Good bye to JRiver? time for foobar2000?

Discussion in 'Computer Audiophile: Software, Configs, Tools' started by wormcycle, Sep 16, 2016.

  1. wormcycle

    wormcycle Friend

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    I have been using JRiver for all my computer playback for 2 years and it was pretty much the only player I like because of its great UI, and good synergy with DAC Magic 100 ASIO driver. Paid for every upgrade, including master license etc.. And that's fine, I have no regrets, they have a fine product and I really enjoyed it.
    I have been experimenting with foobar2000, always unhappy with ifficult to configure UI, not paying much attention to SQ.
    Than I watched simple video how to setup foobar and tried it just for fun.
    I started listening to the recording of Mozart piano trios (flac 96/24) and it stopped me. I switched to JRiver and it was .. not that good. It was not so much as noise in the background but rather sound was slightly defused comparing to JRiver. But it was there I could not just brush it off. I tried different headphones first: HD600 and HD800S. The difference with with HD800S was even more clear: the sound in foobar was clear and coming from a dark, quiet background, was just better. Tried different recordings, the same effect. I am going for a week long trip and will not be able to do any listening during that time, this is all very preliminary, and I know I describing it in not very objective terms.
    But I am very intrigued, all my attention will be on foobar when I came back. Anyone else surprised by foobar2000?
     
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  2. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Similar audio output settings in both? Sounds like there is some resampling going on.
     
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  3. geomaso44

    geomaso44 Rando

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    Last edited: Nov 21, 2016
  4. OJneg

    OJneg The Most Insufferable

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    I've had the opposite experience FWIW
     
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  5. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Jplay, XXhighend, Fidelizer, etc. didn't do anything for me, but I use a dedicated laptop with unnecessary services disabled. My semi-ancient Sony VAIO dual Core laptop also has a completely separate USB 3.0 port with its own bus and own drivers - isolated from the shared USB ports.
     
  6. Madaboutaudio

    Madaboutaudio Friend

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  7. Hands

    Hands Overzealous Auto Flusher - Measurbator

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    Opposite of what I heard too. Make sure you have DSP stuff turned off. Try disabling dither in Jriver. Play around with loading into memory setting and ASIO buffer settings, etc.
     
  8. wormcycle

    wormcycle Friend

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    Similar: both are using ASIO, USB 2 driver for DACMagic 100. You were right, it was resampling to 96000 on foobar but most of the tracks I used were 96000 anyway. Removed resampling but did not have time to fully test the result. Will get right back to it after my trip.
     
  9. Ice-man

    Ice-man Friend

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    Jriver sounds great. I don't hear any difference between it and foobar when are things are equal.
     
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  10. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    As @Hands said, check dithering, bitdepth, etc. You can toggle memory play on JRiver too. Make sure ASIO buffer is the same. Lower buffers typically increase Gaurav Factor, but can result in dropouts on a slower computer.
     
  11. chakku

    chakku Friend

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    I use the ASIO drivers with my DAC2 and a SoX resampler plugin to resample anything that isn't 44.1kHz to 44.1. It's nice because I can hear other audio on the PC at the same time as the ASIO output as opposed to it being entirely exclusive. Just need to make sure to download the resampler plugin version that resamples everything -but- the specific sample rate, as opposed to the resample -only- the specified.
     
  12. MrTie

    MrTie Friend

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    Ditto. And i simply like how jriver handles VSTs, UI is whatever I only ever used foobar and jriver dead stock in that regard.
     
  13. Prydz

    Prydz Friend

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    Funny... 3 years ago or so I tested JRiver vs Foobar and prefered JRiver.
    After I read this thread I had to test Foobar again, and actually, I thought foobar sounded more like the way its intended. Like there is some layering with JRiver.
    Might be placebo, or the later JRiver versions are worse? :D
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2016
  14. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Get CD transport. @Tari is selling one. Then you don't have to worry or be neurotic about this stuff.
     
  15. Negura

    Negura Friend

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    I compared Foobar and Jriver many times in the past. I had very much the opposite experience everytime. Foobar sounded rather flat and compressed. But this is so minute it's not really worth worrying too much about.

    This might be of interest too:
    http://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_out_asio

    Please note that this component is meant for systems where ASIO is the only available output method. It is highly recommended to use the default output modes instead of ASIO. Contrary to popular "audiophile" claims, there are NO benefits from using ASIO as far as music playback quality is concerned, while bugs in ASIO drivers may severely degrade the performance.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2016
  16. Prydz

    Prydz Friend

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    So I should not use ASIO with JRiver?
    Just wasapi? Or "default audio device" (Direct Sound)?
    My DAC uses ASIO driver atleast, atleast from the stuff I download for my DAC.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2016
  17. k4rstar

    k4rstar Done his time

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    https://wiki.jriver.com/index.php/Audio_Output_Modes

    tldr; if your device has a well-behaved ASIO driver, use that otherwise use WASAPI
     
  18. Prydz

    Prydz Friend

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    How do I know if my device has a well-behaved ASIO driver? :D
     
  19. Negura

    Negura Friend

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    o_O And here I thought the link I provided to the FOOBAR ASIO plug-in page was self-explanatory to what software that quote and claim applies to. Just because... duh.

    Basically if the ASIO plugin author discourages its use, except as last resort, and if we are to believe him, this raises a few questions:
    - those using foobar with ASIO have been doing it all wrong then, if the ASIO plugin is indeed worse/buggy/whatever than going through direct sound?
    - use some other output plugin instead? I personally thought even less of WASAPI in Foobar than with ASIO.
    - or why bother using Foobar? Unless for pragmatic reasons
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2016
  20. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Some of the ASIO drivers are wrappers. For all we know, we could be getting DirectSound. Typically only the pro stuff has real ASIO drivers.
     
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