Nearfields for audiophile listening?

If dropping that sort of cash it's really important you go to a store and demo everything they have available. You should be able to find a demo pair of Neumann KH120s for ~$1200, they are voiced flat but have a certain sweetness and are not unlike the HD650s in the upper mids. They were my personal pick against other 5"-7" options in that price area. Just one suggestion.

 

Here's a query -- I listened to some Dynaudio BM6A (older version AFAIK, not the MKII) monitors in my room and they were noticeably veiled and had a sort of mids suckout compared to my usual Yamaha HS50 monitors. Was very unimpressed; they were less punchy as well. Is that veil or lack of clarity a known issue with Dynaudios? Anyone know?

 

Might be sbir, try experimenting with the distance to the front wall, don't be afraid to put them almost against it. There should be controls to reduce the bass if it becomes too boomy. The manufacturer usually has guidelines wrt to minimum distance to make sure the amp receives enough cooling.
Also try playing with toe in and distance between speakers, an equilateral triangle is not always the best choice. I had good succes with the distance between the speakers being 0.8x the distance between speaker and sweet spot.
And the last tip i can give you is desk reflections can cause problems, either raise them, angle them upwards or use proper stands.

What works for one pair of speakers could very well not work for another.

 

you should go to a local pro audio shop and listen to whats available.
imo, in your price range, passive + diy power amp will KILL whats available in 1.2k active speakers.

if I HAD to go with active in you price range, id likely pick neumann kh120. I find them quite fun to to listen to. however, scm7v3 + a diy gainclone will be more versatile, sound more refined, ect.
id drop asap that yamaha sub though. it likely make thing worst.

 

I am inclined to stick with nearfields for now. I'm in an apartment; can't broadcast widely. I've never had passives and don't feel like researching for weeks to get to a comfortable level of competence. Will see where the dust settles with the Vidar if I move to a more secluded location in the future. I'll be getting a used pair of Genelec 1030's, should suit my needs nicely.

 

That's hardly the pinnacle of DIY power electronics, with a few notable exceptions which use the IC, but in a different topology. Especially for a sealed loudspeaker with an understandably low sensitivity at 82dB/W@1m.

I'd rather go with a discrete power amp with at least around 100W.

 

whats your point? you disagree that some gainclone can be very good for the money? because my recommendation was based on the guy budget if you havent noticed
ill take a literal gaincard lm3875 over any cheap discrete amps. as if discrete is automatically better.

50 WPC is plenty for most people I know, even with 82db/w speakers.
a good gainclone, I mean literal gaincard, is a good amp. extraordinary good for the money. I never said its the pinnacle did I?
good 100W discrete amp dont come exactly cheap now do they?

alternatively, for some including me, even 20 wpc tube amp will be plenty for 82db/w.

 

For two 82dB speakers 20W will yield 92-94dB max, at near field scenarios. I'd say that's too little for comfort with high chance to clip the amp.

I'd use something like this instead of a gainclone - https://www.neurochrome.com/product/lm3886-done-right/ Mostly due to the fact that it has proper compensation.

 

I know the math and ill say that for everyone I know, a 20 WPC with even 82 db speaker is plenty but its probably ill advised. best go with more powerif you dont know well your own listening habits...but in my honest experience, I cannot even pass the 12 o clock knob on my GF cyrus one amp (25wpc) on her 82db ATC SCM7v3 9 feet away without her screaming to put it down as its already way too loud.

I actually even find my dht 6b4g 12 WPC enough with my p3esr, im probably crazy but it gets pretty damn loud. of course I wouldnt recommend it and I cant blast them at all and in my case I know exactly what my limit are in order to not clip the amp so its not something id recommend for everyone

with my sony ta 707 80 WPC, I couldnt even go past 11 o oclock on the knob without fearing for the safety of the scm7v3 and on my P3ESR, the same. this power 'game' seem a bit exaggerated in my humble opinion.

 

Output power has nothing to do with the volume knob. Look at your gain structure and you'll be able to tell how much voltage you're pumping in a given load. With a hot enough source I can max out my power amp pretty quickly. The volume knob doesn't regulate the output of your amp in terms of "knob'o'clock = a set percentage of output power", you can run into voltage clipping or current starvation (with lower impedance loads) before you run out of knob. And one can find himself in a situation where in a given load he can't max out the output power of the amp.

And what's interesting - with dB graded gear like ADI-2 Pro one can precisely try out just how much louder is X dB.

 

People I have encountered listen at very different loudness levels, most of them in the high side (85..95+ dB) given the opportunity.
Speakers might be easier to listen to loud in perfect acoustics than headphones, but imo in typical listening scenario this is not the case.
How many of you really listen louder than 90 dB with headphones? Factor in some crest events and we need 100dB for headroom.

I think I can hear where amps in my 8050s run out of Class A steam, it's not very loud, maybe 80 dB,
bass driver movement is not detectable yet. They are quite resolving of plankton up to this point, after that it drops off to shit, and you are left with 'detail' and 'slam'.
New dsp Genelecs are incapable of even that low spl plankton.

 

I personally think a literal gaincard is better then all those redesigns of the lm3875 gaincard. have you heard a literal gaincard?

who listen at 94 db in nearfield? seriously, I couldnt appreciate listening to music in nearfield even at 88db with 10db peaks. I know many mixer mix at about 75db, I sure couldnt appreciate listening in nearfield at 95db.

I listen normally to about 75- 80db average, I never ever listen over 90db. even 85db becomes a bit uncomfortable to my ears. 85db in midfield (7-8 feet) is already the max ill ever go.

I dont want to argue with anyone, but im borrowing a friend 300b audion golden night with my shl5+ and I dont need more power. thats me and I know for many its plenty of power.

 

I'm curious to know who actually measures the SPL. Do you guys have proper meters, or use phone apps?

My music is pretty quiet. OK, I can't listen with just one door between me and the sleeping wife (which is why I'm here: without the wife, I doubt that I'd ever have used headphones much) but my music wouldn't bother neighbours. I use a phone app sometimes in live music. Within the same app on the same phone (comparison, not absolute values, as obviously not calibrated) I know I am getting uncomfortable as the volume gets over 90.

But at home... who does what? And is it because you think you might be too loud?

Hmmm... maybe offtopic. Feel free not to be distracted

 

I actually have one of these: http://www.vellemanusa.com/products/view/?country=us&lang=enu&id=521447

 

i've read good things on those neumann kh120 when browsing gearslutz.
..currently i'm using the focal alpha 50s...good bang for buck speakers:
while they're not inexpensive (like jbl 305) they're not expensive either...
am looking at the new focal shape series (replaced the cms series)
or something from dynaudio...x2 or x4 used
using roon, microrendu, lps1, tidal and iFi micro idsd (until i upgrade my DAC)

i find i seldom listen to cans anymore..just good quality sound from my nearfields is more preferential.
...something about that larger soundscape of speakers vs cans.

 

Actually, my HD600s sound better than the bass-lacking speakers I currently have on my desk, but mostly, I'd say that, in a half-decent room, the speaker experience wins. Even half-decent speakers, and here people are talking about way better than half-decent.

Cheapo-choice... in some ways, the M-Audio AV40s I had before were better. They had more bass at half the size. And I'm not talking about head-banging, I'm talking about the weight and fullness of classical orchestra.

 

In your opinion what technical difference would warrant a positive performance difference between the Gaincard and Tom's designs using the LM3886 IC? I don't see any and the simple chipamp realisations I've heard weren't anything to write home about, which surely wasn't the case with Modulus86.

Please understand, that in electronics there is no principle that circuits with less parts perform somehow intrinsically better. There is the KISS principle which goes against unnecessary complexity, but more often than not audio electronics will be more complex than the easily marketable "only X parts in the signal path". Simplification in itself aids perception and abstract thinking, not engineering to meet the infinite complexity of real life requirements.

Most mixing happens at 80-85dB, depending on preference. That means 85+10dB is an absolute must for a system to be able to playback reliably (which is why most small monitors go to around 100dB). With tubes you will get soft clipping, which won't sound too terrible, however no clipping will always be preferable to soft clipping for high fidelity playback.

 

It tends to correlate that devices with minimum amount of parts sound better.
opamps = usually bad or mediocre
SET-s = usually great
Class A amps = Usually great
dac with voltage out and no buffer = great
same dac with very good opamp = mediocre
dacs with simple tube out = usually great
dacs with simple jfet out = usually great
consumer class A-B with 5+ stages = awful
consumer class A-B with 3 stages = decent

edit: also for some vague reason newer high performance audio opamps use less stages, like OPA1622
I bet it sounds better than say AD797 as dac buffer.

 

Have you tried to find out why?