Verum Audio - Exciting high performance DIY planar

Discussion in 'Headphone Measurements' started by cskippy, May 24, 2018.

  1. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    @Lyer25 - for the next project I'll definitely do so. I already realized my mistake but i can be corrected only during next project.
     
  2. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    Spare channel can be used as a microphone :D (no jokes! btw)
     
  3. Lyander

    Lyander Official SBAF Equitable Empathizer

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    Lol! Yeah, microphones and headphones are basically mirror images of one another in the way sound travels though (gross oversimplification). I remember someone here showed off how headphones could be used as mics— was that the Verums? Can't remember.

    And gotcha, yeah, might be too late in the game now. But this is your first venture I think, so slip-ups will happen. What's important is that you're prepared for the next time around (please screen your social media handlers ;)).
     
  4. Dzerh

    Dzerh Friend

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    Verum Audio definitely needs improvement in communication with customers, especially in order progress tracking area.
     
  5. Armaegis

    Armaegis Friend

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    I would be very interested to see what you can cook up with that.

    I remember Audeze announced a funky mic a couple years ago, but I don't know if it ever made it into production.
    All the old webpages down down. These are the only things I could find:
    https://www.facebook.com/audioNEXT/posts/audeze-planar-magnetic-microphone/906204316101939/
    https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...e_tetrahedral_planar_magnetic_microphone.html

    I found a random reference that said this video was using an Audeze mic:
    You can see it right around 1:43. Looks pretty close to the picture in the facebook link.
     
  6. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    I have a cunning plan - make reliable headphones from the start and 100x times less communication problems \/

    About microphone - connect Verum 1 to mic hole with existing cable and shout into the cup (remove earpad first). Then plz tell me the results.
    Hint! Add +10 db on mic input in your sound card drivers.
     
  7. Jerry

    Jerry Friend

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    Good plan!

    Now tell us about this new project :)

    And pse don't forget to send my earpads.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2021
  8. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    My next project isn't a headphones.
    Though I'm working on improving existing model and on Verum 2 I want to start some small non-audio project. Frankly speaking to have funds for Verum 2 prototypes. All manufacturers refused to make magnets I need for Verum 2 so now ... I'm making my own rare-earth magnets. Yep, right from the powder :D

    No way ;)
     
  9. Jerry

    Jerry Friend

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    Good luck with that.
    Look forward to more info on the V2. Any price target? Why do you need to make your own magnets?
     
  10. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    Thanks!

    Verum 2 will have an orthodynamic driver. Now drawings are finished and I'm trying to actually produce what I've designed:
    driver.png

    And all manufacturers with whom I've collaborated on Verum 1 magnets refused to produce such ring magnets. Too complex for mass production. So I have no other variant but only to make my own magnets. It's difficult but not impossible.
     
  11. 9suns

    9suns [insert unearned title here]

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    Awesome!
    To my untrained eye, looks similar to what Final is doing with their D8000 headphones (and also Yamaha in the 70's).
    Would you mind sharing more details about the design and why is different from Verum 1?
     
  12. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    @9suns you're absolutely right. I'll share more details in a month or two when I have smth more then few renders.
     
  13. skem

    skem Friend

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    Does the V2 sort of design suffer from more resonance peaks? Seems you’ll have Bessel modes given the boundary condition and excitation pattern.
     
  14. Jerry

    Jerry Friend

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    This is quite fascinating. Any reason why you want that particular magnet design?

    The Verum 1 is a unique sounding planar. I'm quite hooked to its mids. Look forward to this Verum 2 project. But pse do take your time to double-check for reliability issues.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2019
  15. Dzerh

    Dzerh Friend

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    Just curious, what are benefits of such design against mainstream? And if there are significant benefits why we don't see that used more often?
     
  16. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    Let me explain some benefits:

    1. Several times more powerful magnetic force with same percentage of open surface and magnet weight. Ring magnets generate much higher isodynamic field then bar magnets.
    2. If you look attentively at Verum 1 (or any other conventional planar with bar magnets) you'll see that only about 70% of membrane really works. Please look at photo:
    [​IMG]
    Side traces are not connected to main spiral. In Verum 2 100% of membrane will work.
    3. In orthodynamic designs with circular magnets membrane REALLY move as one piece like a piston. That will decrease THD significantly.

    Unfortunately, production of thin and large ring magnets very expensive and difficult. Look at Final Audio D8000 - it has same principle but only two small magnet rings: https://www.6moons.com/audioreviews2/final6/2.jpg
    Verum 2 will have 4 magnet rings.
    magnets.png
     
  17. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    Always like to conversate with a specialist :punk:
    Bar magnets excite standing waves, rings don't have parallel surfaces and don't have such problems. Also I'll make smth to minimize reflections between ear and membrane. ;)
     
  18. Syzygy

    Syzygy Friend

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    Loosely related, just watched these this morning. You can see your magnetic fields:

    How to build it:


    How it views when done:


    The guy can be a little gruff, but it's interesting being able to view the magnetic field.
     
  19. Garuspik

    Garuspik Tovarisch Ukrainian Terminator MOT - Verum

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    Ferrofluid is the best way to look at magnetic fields.


    Verum 2 is not a "tomorrow" project. Most likely not even this year. Right now working on new headband design for Verum 1. This will show in a couple of weeks I hope.

    What I really need for TOTL headphones - source of flim mylar+aluminium with a thickness about 7 um each material. Or even less. Unfortunately can't find and use more thick film and in terms of plankton Verum 1isn't TOTL ;(
    If someone could help me or have info where I can buy such film I'll be very thankful.
     
  20. skem

    skem Friend

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    Yes, I agree about the excitation of standing waves from bar magnets, but if the membrane doesn’t have a parallel boundary (I.e., circular headphone) they die out fast. Rings do have a circular standing waves, like a drum head, described by Bessel and Zernike polynomials, and an overall circular membrane may support those standing modes efficiently. It’ll be interesting to see what you find with a prototype, even made with less-than-ideal film.

    Ah yes. This is why Fan makes a big deal over his less-than-1um membrane. Audeze uses 2um, I believe.

     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2019

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