPL. After using this system of volume control for such a long time it is easy for me to know fairly precisely the SPL at which I am listening.

 

Here are my thoughts. Note I tried this with the specific goal of determining if I needed to add this to my stable and if it would fit into my system for the most part as it stands.

I’m mostly a speaker person, and other than portable gear I don’t really have the desire for a lot of dedicated headphone gear (namely amps). I can run high impedance cans directly off my Thomas Mayer 10Y preamp, and both the VC and the Atrium work perfectly there.

First thing to highlight is I went back and forth all fall between the VC and the Atrium to try to identify if anything was “missing” that I might desire in a new headphone. I couldn’t frankly, and ended up buying another VC for my office as I think the VC is just better and suits my goals more closely. The HD800S also works well off the preamp, but I found I always reached for the VC so sold the HD800S. The staging and the timbre of the VC are outstanding for me, in my system, with my music, etc. Atrium has enjoyable slam, so that was the characteristic that I thought a planar might provide, as I used to love the HE-6/SE off of speaker amps.



I have a McIntosh speaker amp in my office with which I thought I might try the Caldera. But ultimately I didn’t as it was much more efficient than I expected. It works fine out of the Vali plus plus (my plus key isn’t working for some reason so just pretend), the iFi Gold, the iFI Go Blu, the HiBy RS6 and the “headphone” out on the McIntosh amp. I also tried it straight off the TM preamp, and though it’s not ideal, I didn’t really hear any rolloff in the lows or highs and it supplied plenty of juice to drive the headphones (1 watt max out of the preamp). So I think Caldera should appeal to those who like planars without having to resort to speaker amps.

With that background, I thought if the Caldera was distinctly superior to the VC or Atrium I’d consider a dedicated headphone amp for it. While I still might consider a Caldera at some point, for me in the end it didn’t distinguish itself enough from the VC or Atrium to rush to buy it, and the VC had more of what's important to me to prefer it.

Here’s how I heard it (in my system, with my preferences, with my music). This might be different than how others hear it but I took realtime notes to avoid blurring or forgetting the differences later. In particular I don’t agree at all that the Caldera has better technicalities than the VC, as some have suggested. Also note differences here are exaggerated to some extent to highlight differences.

· Caldera is brighter and has a slightly metallic/plasticky sound (The VC has a richer, fuller sound).

· I’m more conscious of wearing a headphone with Caldera (The VC – in my system – can completely disappear for me, which is a real accomplishment).

· Images are more specifically defined and there is more separation of instruments with VC. I preferred the VC’s staging.

· Timbre is just flat out better on VC; voices and instruments have more body and sound more fleshed out and closer to real. The Caldera is also very nice but voices sound a little more ethereal and less solid/real.

· The VC has a grander sound. The Caldera is also “big” sounding but not as big to me. Sounds from VC are a little more out of my head than Caldera (which again is a major accomplishment for a closed can).

· I was very impressed with Caldera’s efficiency. It worked out of everything, even RS6 and of course Gold Bar. No need to try it on a speaker amplifier (indeed might be risky) but I’m still curious how much it can scale.

I admit that about halfway through the loaner, I stopped listening to the Caldera out of fear I’d begin to like it more, and I’d be poorer adding both the can and a suitable amp for it. I’m curious what if anything might have changed from the original loaner I tried and the “production” version. In particular, I’m curious if the timbre is less plasticky sounding by comparison to the VC and Atrium as that was my only “complaint". I’ll probably wait for Caldera closed to try (as I also prefer the VC over the VO). Zach is in my opinion going about things the right way by having different technologies represented in his offerings and trying to maximize each of them so that customers have a choice to suit preferences and associated gear, while still maintaining a house sound.

 

4.5 months later and my system has dramatically changed. Went from an ortho-based setup to a fully electrodynamic setup. Not one component is the same (except for the pi2, that stays).

A huge thank you to @ext1, @tommytakis, @brencho, @Clear Water, @Inoculator, @dasman66, @Erroneous, & @Michael Kelly for making this all possible! Seriously, if not for SBAF, this amazing, synergistic rig would not be possible, full stop.



This chain comprises Pi2AES > [BJC AES cable] > SFD-1 mkII (stock) w '75 Voshkod Rocket 6922s > [custom Furutech OCC copper + KLE connectors RCA cables] > HLF-Sina-Tommy special ed. Crack (vtg Siemens caps, Muse ES cathode caps & Allen Bradley resistors) w Tung Sol 7236 & RCA Clear Top > JAR600B.

I can't even begin to say how much better it sounds than my previous setup. It's also cheaper, with each new item being less expensive than the last. I couldn't be happier right now.

The timbre is light yet rich, like good champagne, the textures I'm hearing are varied and gorgeously rendered, and the soundstage of the SFD-1 spookily increases the venue space of the Crack's more closed-in soundscape—it goes from being a small club to a concert hall.

And I get the PB&J analogy when it comes to Crack and HD6X0, it's a truly lovely pairing, which adds some bass slap and slam to the JAR600Bs, and magics up the already enchanting midrange of the expertly-modified black silk 600s.

This is definitely a old-school tone-based setup, meaning it has an anti-modern hifi sound, shooting instead for warmth, wetness and richness at the expense of some ultimate resolution or, much less, meaninglessly low distortion numbers.

Yet I still don't feel like I'm missing out on much with the SFD-1, which is no resolution monster, nor with the Crack, with great resolution being one of its well-known drawbacks, as both together contribute to an open, holographic, macro-y sound with excellent low-level detail retrieval and muscular bass weight.

The only way up from here that I can see that would keep the special synergy of this setup is a SFD-2 or SFD-2 mk II with a Zana Deux Super (but with the same incredible hp!).

I'm in love with the OTL tone and sound, so I could go Apex Teton too, but unless I find an insane deal on one, I think I'll most likely top out at a ZDS—I do love that vtg EC sound.

 

Great rig. A well-tweaked Crack (where upgraded parts are chosen with careful intention, not simply cause they're boutique) is an absolute champ. For the HD/JAR600, there's few, if any, other tube amps (SW51+ included) I'd take for it unless going TOTL. And even TOTL amps, it would only be EC's classics for me (EC BA/EC ZDS).

 

Which McIntosh speaker amp are you using?

And how do you run HPs off the Mayer preamp? From the RCAs?

Great post.

 

Not OP, but I was just reading about Mayer products yesterday, and the 10Y preamp in particular, looks like you just need an adapter, here's what Thomas says on his site (link is the same):

"The 10Y line preamp can perfectly drive high impedance headphones (300 Ohm or more) and is useable as a normal preamp at the same time. It works very well for example with the Sennheiser HD600 shown in the photo. This HP has an impedance of 300 Ohms. Existing 10Y line preamps can be used with headphones simply with a suitable adaptor. For new builds, headphone jacks can be added at the front and/or back of the unit."

 

Yes, I had him just add a headphone out on the back with the rest of the inputs/outputs. It works well with any high impedance headphone.

My McIntosh amp is really old (MC2505) but still sounds great. I have it on my bass bins at moment while I use my Mayer mono blocks on the upper horn.

 

Things have definitely escalated over the past three years but after quite a few months of buying and selling gear and headphones I've landed on what I have no complaints with and thoroughly enjoy no matter the genre or recording quality. I was going for a warmer/thicker sound that also had good resolution and extended (but forgiving and non-sibilant treble). Both Atrium Open and Verite Open deliver this in spades.

I won't share what tubes I'm using (although you can zoom) to try and keep prices down). Send me a PM if you are curious.

Here's the deal...

(EQUI=CORE 600) -> Roon Core on PC -> Holo Audio Red -> Coaxial SPDIF -> Schiit Yiggy OG A2 -> Single ended out to -> DNA Stratus v3 (specific combo of tubes, some NOS some NP) -> ZMF Verite Open (Be2 pads) or Atrium Open (Auteur Leather Perf pads).

One of the main changes that got me where I wanted to go was a change of 2a3 tubes (the LinLai Elite 2a3 were too lean and bright on Stratus v3, but perfect on the much warmer v2). I could then play with rectifiers and input tubes and easily tweak for a thicker more lush sound or a more ethereal, leaner and resolving sound with a ton of air. I'm somewhere in the middle now.

The 2nd most important change was moving from AES to Coax out of my streamer. No joke, any unatural sibilance or etch I was hearing with AES or Unison USB is entirely gone. Very enjoyable "analog" sound now.

It's taken many months to finally get to a place I could stay for a very, very long time. Pads, cables, tubes etc all make enough of a difference to kill the enjoyment or not. To me (maybe I'm insane) it takes a lot of trial and error and tweaking to get your preferred sound. It's not as simple as dropping big dollars on gear, switching it on and loving it.

There were many days I would blame the sound I was getting on the Stratus, and it always ended up being the streamer, wrong headphone pads or something else. So glad I never sold it and stuck in there.

Anyways, sorry for the long post. I just wanted to share a system I would finally be proud to bring to a meet knowing exactly what it sounds like, and would be very curious to hear what ya'll think! We are all so different in our preferences, but that's what makes chasing the dragon fun.

 

I didn't know what this thread was for when I made the other one.

This is as clean as it'll get:




I originally had a cavalli liquid lighting where the cd player is now, but a resistor in it erupted in a white flare in 2020 and I never bothered to get it fixed. As mid-fi as the cd player is compared to the rest of the setup, adding the ifi iPurifier2 spdif powered by an I power x really makes it something else, and that synergy with the Vega in exact clock mode and filter 1 (the default 4 is just less detailed, idk why they did that) got me more enthusiastic about this setup when I was mostly using the bedside one further down before. It galvanically isolates the signal, reclocks it with a femtoclock, and there's essentially no wire to the DAC.



I'm including my messass DDC on the floor with powered extension cables running to it from PC's at the other end of the room (I just switch which is plugged in) because it actually doesn't sound bad at all -- I actually want to say it's a little better than the cd player, but I've only briefly a/b'd. The douk audio u2 pro has krystek femtoclocks and its own ipower x. It disconnects itself from the USB power and ground lines with a relay when the aux power port is used, but I still just have the idefender+ there anyways. It does no harm.



I actually have no noise in this system apart from the jot 2's native noise floor.

The dbel84 modded lcd-3's are what I was last using, but I usually have zmf verite with verite pads plugged in instead, and it's a good pairing. I've known I like v-shaped headphones on the ECBA ever since I got my th900's.

Secondary bedside setup:



The burson conductor is a good single-ended DAC when you feed it with a quality DDC (I have one beneath this in a mess I won't even show). It has separate linear psu's for its digital and analog stages and the line output is class a. It has no audible noise floor unless the ddc is connected via coaxial, so the issue is in that unit, but it's so minor I haven't tried to fix it -- only audible on grado's with the conductor's volume maxed. I usually use Grado rs1x's or fostex th900's here. The conductor's headphone amp is higher performance than the sw51+'s in some regards, but the signature isn't nearly as enjoyable.

I can say with fair certainty that the powered USB extention cables I have going from both pc's to both setups don't harm anything because the vega on exact mode skips with any significant jitter, and it never does so when that ddc is used. I can record games with OBS on the same PC I'm listening wirh the vega on.

 

The pic with the audeze's just didn't represent the synergy I actually enjoy -- I was just reminding myself how well the amp could handle planars.

I've had the pictured combo for a long time now, with the zmf verite w/verite pads being like a higher res version I'm just not using atm, and it's the synergy that originally made me stop caring about stats and orthos -- I used to be chasing an ideal sr009 setup before I bought the fostex th900's on a whim. The ECBA with these tubes (KR Px4's and a tung sol round-plate -- other nos 6SN7 tubes that are as dynamic sound drier to me) perfectly compliment what I've seen purrin call "Japanese sound" before -- seeing purrin call the zmf verite Japanese sound is why I decided to buy those back in 2020.

The recessed mids of the v-shaped sound just become part of the soundstaging and don't come off as recessed at all. They're just *there*, like everything else.

I'm sure the Vega isn't the greatest staging DAC ever, but it gets pretty competent in that regard with the settings optimized and the clock respected. I say this because I ran it with much worse input devices for years, and that's when I was less enthusiastic about it compared to the convenient bedside setup, but getting it to where the DAC never leaves exact clock precision, and the clocks of all the input devices are of similar grade to its own or better, constituted a solid DAC upgrade. I always bring up the exact clock mode because it makes the Vega the most jitter-intolerant while simultaneously high-performance DAC that probably exists in the consumer market. The benefit is that it sounds "more analog" for the fact that the DAC is omitting extra steps before the analog stage it would normally perform.

 

How are the two separate DACs being utilized in atomicbob's system? Just curious.

 

Level matched A/B comparison

 

Rock-n-Roll! 'nuff said: