Back to CD - Wow!

Is a network streamer with a top-notch DAC better than a standalone CD player? Over the past decade, many, including myself, have said yes. I ditched CD players in 2010 after hearing the Linn Klimax DS. Back then, I pitted Linn against Bricasti, Naim, Ayre, and even the Linn CD12, and Linn Klimax came out on top. After that first Linn, there was no way I was going back to CD players.

Fast forward 13 years, and I stumbled upon a post from @purr1n raving about the ET3. Since I still have a collection of CDs, I decided to give it a whirl. The ET3 impressed me as a transport, and my CDs sounded decent, but not as good as my streaming setup. My streaming system has evolved from a single Linn Klimax to the Linn Akurate DS3 as a transport, with Playback Designs Merlot acting as the digital director and a second Playback Designs Merlot connected via their proprietary Playback link. It’s a lot of gear to get truly excellent digital playback.

After living with the ET3 for about a year, I wondered what a top-of-the-line transport could do for sound quality. One thing led to another, and instead of getting a CD transport, I ended up with the Emm Labs XDS1, which is still their flagship single-box SACD player.

At first listen, I knew the XDS1 had it: natural, full, dynamic, musical, great bass, nuanced and extended treble, every note had weight and substance. In short, CDs didn’t even sound like 16/44 anymore; they sounded more like high-res. Then I played the same CD file via DLNA in my streaming chain, and while it was super close to the CD player, it didn’t quite have that high-res magic the way the CD player did. I also tried connecting the streamer to the CD player, and the result was worse than the streaming chain.

So, after 14 years and using three boxes to achieve good digital, what did I really accomplish if a single-box CD player sounds better than the chain? It’s definitely something to think about. Of course, I’m not ditching the streaming chain as I still enjoy streaming services, but I think I’ll be spinning discs more often than streaming files.

 

And then one day... the siren call of vinyl...

 

... and before you know it, concert tickets.

 

I love the sound of CD's. I never gave up on any media really, I still listen to cassette tape, vinyl and stream from my Plex server. I don't have any streaming service though. . I like music from everywhere, though I never have had an 8 track! Maybe I will get a chance with the way things are always come back around!! I suppose any way I can get music into my brain. And hell yes to concert tickets!!

 

never gave up on CDs either - I was blown away by the excellence of the PS Audio Perfect Wave - prior to this I thought transports played a small role but never expected that experience. I do use the NAS more than anything else just because I am lazy and like playlists..dB

 

Yeah, it isn’t that I doubt non-streaming or file-based sources may sound better, it’s that I listen to between 400 and 700 new albums a year each year, typically, and that’s easiest to do with streaming, possible with files, and a herculean task if I was using anything physical, so I just ignore reports on the virtues of physical media the best I can, lol.

 

Shucks, I don't want to tell anyone how to live their life!!! However you can listen works!!!

 

hello,

i buy a shit-ton of cd's (they CAN be f'ing cheap to acquire)

i want to possess a physical copy of the music i love without being hostage to a business algorithm that will change at any moment, and takes that music away from me. i do not chase the ultimate remaster (although i do appreciate remastering which brings a recording to life again).

i'm thinkin' the debate between physical media and digital/streaming media is getting a bit absurd. do you want to have unlimited access to the music you love, be able to manipulate the format of those files (assuming you convert them) or do you want to hope that (whatever) streaming service decides to NOT delete something you have loved in the past.

as stated, i buy a shit-ton of cd's.

YMMV

cheers!

 

I am the same way, I have a disk version of the PS5, but my life are all Spotify junkies. I don't understand them and they make fun of the old hoarder!

 

I still buy vinyl and CDs. Honestly, as high as vinyl prices have gotten I almost exclusively buy CDs now again. You can pick up six or seven used CDs for the price of one vinyl album a lot of the time. I like streaming too but mostly use it to discover new music. If I find myself streaming something repeatedly I will track it down on physical media.

There are so many factors on what sounds better. Is your personal analog setup simply better than your digital one? Or maybe it is the other way around? I do think my physical media sounds better than my streamer, but wouldn’t put money down that I could A/B the two blindfolded. I do know that I am personally more engaged when I use physical media.

 

Cds are my main source I use a Jays audio cd3mk3 transport wishbone clamp feeding
My Lampizator Pacific with a Shyunata Omega AES//EBU cable connecting the two.

 

But... that involves going outside and being around other people...

 

https://vancouver.craigslist.org/rds/ele/d/surrey-north-track-player-and-radio/7815406933.html

 

I've started hitting the local library for CDs. I'm mostly just grabbing things that I have added to my Tidal library, but ripping them a network server for offline access. When the library is a spent husk, then it will be the second hand shops, again, just to rip.

The thought of building a physical collection specifically to listen to the physical product? CDs or vinyl? Ugh, f**k no. I've got enough shit in my house as it is. I don't deny that for some people it might sound better than a network transport, but for my own needs, convenience trumps all else by a HUGE margin.

Ewww, gross. I got into headphones specifically because I don't like people.

 

This is true re: being beholden to the whim of streaming services, but I don't necessarily buy that CD's are a necessary part of the equation for file-based playback. It's plenty easy to download files via Bandcamp, or Soulseek, or torrents, or what have you. I did it for years before I finally gave in to the convenience of streaming. I still find it annoying when I can't find something (usually a Bandcamp release), but generally I'm surprised at the amount of stuff I can find on TIDAL, at least. Certainly you CAN include CD's in a file-based playback habit and rip them to codec of choice, it's just optional. I think vinyl rips are a different thing altogether, though, in terms of chasing a certain SQ, whereas while audiophiles definitely tend to, on balance, talk about files sounding better than most streaming (especially if you upsample), usually the idea with CD's is that they only sound better than downloaded files if you actually play the physical disc in a good-to-"audiophile" quality CD player. Ripping them can have mixed results, if no real difference, vs. just downloading a lossless digital release or someone else's rip.

FWIW source-wise the conventional wisdom I've seen among audiophiles after lurking audiophool internet spaces for a number of years, if there is any, is:

Vinyl > physical CD (not gonna get into SACD vs. CD here, who cares about SACD's IMO) > Vinyl rips > Digital file-based playback (some divergence here, but usally upsampling > non-upsampling, DSD > PCM, and then you get into debates about which player sounds better, and which storage medium, and audiophile SATA cables, and and and...) > Streaming. The only time I've seen like, ORFAS audiophiles who have heard a lot of $$$$ stuff (What's Best Forum-type folks) claim anything other than vinyl sounded best was for the Taiko Audio stuff, which supposedly is when digital finally "surpassed" vinyl, to some of them, but hell if I'm gonna spend 20 to 70k on a server to find out.

 

I just can't get onboard with most of this 'conventional audiophile wisdom'.

If Tidal serves me up a 24/192 track from a properly mastered source, is that equivocally going to sound worse than the CD? Is a CD and a lossless bit-perfect FLAC from the same transport going to sound <that> different, if different at all?

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

I agree with you with the caveat that the equipment involved is roughly equivalent sonically. I got another reminder last night that @purr1n was absolutely correct and the Wiim is steps behind, even as a transport. Although I suppose Qobuz could have had a really crappy master.

 

Well of course. And considerations like a $100 CD player is probably better than a $100 turntable, while things get blurrier as you get higher in cost. I also worry about the tendency for manufacturers (and ability of some people) to properly setup file-based and streaming-based equipment without digital-domain fuckery like poorly implemented DSP's, multiple layers of volume control, etc. etc.

Chesebert's particular setup sounds awesome with CD's, which is great. But sweeping generalisations derived from this are not particularly helpful.

 

I've never actually owned a high end cd player so I won't write them off, but yeah I also only ever end up getting cds just so I can rip them if it's something that's not available online - I just don't have the room to store all that stuff.

Something I've always been curious about for folks who do have high end spinners, since cds do somewhat have a natural lifespan like vinyl records do, if you make a perfect cd rip using EAC or some other similar software and then burn that back to a writable cd, do you think that still sounds the same as the original cd did? I would imagine that it should, but I've never heard of anybody using them that way.