Nearfields for audiophile listening?

NOOOOOoooooo! I want to throw my money at HEDD, but this is why I can't. I often think something like "In the real world, we don't often have the time/money/space/knowledge to get everything close to the ideal, so by having a small sweet spot, you make the requirement for everything to be perfect even higher and expose errors earlier." I really like what the company is about though and the interviews with HEDD's CEO shows he wants to build accurate yet musical speakers, not "brutal honestly! disgusting all the way!". Sure, I'm going to just run Sonarworks on top of them after, but you know what I mean.

I also think that we are cut from the same cloth after reading this thread more. I have a lot of the same preferences and things I want to hear.

I got the 306p while it was on sale and have it right now but I am *not* impressed. I thought it would be like the LSR305 but just slightly better, maybe some minor crossover annoyance. Instead, It seems to measure noticeably worse but the hiss, while present like before, is more noticeable. The 306p doesn't fade away the same. They force you to sit further back which is cool and all, but I don't have the physical desk space or stands to do that! Most people buying this s!@# in the first place will also be using them sub-optimally. They should have considered how the end user will treat them. Hell, the end user of cheap monitors are YOUNG AND STILL HAVE THEIR HIGH FREQUENCY HEARING INTACT! rant over

I might just be trying the Mackie MR624 or XR624 after all like you did now. What was the hiss on XR? MR is A/B amp, but XR is the higher end model, but has Class D.

Honestly though, our true savor was the Kali IN-8. It could have been the one. Front port. 3 way. "Pseudo" coaxial design and functions as a waveguide. Mid range price. The designers were smart to fill that gap, even if it is taller than Michael Jordan. But Kali is known for loud hissing speakers, so now I can't look at them. Why!? If Genelecs were only cheaper and I could buy them without their DSP and expensive accessories.

 

Speaking of... Dunlavy's giant SC-## can be had for a decent price on the used market. I'm not sure if you can use them in nearfield though.

 

My 305MKIIs are dead silent since I went full balanced from the BF2 and removed the Asgard 3 as a pre and Rolls Promatch to balance. The volume changes at the back of the monitors/sub x3 each time is a little clunky but not annoying, yet.

 

Interesting. I have the same setup as my LSR305, just going in balanced to my audio interface. My LSR305 wasn't dead silent, but I could hear it from 10inches close only. The same is true on my 306p, but I can hear it without any signal chain attached, just a power cord, and it's practically volume and sensitivity independent.

Perhaps the 5 inch model is the golden child for JBL.

I really want to try the Mackie XR624 while they're on sale, but I've already seen several reports about their amplifier noise too. The sale looks so good though and I've wanted an upgrade for a while.

 

I should mention, per the directions my monitors are set to -10 dBv even though they are fed balanced from the sub.

 

I don't know what monitors you are using, but strangely enough, JBL says to set them to -10dBu when connecting them to their own speakers, so you do have them set correctly. It also seems to make a big difference in volume available as well.

 

If we suppose that speakers don't have to be especially euphonic, I'd recommend to try out PSI monitors if they are in your budget.
In case of proper placement they have a "window effect" with great 3D scene and almost palpable sound sources. So, if you want to add some sound for your working place where you sit still for whole day, it's a good idea. Out of aim they are just another mid-forward overly analitycal speakers.

 

i've audition the smallest PSI 14m recently and I must say they are really huge sounding. i don't know if it is the soundstage or what, they just sound like it came from something bigger than the two small cute boxes.

but yeah, mid-forward and analytical speakers. they are definitely bright sounding, like most studio monitors.

 

Newcomer here looking for some impressions/recomendations, already read the 72 pages.

Here is my current Desktop setup: Auralic Aries Mini with BOTW P&P ECO Sbooster ULTRA MKII PSU with 2TB Crucial SSD -> Wireworld Starlight 7 USB -> Sony TA-ZH1ES -> Mogami 2534 Star Quad, High-Def. Audio Interconnect Cable with Premium Gold plated Locking RCA Connectors - Directional -> Focal Shape Twin Studio Monitors / Focal Stellia

I´ve been using the focal shape twins for a year and before them i had the Dynaudio LYD7, which i found quite inferior to the Focal Shape twins in terms of definition/resolution/soundstage,etc.

So atm i´m inclined to get a pair of HEDD Type 20 Studio Monitor, these will be mostly be used to listen to music, although i´m a musician and play guitar/write music at home, i do not do any mix/master at home, nor will i be using the monitors for that goal!

Only looking for an upgrade, and the monitors need to have XLR and RCA connections since my Sony TA-ZH1ES only has RCA outputs, the XLR inputs I use to connect to Focusrite 2i2 when playing guitar at home.

What are your sugestions/impressions about the HEDD Type 20 for my current setup?

Music i listen is mostly death/tech/brutal metal with high end sampling rates (44.1, 48, 88.2, 96 and dsd 64, 128), but i also listen to other genres such as jazz, chillout and some EDM.

 

I own A14 and A25, so i know their character.
A14 are mid-forward and bluntly revealing only when you're not properly positioned or have strong reflections, otherwise they are just right and clear as good 3d 4k monitor. But they are really limited, as can be seen in specs sheet (thd vs freq) . If you want them to play something more or less bass heavy like death metal, their usable spl is around 85 db/m at most, because all lows get smeared and muddy, depending on your tolerance for artifacts. Anyway they are bass reflex, so quality of everything below ~ 80 hz is compromised by default. I'd say, they are great for surround and broadcast, or you need sub for fullrange.

I don't know how exactly these will work with your DAC, but Hedds i've heard was little bit dull/muffled in mids due to strive for deeper bass, but for consuming commercial tracks it might be very good. Especially TDM which can be produced in different ways.
Don't know for sure how you will understand AMT tweeter. For some people after fabric domes it's annoying. I'm ok with Adam AMT, but it's really just another sound. I'd recommend to audition AMT highs somewhere at least before purchase.

 

+1 on that solid advice. AMTs and in general ribbons sound differently versus soft domes. If done right they outclass most domes, but also are pricier.

 

Thanks for the update, unfortunately i don´t have the chance to try any monitors with AMC tweeters, i mostly buy based on reviews/recomendations, it was like this with the yamaha hs7, the Dynaudio LYD 7 and the Focal shape twins, always looking for a substantial sound upgrade in terms of tecnicality and soundstage when looking for the next buy

 

The 305 is the only good jbl 300. The 306 and 308 suck balls.

kali treble sucks and the bass is flabby. It was far from true savior despite the marketing.

The best sounding cheap powered monitor is the HS8 easily. The JBL 305 mk ii and KRK Rokit 5 G4 are a bit more responsive to work on with the JBL having the best high end. The HS8 sounds bigger and better and has no mid suckout which is rare for an 8” woofer two way. Ignore the other sizes from all three brands.

 

1. Ditch the mogami quad for mogami regular. It makes a difference. Mogami quad dulls the sound. The “Gold” sold in stores aren’t very good for all but the noisiest live environments. Otherwise, you just hurt the sound.

3. Dyn Lyd sucks compared to the bms. I would get something that just sounds bigger and better than BM6a, which is good to work and sounds good but lacks that volume. BM15A sounds good with suckout in the lower and upper mids but the key is it sounds good! There are more tonally accurate speakers though like the ones listed below.

3. Get something bigger and inspirational without weird mids If you’re not doing any real work on them. I’d recommend Yamaha HS8, Adam A7X, KRK V8S4 (V6 has more accurate upper mids but this is bigger!), JBL 708, or Quested V2108. All have these have tons of vibe. Never heard the Hedds but they shouldn’t be bad if you get the 07 or three way 20 if they’re made by the guy who made the older Adams and sound at least as good as A7X or A77X but you might lose the vibe of that speaker that makes things sound good and is awesome for listening. None of the Chinese AMT speakers had it and a lot of the made in Germany Adams didn’t have it either despite having the better tweeters.

These will all get you away from the Focal tweeter fatigue and weird woofers. Yes I think the HS8 is better than the Shapes. The cab volume and dry papery sound rules for metal. The JBLs can be kinda colored and they get can get congested in the Lower mids. Quested will throw mud and midrange bleed/overlap in time/space/frequency in your face ime. So you might want something even vibier.

 

@fsilva WARNING. BEWARE. Almost all death metal after the Morrisound and Sunlight eras is going to sound like shit because it is awfully recorded for the most part. Some of them are shockingly decent like None So VIle but most... awful and overproduced. Sarcofago I.N.R.I. might as well be live in the studio compared to them. Everything labeled "technical" or "brutal" after early Suffocation is pretty much going to sound awful on more accurate speakers and you're not going to get more out of them from them either. Those records, you can hear everything on a phone speaker like Morbid Angel's Altars of Madness but unlike that clicky kick classic, they won't scale with more detail and bigger sound . They will get really small sounding due to the limited and off balanced sound. Maybe this is what you want to avoid for your own stuff but maybe this is not how you want to hear those records.

Tech and brutal death is worse recorded and mixed than Burzum for the most part. While a black metal demo might be super cool on high end monitors because you can hear what's going on and what's totally wrong with it scaled up, tech death you can already hear that and everything is so small and limited anyway. A lot of these benefit from more lofi monitors like Focal, which universalize recordings, and more colored monitors like Adam A7X. So while a Thomas Skogsberg record like Dark Recollections can hit you like a truck, an Eric Rutan record will be 10x worse than it is in the car. Any of the newer direct input guitar guys with sample pack drums? They're gonna sound like total shit for the most part and you gotta accept that it's some dude wanking off in his bedroom with a UAD Apollo or something.

Playing tech death on monitors is pretty much like playing coked out 80s pop on monitors but even worse. You're not gonna like what you're gonna hear.

 

Now I may sound like a prophet of common sense, but it's really bad idea IMO.

Before your "monitor evolution" was simple and straigtforward
HS7 = 160E
LYD7 = 480E
Shape Twin = 630E, 2x6,5" + PR
So, you just went from el cheapo to decent active speakers with bigger displacement.

Now you're in 2KE range and still want to buy out something "definitely better" by reviews. It just don't work out like this now. You can get not just Hedd20, but Neumann 310, Core 47, Focal Trio Be, and maybe something like PSI A17/21. All those speakers are very decent and some people prefer one, and some another.
It's just economy - you'd like to get best from your investment, and now investment size requires your personal annention. All these audio-choices finally come to your physiology and preferences, so there will be no-one to blame for wrong speakers that you cannot withstand for 30 minutes if you're very unlucky.
I'd spend this amount of money without audition only in case of 2-week return policy without questions from seller.
Signal routing is not the reason to prefer something special. You can buy some simple monitor controller or relay-based router and just select sources according your needs.

 

I´m aware that most of the metal albums that were released after the Morrisound era may sound good or not, it´s a matter of taste and the way the albuns were produced, i´m not to picky regarding that. I still like most of the albums that are released by Erik Rutan nowadays.

As for the yamaha´s hs8 i don´t see them has being an upgrade when comparing them to the Shape twins.
Still inclined for something like the Heed 20´s in terms of price wise and scalability.

Thanks for you suggestions/impressions!

 

I was inclined to continue with Focal and get the Trio BE for instance, but they do not have an RCA input, and using adapters to connect them to my Sony Dac seems like a no go for me...
Will check the other recomendations you suggested tough, although as i´ve said, i buy blindly, after doing lots of "research" on forums and reading to tons of impressions, reviews, etc.

As for monitor controllers, what would you suggest? And would a controller add any sound coloration?

 

I own Dunlavy SC-IIs, which share the same driver size and configuration as the bookshelf SM-1s (SM stands for Studio Monitors) but with higher cabin volume. Unfortunately, any closer than 8 ft from listening position results in the phantom center greatly deteriorating. Maybe the even smaller SC-Is could work nearfield but i still think that they would lose their trademark sound traits.

Speaking of Dunlavys, when i bought them (used) i was strongly fixated on the acoustic suspension and perfect phase and time coherency idea. Nowadays, after getting a bit more into more modern scientific speaker approaches (i.e. off-axis response importance is much more important than phase accuracy), it seems that this 1st order purity is more of a cult of the past.

Despite the above, i'm still amazed by unusually outstanding imaging and timbral accuracy of the Dunlavys, especially on instrumental music (guitars, piano, drums,..), which makes sometimes makes me rethink and dig deeper into this minimum phase vs off-axis debate (Duns poor vertical off-axis behaviour ).

SC-IVs and VIs are the best measuring legacy type speakers on Stereophile. The SC-IVs FR and phase response (https://www.stereophile.com/content/dunlavy-audio-laboratories-sc-iv-loudspeaker-measurements) is to my eyes as good as the modern DSP-ed Kii's. Decent condition IVs (Vifas are quite vulnerable) can be found between 2k-3k $.

 

I'd say you'll need something like passive input/output selector like https://www.aliexpress.com/i/32879847806.html
But I don't know about possible sound coloration as i'm not a conventional audiophile. I don't care for anything subtle until everything else right.