ZMF Caldera Review and Impressions

Discussion in 'Headphones' started by Vtory, Sep 12, 2022.

  1. zach915m

    zach915m MOT: ZMF Headphones

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I'm not aware of opinions of the Clear MG - but - I can say with 100% confidence that that area and bass QTY is heard differently by people that often at shows someone will put down a headphone, and someone else will come by and pick it up with the same track playing, the two people may say completely opposite things regarding the bass and treble. Our hearing is definitely geared towards hearing midrange more similar since we communicate through voice to each other, but the low low's and high high I have never found anything aside from anatomical changes (different earpads) and filtering (titan mesh) that can help make each of our headphones safer to try/buy since we all differ so much there.

    PS/Edit - One anecdote I can think of is that my own brother, will listen to headphones at what I consider a whisper volume, like literally like 60 -65 dB or something. But then when he watches TV, he listens to it SO LOUD that I can hardly stand to be in the room. Volume of listening - and I think we've all been around someone who listens on like a Susvara or something and we're like WTF DUDE THAT IS SO LOUD! Things just sound so different at different volumes, and then you throw in all the other factors of type of music and source and all that, and there's too many things to homogenize.

    The above is the main reason why it kills me when reviews are written in a finite voice, about any product that leave out their own taste, chain etc. We can certainly come to conclusions about baselines for measurement and characteristic, but leaving out the subjective is just near-sighted.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2023
  2. lcmusiclover

    lcmusiclover Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2017
    Likes Received:
    912
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Oregon Coast
    tl;dr -- Love my ZMFs, and Atrium Open, Auteur Classic and Caldera are like 3 points of an equilateral triangle with 'ZMF house sound' at the centroid. Which you like best probably comes down to personal taste and preferred genre.

    Let me say up front how much I appreciated getting to demo these headphones. And also, kudos to Zach for entering a new product space with such an attractive first offering.

    So on with my impressions which will focus heavily on comparisons w/ my Atrium & Auteur.

    Atrium has the most open headstage, with the most depth. Auteur is at the other end, with Caldera in the middle. Caldera has the most precise image with both Auteur and Atrium about equal, one step down. Caldera isn't Utopia precise ('That instrument, RIGHT THERE') but certainly as precise as my HEKse, although the Caldera stage is smaller in all directions vs HEKse.

    Tonality isn't all that different between the 3 ZMFs. Caldera has the brightest, most prominent highs, though still less so than HEKse and not significantly brighter than Auteur, with Atrium being the least bright of the three. Again, small differences though. Atrium's headstage depth can make the mids sound a bit recessed vs the other 2, while Auteur seems to have the most prominent mids of the three. Bass is about equally prominent from all three, but has somewhat different character. Caldera's bass seems the most linear, Auteur has a little more mid-bass warmth, Atrium is closer to Caldera with a bit of sub-bass roll-off.

    Biggest difference between Caldera and Atrium besides headstage is that 'speed' thing. Atrium comes off somewhat laid-back, while Caldera is more incisive. Auteur is closer to Atrium, but comes off a little bit more ... immediate? Atrium/Auteur difference might come down to my Auteur Classic being very hard (African Blackwood), as well as less headstage depth than Atrium.

    Strangest part for me is that Caldera manages to come off as neutral and at the same time, a bit warm. By that I mean that no part of the spectrum seems recessed or elevated, yet I still hear the warmth of the house sound.

    Honestly, 6 days (thank you, Juneteenth) wasn't enough time -- I barely listened with alternative pads, and spent a bunch of time futzing around with my chain :)

    Speaking of my chain, I listened to Caldera with:

    Volumio Primo ==> mScaler ==> TT2

    either direct out (headphone jacks, not rear XLR out) or DAC out feeding:

    DSHA-3F
    Liquid Gold X
    Liquid Platinum
    Audio-gd Master 11 (as amp)

    I didn’t hear much difference between the Caldera sound from any of the amps. In fact, I could barely hear any difference between 3F and LG-X — just a small sense of some added mid-bass warmth/bloom from the LG-X. Tube swaps in the LP and transformer swaps in the 3F has (much) less effect than on Auteur.

    The Master 11 as amp was quite good, a bit more authoritative. I assume that's due to massive power reserves and Class A topology. My Hedd behaves similarly from the M11 as well.

    But overall, I would call Caldera not amp picky. Of course I never listened to them on a 'real' tube amp since I don't have one of those, only the LP.

    I also listened to:

    Volumio Primo ==> mScaler ==> Master 11 (as DAC/amp)
    Volumio Primo ==> mScaler ==> Hugo 2

    Of these two, I really liked the Master 11. It sounded very musical and engaging, and it was probably my favorite pairing -- maybe due to the combination of Class A amplification and 1704 DAC character. By comparison Hugo 2 ended up seeming less musical, even a bit analytical, which is not something I'm used to be saying about ZMFs.

    Also, I did most of my listening w/ stock pads and the thick lambskin pads. Used the cables which came with — mostly the 4-pin XLR cable.

    Atrium was 'open mesh' with Universe lambskin pads. Auteur Classic was 'open mesh' with Eikon suede pads.

    I'm sitting on the fence about Caldera. If I didn't already own HEKse it would be a no-brainer. But I did honestly prefer HEKse for classical, although Caldera only got a cursory glimpse of that genre.

    Really each of the three ZMFs end up being Number 1 for some genre.

    Feel free to ask for any info I left out ... but ask soon ... auditory memory fades quickly.
     
    • Like Like x 17
    • Epic Epic x 3
    • List
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2023
  3. sp33ls

    sp33ls Friend

    Pyrate Contributor
    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2018
    Likes Received:
    169
    Trophy Points:
    33
    Location:
    PNW
    Man, I really enjoyed my time with the loaner pair. First of all, shout-out to everyone in the community who makes all of that possible. Being able to experience TOTL gear at home with your own system is a definite advantage over trying to make judgements at noisy expos.

    To be honest, my impressions match up quite nicely with what others have already said, so rather than rehashing, I'll just spitball the thoughts that ran through my mind while enjoying these Redheart beauties.

    I tried the Caldera on a few different amps and DACs:
    • Allo Katana --> Upgraded WHAMMY
    • RME Babyface Pro FS --> Neurochrome HP-1
    • Yggdrasil LiM --> Yamaha C-1 (Restored/Upgraded)
    There was some serious magic happening with the Yggdrasil/Yamaha combo. The C-1 offers the best of both tubes and solid state with its all-FET signal path (including some VFETs). This was my favorite pairing.

    upload_2023-7-5_22-55-23.jpeg

    Speed demon

    First thing I noticed when I put these on was the ortho transient response. Despite expecting this, it never failed to impress. While I'd owned a pair of LCD-5 in the past, currently my quickest pair of cans are the Verite Closed. While quite nimble and agile, the Caldera says "hold my CAMS" and proceeds to run circles around any dynamic driver. To be fair to the venerable VO/VC, the Be-coated driver still make for an interesting race.

    Zach did it before Elon

    This transient response aids in its ability to provide superb imaging and instrument separation. It has an "in your head" kind of sound. Not because of the soundstage, but rather because this is just about as close as one can get to playing music in their mind until Neuralink permeates our hobby (heh, only half joking.)
    The holographic imaging mixed with the razor-sharp transient response makes for an eerily transparent musical experience where nothing ever sounds congested.

    To steal an overused HiFi trope: you're in the recording booth. This also applies to the overall presentation from the Caldera; I feel like I'm sitting in a high-end studio.

    REAL or REEL

    Segueing into a more philosophical discussion that's outside the purview of an impression thread, but while the Caldera was more transparent, it felt more like an excellent reproduction of the music. Despite any additional harmonic coloration, my ZMF dynamics are able to more readily trick my mind into believing that these instruments sound "real." But, wait, if they're less transparent than the Caldera how could you make the claim that they're more "real?" I hear ya, and we could just as well draw analogues to digital vs analog, tubes vs solid state, etc... but, that's a topic for another thread.

    It's still worth noting that this is the best timbre I've ever heard from a planar.
    And while the tonality is also among the best I've heard, I did experience that extra "spice" in the treble with the stock pads, but that's easily remedied with pads/mantle mesh/EQ.

    Much of what ZMF fans enjoy about ZMF can be found in spades with the Caldera. Tone, technicalities, and tactility are all standout characteristics. Many planars can be described as "thin" or so "sharp" that they end up unforgiving and fatiguing. Zach did an excellent job with ZMF's foray into the TOTL planar segment, as I found that the Caldera is ideally situated within the musical <---> analytical spectrum.

    Put your money where your mouth is...

    In conclusion, my experience with the Caldera was nothing short of extraordinary. Their sound quality pushed me to a heightened appreciation for music, pulling out nuances that make a significant difference to the listening experience. These headphones are a sound investment for anyone deeply involved in the audiophile world and they've certainly set a new standard in the TOTL planar segment. I'll admit these are the TOTL planar for which I would actually empty my wallet...

    That said, I still find a particular charm in the dynamic drivers, as evidenced by my love for the current ZMFs in my collection (AO, AC, VC). They have a unique characteristic that continues to draw me in, despite the technical superiority of the Calderas. It's a reminder that personal preference and emotional connection to music often outweigh specs and categories in this hobby.

    My time with the Caldera reminded me of why I love this hobby so much, drawing forth a spectrum of emotional responses. Goosebumps, chills, teary-eyed moments - aren't these the very heart and soul of what music is all about?
     
    • Like Like x 12
    • Epic Epic x 1
    • List
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2023
  4. earnmyturns

    earnmyturns Smartest friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,218
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Palo Alto
    Home Page:
    Just a comment on the last two very detailed Caldera impressions. I agree with the descriptions and I could not have put it nearly as clearly. However, I do think Caldera is amp-picky. I've used mine with 1) DNA Stellaris, 2) DSHA-3F, and 3) Ferrum Oor+Hypsos. #3 is the only setup that convinces with Caldera, while #1 and #2 excel with Atrium. With #1 or #2, Caldera sounds (relatively) thin, 2D. With #3, it's a whole different experience: fast and multilayered, better instrument placement than Atrium with any of #1-#3.

    I don't know enough about amp design to understand why, but this is what I hear.
     
  5. Vansen

    Vansen Gear Master (retiring)

    Staff Member Pyrate
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,893
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Seattle
    Here are some initial impression on this headphone from about three hours of listening. My opinions at this point usually hold, but we'll see how they evolve over the week with them.

    • Any negative feedback below is probably me being overly critical. Even on the items I’m critical of, these still out outperform most headphones.
    • I’ve never described a headphone this way before, but the FR (not technicalities) feels soft. It’s got warmth on the bottom end, a little recess in the mids, and a ton of air. I feel like these aspects of the FR is significantly impacted by the pads and haven’t rolled any yet. I’m excited to swap through the pads.
    • Dynamics are amazing. Even when things get very complex and fast at loud volumes, this headphone holds it together better than any almost headphone I have tested at home.
    • Detail and imaging are way better than my modded twelve year old HE-500. They beat my JAR600, too. I honestly have no critical feedback on this one. Imaging is expansive, but feels very natural. On the opening of Carly Rae Jepsen’s Let’s Get Lost I had to take the headphone off because I somehow thought my Philharmonic BMRs were playing, but it’s just the awesome presentation of this headphone.
    • FR sub-bass and bass are a few dB higher than my HE-500, but the impact/ slam on the Caldera cannot hold a candle to my HE-500 in this area. Even with the lower dB, the HE-500 feels like it hits a lot harder. The Caldera still hits a lot harder than my JAR600, so not too much of a downside here. This is my opinion when listening to modern rap or hip-hop music. However, if I listen to Sara Bareille’s Brave Enough: Live at the Variety Playground, I have no complaints about impact.
    • Unlike everyone else in this thread, I find these headphone to be very pick about amp pairing. It took me a while to figure something out where I wasn’t, “WTF!?”
    • This headphone shines on my EC ZDT w/ Silver OPTs and an Amperex ECC83. This pairing is fantastic. I only wish one thing was different on it: I wish it had the impact that my HE-500 have.
    • I initially plugged these into my Eddie Current Balancing Act w/ National Union 307a and 1945 RCA smoke glass 6SN7GT and was somewhat let down. From previous tube rolling, I know RCA pairs well with my Sennheiser headphones, but it has a slight mid-range recess and wide staging. I have a Lin-Lai E-6SN7 that I don’t care for with the HD580 or JAR600, but from memory, it seemed like it would pair will with the Caldera. I swapped the Lin-Lai in and was happy. Even at loud volumes it still holds everything together well. The 9 o’clock position on the BA equals about 92 dB on popular music from this century and it doesn’t have issues driving the headphone with authority. I still haven’t decided if I like the ZDT or BA more with these.
    • These don’t work on my Ragnarok 1. Not sure why. My HE-500 shine on this amp. On the Rag1, there’s distortion I can’t get past in the upper bass and lower mid range. It’s not present on the BA or ZDT.
    • I’m pretty happy with where I’m at in my headphone journey. To this point, the only other headphone I want to add to my collection is the Focal Utopia, which is probably my favorite headphone. I’d add this as a second headphone I want right after the Utopia. The only headphone I haven’t spent time with at home that might make its way on that short list is the DCA Stealth - but I’m not about that price for a headphone. I’d throw the cash at two channel investments before considering a headphone as expensive as the DCA Stealth. I would wait around for a used Caldera, however. I’m happy with my HD580 Precision/ JAR600/ HE-500, but would consider pivoting to the Utopia and Caldera as my primary headphones in the future.
    • All of my other headphones look like crap when sitting next to these. They’re a work of art.
    • DACs used were OG Schiit Bifrost MB w/ OPA1656 and Gustard X16 (lol). Going to try this on my VPI Classic 3/ Kiseki Purpleheart (I feel like I should swap back in my VAS Nova cart)/ Manley Chinook and maybe my Yamaha I use the HE-500 with this weekend.
     
  6. tatsugiri

    tatsugiri Acquaintance

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2023
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    USA
    Could my Eddie Current Balancing Act with PX4 tubes power these alright? Iirc the ECBA puts 1.5W into 50ohms? The amp was made to at least be able to power lcd-2's and I've had an *okay* time with my modded lcd-3's (less efficient) on it.

    The amp's amazing with my Verite w/verite pads -- I'm tempted to say I have one of the best zmf verite setups there ever was, so the caldera is on my radar if it has at-all-similar synergy.
     
  7. Vansen

    Vansen Gear Master (retiring)

    Staff Member Pyrate
    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2016
    Likes Received:
    3,893
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Seattle
    Yes. My BA with 307a tubes paired well with the headphones and is mentioned in the post above. It had plenty of power and was in the low 90 db category at the 9 o'clock position. The BA was the best pairing I had for the Caldera once I swapped in the Lin Lai E-6SN7 tube that I don't care for with Sennheisers. It did a slightly better job than my my ZDT, which does 3W into 32 ohms vs 2W into 32 ohms for the BA.
     
  8. tatsugiri

    tatsugiri Acquaintance

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2023
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    USA
    Thank you!

    Since you mentioned that you hadn't pad rolled yet, I feel like sharing that I thought my verite sounded *bad* with the universe they come stock with, but are my favorite with the verite pads and some other, less warm sounding pads. You might have a similar experience with the caldera.
     
  9. JeremiahS

    JeremiahS Almost "Made"

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2015
    Likes Received:
    286
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    Jakarta, Singapore
    When I tested a friend's unit it seemed fine but he was using higher gain tube in the driver position, Tung-sol 6C8G if I remember right.
     
  10. TonyNewman

    TonyNewman Validated by Tyll removing Utopia from WOF

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2016
    Likes Received:
    290
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Just got my ZMF Caldera and I am impressed. Right out of the box it sounds great. Looking forward to how it will sound after a couple of hundred hours of use and then some pad rolling. I love my VC and VO, but the Caldera is another level of performance. Well done Zach and ZMF.
     
  11. TonyNewman

    TonyNewman Validated by Tyll removing Utopia from WOF

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2016
    Likes Received:
    290
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Quick follow up - I was reading some reviews/comments that say that the Caldera is fantastic for Rock/Jazz/Folk ...etc - almost anything EXCEPT orchestral / classical. I did some A/B testing and I kinda agree. My HEKv2 or HD800S do a better job of those genres. This is not a knock on the Caldera - what it does well it does brilliantly, but if orchestral / classical is the bulk of your listening some other headphone might be a better choice (HEKse / Susvara etc). For me, 95% of my listening is within the Caldera sweet spot, and I am happy to roll my headphone for those moments I want to do some orchestral / classical. As always, YMMV.
     
  12. Vtory

    Vtory Audiophile™

    Pyrate MZR
    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2016
    Likes Received:
    10,831
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    East Coast
    Not quite sure what the reviews you read intended.. but in my experience (I'm pretty much sure that I used Caldera longer than 99.9% of current Caldera users), they actually shined in complicated orchestral pieces. I'm very sensitive to even emphasis over the entire spectrum. And Caldera is probably the only pair that could "properly" balance mids against very low or high frequency bands. Overall, I don't think of any pairs other than Caldera that can reproduce as complicated or elegant expressions. Particularly for modern recordings. YMMV though.
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2023
  13. TonyNewman

    TonyNewman Validated by Tyll removing Utopia from WOF

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2016
    Likes Received:
    290
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Not saying that the Caldera is bad at orchestral / classical - I am saying that I prefer the HEKv2 and HD800S for those genres. The Caldera has some colouration that works fantastically well for most forms of music - particularly the sort that I mostly listen to - but for orchestral / classical I prefer something more transparent, hence the HEKv2 and HD800S. It's a preference thing that is going to vary from person to person. Some folks have mentioned it and I tend to agree with them. It's not a big deal, I think.
     
  14. dubharmonic

    dubharmonic Friend

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2017
    Likes Received:
    3,032
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Evanston, IL
    @Vtory you're right, the mids are perfectly balanced. Caldera has the best mids of any planar I've heard yet.

    [​IMG]
     
    • Like Like x 6
    • Agreed, ditto, +1 Agreed, ditto, +1 x 1
    • List
  15. TonyNewman

    TonyNewman Validated by Tyll removing Utopia from WOF

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2016
    Likes Received:
    290
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Vocals - male or female - are spectacular on the Caldera. Just awesome.
     
  16. Lickumms

    Lickumms Acquaintance

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2022
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    USA
    Edit: I did the review with the stock Perforated leather pads on the Caldera. Which weren't thick enough to keep my ears off the drivers. I didn't realize there was a thicker pair of pads included in the box. I will do some quick listening to see how they change the sound then post my edit at the bottom. Immediate notice is that not have my ears hurt really improves the listening enjoyment.

    Edit 2: Review update at the end.

    I decided the best use of my time with the Caldera would be to do a comparison to my other similarly priced, planar, headphones. The headphones I'm going to be comparing are the Final Audio D8000Pro, Kennerton Thror, and the Kennerton Rognir. Sorry if I get a little rambly in this review. I'm a little burnt out from constantly swapping between headphones and listing to the same songs on repeat.

    https://imgur.com/W10uUO1
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Thror, D8000Pro, Caldera, Rognir

    Signal Path: Computer:Audio-GD R8MK2: Switch box: Bottlehead Mainline/TorBalanced/Audio-GD Master-9
    I don't use any EQ when listening to music.

    I figure I will give a general comparison of different sound aspects of the headphone then give a little more detail after the fact.


    Comfort and weight: This is really subjective area since everyone has different sized heads and ears. I have a massive head so most headphones tend to run tight on me.

    Weights: D8000Pro(stock Pads) 538g, Caldera(Stock leather Perforated pads) 519g, Thror(ECL-01 non-MF) 485g, Rognir(ECL-02 MF) 492g

    Personally I find the Thror to be the most comfortable headphone. It has plenty of room for my ears and its setting is a slide with a nut to lock it in place so you can get the fit to be perfect. The tightening system is a little awkward if you are having other people try them on since they would have to unscrew the bolts then set the headphones to there size. It is the lightest of the bunch and doesn't squeeze my head as hard as the other headphones do.

    Next would be the D8000Pro. It is the heaviest of the lot but not by much. I like the adjustment system and the ear pads fit great around my ears with no pressure. I do find the third point of articulation on the cups to be bizarre and completely unnecessary. I don't get why I would ever want to spin the cups clockwise or counter clockwise? It really just adds an unnecessary adjustment I have to make to be possitive the cups are sitting the right way.

    After that would be the Rognir. It has the same pads as the Thror but uses an auto adjusting system for how the headphones sit on your head. I find that I'm constantly having to readjust the headphones so the ear pads do sit on the tops of my ears. Which gets quite annoying after a while and makes my ears sore.

    Just behind the Rognir would be the Caldera.I like the adjustment system and the pads are really high quality but its pads aren't deep enough to stop my ears from touching the driver covers. So there is a constant pressure on my ears. Combine that with how tight the headphones sit on my head I can't actually wear the headphones for more than an hour with out getting some kind of headache. I can't bend the headband to make it less tight since I don't own them I can easily see how on a normal sized head these would be super comfortable headphones but for my massive head, My poor mother, it is not great.

    I'm going to only post a couple things about how certain ranges of sound compare on the headphones where I noticed any major differences. Since the headphones are all around $3500 none of them are really bad at anything.


    Sounds Stage: Again there isn't too much a difference between the 3 open back headphones but for some reason the Closed back has the largest sound stage.

    The Rognir is a bizarre closed back headphone that has this insanely massive, to the point of almost sound artificial/hollow, sound stage. It is the biggest of the 4 by a lot. It also has the most separation between instruments. The other 3 headphones? The D8KP has the second largest sound stage with the Thror and Caldera being pretty much tied. For separation I would say the Thror would be second followed by the D8KP then the Caldera behind it, but not by much.


    Sub Bass: Remember how I just said none of the headphones are bad at anything. I lied. This is the most definitive difference between the headphones.

    Song used for sub bass: 2049 by Hans Zimmer, Benjamin Wallfisch

    The D8000Pro is so much better at sub bass than any of these headphones its not even funny. It has incredible rumble with enough power behind it you can feel the Sub bass shaking your whole head. The Rognir has some sub bass with a little bit of the low end rumble, but doesn't really even compare to the D8P. The Rognir can be a little farty sounding when reproducing super deep bass. The caldera had a little less sub bass than the Rognir but was lacking in the rumble that was present with D8P and Rognir. The Thror didn't even show up to this comparison. It has zero sub bass and doesn't even try to reproduce and thing below lower mid bass.

    D8000Pro>>>Rognir>Caldera>>>>>>>>>>>Thror


    Precision and detail: There was a slight difference in how focused on details the headphones were.

    Most of the headphones were pretty on par with each other. With the only noticeable exception being the Thror. The Thror is able to take every super minor detail and bring it front and center. I didn't noticed there was a difference between them till I was listening to the song Spokey Donkey by The Seatbelts. The song begins with a Harmonica solo. During the solo you can hear the player stop and breath between verses. Only on the Thror was I able to hear the slightest smack from the players lips coming off the harmonica right before he would breath. What is lacks in sub bass it makes up for in detail and precision. The only other thing of mention between the headphones is that the sound stage is so massive on the Rognir that it feels like some details can get lost in its massiveness.

    Thror< Caldera=D8KP< Rognir


    Couple other genera/songs I like:


    Painkiller by Judas Priest

    The Thror really shines over all the rest due to how fast and precise it is with the guitar, vocals and symbols. Every instrument is perfectly represented with out anything getting lost. The lack of sub bass doesn't matter in an music where they are only using a drum kit. Though, if you are going from any of the other three headphones the bass can come off as lean compared to the other 3.

    The D8P while great added a little too much bass, especially in the sub bass and lower bass area. Some of the lower mid details got a tiny bit lost in the bass. The guitar and vocals didn't shine quite as bright as they did with the Thror.

    Caldera had a similar problem to the D8P. Though most of its added bass was in the mid range. The vocals are better compared to the D8P but not nearly as good as the Thror.

    Rognir with its massive sound stage. Everything is so far away from each other that certain parts can come off as slightly hollow. Its bass is the second best balanced out of the headphones behind only the Thror. Since the sound stage is so massive the symbols can come off a little dry/thin when compared to the vocals/guitar.


    EDM or any high speed dance music.

    I thought the D8KP would be a clear winner in the EDM since it has the best bass of the headphones but the the energy and attack of the Rognir blew it away. The Rognir is so violent and fast when it comes to music in this category that it is almost impossible to imagine any headphone existing that could beat it. It's massive sound stage is an incredible complement to the the genera. It helps separate out everything and create a more enjoyable experience. I'm to even sure if the D8KP gets second place in this since it has such a warm laid back sound it kind sucks a lot of the life out the music. Second place is goin got go to the Caldera followed by the Thror then, surprisingly the D8K in last.


    Jazz:

    The D8KP is a clear winner when it comes to jazz and other music like it. Listening to jazz with the D8KP is like being in a bar with a private band playing music just for you. The headphones are so laid back, warm, and smooth that the music just envelopes you. They are truly incredible with this genera. The Caldera and Thror are both equally good at Jazz but the Caldera does a little better job with the Bass. The Rognir might be a little to aggressive for some versions of jazz.


    Female Vocals and highs: Female vocals are really important to me since about 2/3 of my music has women singers.

    The Thror is so good when it comes to highs. Which naturally makes it the best for female vocals. Second would be the Caldera followed by the Rognir. The D8KP with is warmth and bass focus is probably the worst but not bad in anyway.

    For the super high end all but the D8KP got slightly sibilant. With the Rognir being a little bit worse than the other 2.



    Conclusion: None of the headphones were really bad at reproducing music... Besides the Thror and sub bass

    D8000Pro
    - Laid back, smooth, and warm headphones with the best bass and sub bass you can get in a pair of headphones. Warmth can cause high end to come off a little muted. Really shines with Jazz, trance, and Soundtracks.

    Thror: Fast and detailed. Neutral bright headphones. Lacking in lower and completely missing sub-bass. Highest detail. Best with highly detailed music, Metal, acoustic and female vocals.

    Rognir: The most dynamic sounding headphones. Super aggressive, in your face sound with with comically large sound stage. Least amount of micro details. Closest you can get to what a headphone on cocaine might sound like. Best with any fast dance music, EDM, and bass machine songs.

    Caldera: Very Neutral tuned headphones almost to fault. Heavily Mid focused with slight bass extension. Sub bass light. Pretty good at most things.

    I personally found that the Caldera didn't really shine in any category compared to the other headphones I have. The other headphones had something they were truly fantastic at whereas the Caldera was just right in the middle of the road at everything. It seems it was tuned to be Neutral, mid focused, and unoffensive. There is nothing wrong with the headphones, they are great at what they do and I mean no offense, but I found them to be boring and just couldn't enjoy the tuning. Which is the exact same problem I had with the ZMF VC. A technically fantastic headphone but I just could enjoy using them.

    If you have any questions let me know.


    Review Update:

    After being told there should have been a pair of thick pads in the box. I took everything out and low and behold they were under some random pieces of cardboard in the box. Turns out not having my ear touching the driver covers majorly increased the comfort, enjoyment, and sound quality of the Caldera. My ears no longer touch anything and with the headband fully extended I could easily wear them all day. I would say, if I owned them and could bend the shit out of the headband, they would easily be tied with first place for the most comfortable headphones overall.

    The thick pads took the caldera from being a neutral, kinda flat sounding, and boring headphone and really lived them up. They are now on approaching a warm/neutral-warm sound signature. The thick pads combined with the Mainline really turned the Caldera into a fantastic and fun headphone.

    The first major change in the sound was major increase in the bass in all ranges especially in the sub bass region. Instead of really only having mid bass it now will reach as low as the D8KP. They still aren't as powerful in the subs as the D8KP but they are now actually able to compet with them. They are now in comfortable second place in the sub bass.

    The sound stage did increase a little bit but not in a major way. They still have ever so slightly the smallest sound stage being just behind the Thror it might even be tied with it but I just didn't have enough time compare them. I wish I had noticed the the thick pads right away.

    The highs are little bit muted/muddied now, and I noticed the symbols in rock music tends to get lost in/covered by the bass. The highs are little rounded out and the headphones don't really have much sizzle on symbols. It also means all the harsh highs are now gone which is a great since it had the most out of the headphones(though it didn't have much to being with).

    I would honestly say they are now like a lite version of the D8KP. Which is a very high complement since I consider the D8KP to be the best headphone I've ever owned. The D8KP is still a better headphone in every way, over all, but it does cost 30%, ~ $1000, more for it over getting the Caldera. So it might not be a fair comparison.

    If I had to pick between to the D8KP or the Caldera. I would honestly hesitate for a second but would still end up getting the D8KP. The D8KP is as close to, in my opinion, a perfect headphone as you can get. Yes the Rognir is super energetic and the most fun headphone to listen to but it's constant attacking sound can get fatiguing for long listens. The Thror is king when it comes to micro details and the best for listening to rock and metal. But its precision, especially in the highs can also get fatiguing for long listening sessions. Where as I could wear the D8KP and the Caldera, I think after adjusting, all day with out any problems.

    If you were trying to choose between the Caldera and the D8KP. I would first look at your system and see if the extra ~$1000 could be spent on improving it first. If something in your system could be improved; improve it and get the Caldera. Then I would be 100% sure that you can afford the extra ~$1000. If you are at all hesitate about being able to afford the higher price of the D8KP. It would be better to get the Caldera. If you are perfectly happy with your system and you can afford the extra cost of the D8KP. Then get the D8KP.

    If you are looking for a pair of headphones that you can wear all day with out being fatiguing. That will work great with any genera of music you throw at with out coloring the music too much all while have great bass you would be hard pressed to find a better headphone then the Caldera in its price range.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2023
  17. zach915m

    zach915m MOT: ZMF Headphones

    Pyrate
    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,517
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I think you probably had the tour headphones so I don't know what pads are still with them, but we make deep and shallow pads, the deep pads are really really deep and make the sound a little more laid back/punchy.

    The headband is bendable and we do by default send them pretty tight as they are more easily bent out. I don't know the shape of the tour unit but you guys are welcome to bend the headband slightly of its so tight it's giving pain.

    It would be useful to others to know which pads you used for your write up.

    You can find headband bending and other info here:
     
  18. Lickumms

    Lickumms Acquaintance

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2022
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    USA
    I used the stock perforated leather pads. I didn't want to bend the headband in case I over do it for the next people in the line. I wear a size 7 7/8th hat which is pretty large. The pad bags were open and had spilled out. I'm pretty sure I got them all back into the correct packaging. I tried the suede pads but found they compressed more than the leather.

    I didn't notice the thicker pads since they were tucked under a piece of cardboard on the bottom of box. I will have to try them and see how it changes the sound. They are a lot thicker. Sadly I only have them one more day before I send them off.

    Edit: The thicker pads really help with the ear pain and seem to be a fair bit warmer than the stock pads.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2023
  19. Lickumms

    Lickumms Acquaintance

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2022
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    USA


    Review Update:

    After being told there should have been a pair of thick pads in the box. I took everything out and low and behold they were under some random pieces of cardboard in the box. Turns out not having my ear touching the driver covers majorly increased the comfort, enjoyment, and sound quality of the Caldera. My ears no longer touch anything and with the headband fully extended I could easily wear them all day. I would say, if I owned them and could bend the shit out of the headband, they would easily be tied with first place for the most comfortable headphones overall.

    The thick pads took the caldera from being a neutral, kinda flat sounding, and boring headphone and really lived them up. They are now on approaching a warm/neutral-warm sound signature. The thick pads combined with the Mainline really turned the Caldera into a fantastic and fun headphone.

    The first major change in the sound was major increase in the bass in all ranges especially in the sub bass region. Instead of really only having mid bass it now will reach as low as the D8KP. They still aren't as powerful in the subs as the D8KP but they are now actually able to compet with them. They are now in comfortable second place in the sub bass.

    The sound stage did increase a little bit but not in a major way. They still have ever so slightly the smallest sound stage being just behind the Thror it might even be tied with it but I just didn't have enough time compare them. I wish I had noticed the the thick pads right away.

    The highs are little bit muted/muddied now, and I noticed the symbols in rock music tends to get lost in/covered by the bass. The highs are little rounded out and the headphones don't really have much sizzle on symbols. It also means all the harsh highs are now gone which is a great since it had the most out of the headphones(though it didn't have much to being with).

    I would honestly say they are now like a lite version of the D8KP. Which is a very high complement since I consider the D8KP to be the best headphone I've ever owned. The D8KP is still a better headphone in every way, over all, but it does cost 30%, ~ $1000, more for it over getting the Caldera. So it might not be a fair comparison.

    If I had to pick between to the D8KP or the Caldera. I would honestly hesitate for a second but would still end up getting the D8KP. The D8KP is as close to, in my opinion, a perfect headphone as you can get. Yes the Rognir is super energetic and the most fun headphone to listen to but it's constant attacking sound can get fatiguing for long listens. The Thror is king when it comes to micro details and the best for listening to rock and metal. But its precision, especially in the highs, can also get fatiguing for long listening sessions. Where as I could wear the D8KP and the Caldera, I think after adjusting, all day with out any problems.

    If you were trying to choose between the Caldera and the D8KP. I would first look at your system and see if the extra ~$1000 could be spent on improving it first. If something in your system could be improved; improve it and get the Caldera. Then I would be 100% sure that you can afford the extra ~$1000. If you are at all hesitate about being able to afford the higher price of the D8KP. It would be better to get the Caldera. If you are perfectly happy with your system and you can afford the extra cost of the D8KP. Then get the D8KP.

    If you are looking for a pair of headphones that you can wear all day with out being fatiguing. That will work great with pretty much any genera of music you throw at with out coloring the music too much all while have great bass you would be hard pressed to find a better headphone then the Caldera in its price range.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2023
  20. Raidersfan8118

    Raidersfan8118 New

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2021
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    United States

    I’m looking for a planar that is good on electric guitar sound. Would you say thror is better than caldera by a bit for this?
     

Share This Page