The WAF Dipole. The Waff-ole. Waffle.

Discussion in 'DIY' started by Ardacer, Sep 22, 2020.

  1. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    This is the first, very crude mock-up of how my full range dipole design transducer might and probably will look.
    [​IMG]

    First measure is in cm, the other is in inches.
    All 16 of the drivers and amps are on their way. Full vibration cancelling in the sub box. No rocking the neighbors or resonances in the upper baffle. Theoretical maximum spl of 100 db - ish.
    Will build it and measure it.
    I'll power it with 16 D-class amps. Just how I roll.
    I think that for a full 20-20k dipole/quasi dipole speaker, this is very slim. Even for a regular speaker, this is small.
    It should be as powerful or even more so than the lx521, possibly with better dipole behaviour.
    I say all this fully aware that this is my first design, I am nowhere near the genius that is SL, and I sound stupid to myself saying it. But that's what calculations suggest. We'll see. In any case, I do own a pair of lx521, so I can compare.
    For added WAF, the whole thing could easily be made into a black slim monolith with acoustically transparent black screen.
     
  2. gixxerwimp

    gixxerwimp Professional tricycle rider

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    I can't see how the nekkid version would gain much "wife acceptance", but maybe the monolith would. What was the design process, in simple terms?
     
  3. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Agreed it would not gain much waf nekid, but for the simple reason that it's not a monstrosity that enthusiast grade speakers usually are, it's way better. See any OB full range design, usually massive.
    Monolith version would be just 2 black slim symmetric towers so compared to most other stuff it would have a gigantic waf, I hope.

    The design process was tedious. No idea where to even begin. You need to know and understand way too much. Kinda regret the time invested, but hey, it's a hobby I guess.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2020
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  4. dBel84

    dBel84 Friend

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    any reason to not just use Linkwitz 521 design - it is tried and tested, gets massive recognition as an exceptional tool to reproduce music and has all of the crossover slopes worked out already

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    I own the lx521. It's amazing. (I actually wrote this in my first post, and, I actually preach about the lx521 everywhere to the point of vomiting, I like lx521 and SL that much. Seriously. )
    It rests at my house. Where I currently don't live. They literally would not fit in the apartment where I live with my future wife, and although she is amazing and would easily make space for the lx521, I won't ask this of her. This design is half the size of lx521 with (hopefully) the same performance, and possibly better look (I like how the lx521 looks, mind you, but not many people do). If it works, quite a feat. (this is a big if, I know.)
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2020
  6. sphinxvc

    sphinxvc Gear Master (retired)

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    What size are those woofers at the bottom? Actually, what are the driver details in general?

    Sub-system reminds me of the Gainphile speakers.

    I like your mock-up, it's like a mash-up of high fidelity stylized images (the back of the driver at the bottom) and MS paint. :)
     
  7. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Why thanks! This is inspired by lx521, nao note series and gainphile. Good catch. 8 inch drivers at the bottom, that's why it's so slim. 4 of them per channel, though. I'll post more later :)
     
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  8. scblock

    scblock Friend

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    Looks interesting. I assume you'll be using active crossovers? What were you planning to use for that?

    The idea of wrapping it in cloth reminds me of the Vandersteen 1, 2, and 3 series. They aren't open baffle, but do hide a rather ugly set of drivers and cabinets behind the cloth.
     
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  9. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    That's the inspiration for cloth. You guys have me completely figured out instantly.

    I use minidsp 4x10 for my lx521, but I'll use RPi for this, with ecasound filters.

    I personally won't use cloth.
     
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2020
  10. dBel84

    dBel84 Friend

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    That'll teach me to look beyond pictures and actually read what people have taken the time to write. My apologies. You are the ideal person to take this on as it should be fairly painless to tweak this design to get close to the LX521. You might want to try foam board as a test platform, really easy to build/cut and this will allow you to play with dimensions /volumes quickly.
     
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  11. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Thanks, was wondering what material is best for prototyping. I did my research very very extensively though, modeled it for months, literally, so I'm quite confident in this particular design. Naturally it could require tweaks, we'll see once the drivers arrive. I'm, as you can guess, very excited :D

    I think most of my tweaking will be in the dsp region, the baffle was very well thought through, I know exactly why everything is the way it is, there was no guesswork.
     
  12. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Look how incredibly interesting it looks in monolith mode.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

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    16 drivers, 16 amps seems a bit too much for that.
     
  14. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Not really, you are limited by the weakest link in the chain, that being in this case the maximum of the low mid woofer. If it's maximum is around 105 db (at the lowest point to which you have to EQ), the fact that the tweeter assembly can crap out a 130 db means nothing much really. Dipoles are crazy inefficient at low end.
     
  15. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Some pics of the build process first.

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    My akita inu, really needs to be in the middle of everything.

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    And my furry bleached asshole for good measure.

    Sorry bout the watermarks, recently reflashed the phone, forgot to remove it.
     
  16. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    [​IMG]

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    My cat on his toilet. Always watching for potential threats.
     
  17. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    [​IMG]

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    Next to the lx521. Pics don't really do it justice, it's 2x slimmer.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2020
  18. gixxerwimp

    gixxerwimp Professional tricycle rider

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    Great pics! Though they are [email protected]#king huge (4000+ x 6000+)! At least you hosted them on Imgur so they don't tax SBAF resources, but they take a long time to load and my ancient PC has trouble scrolling through them.

    Is your wife more accepting of these than the lx521? (Although, from the pics, I think you only have your cat to please ;))

    Have you listened to them yet?
     
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  19. Ardacer

    Ardacer Almost "Made"

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    Considered putting up a pic where she holds the cat but thought, idk, perhaps better not. There is a pic of her and my dog somewhere in pets thread, though.
    Nope, didn't listen yet, amps didn't arrive yet. She took a look at them and said

    Looks the same to me

    so mission failed somewhat I guess :D
    But these can be mounted on small wheels and placed next to walls, out of the way, when not in use, so I think it'll be good yet. Due to perfect simmetry and full vibration cancelling you don't have to worry about coupling them to the floor and rocking your neighbors.
     
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  20. Hrodulf

    Hrodulf Prohibited from acting as an MOT until year 2050

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    My hat's off to anyone building their own stuff! I hope it sounds the way you planned.

    Now, the reality check. In my opinion as a marketing guy, your speaker doesn't have much less visual impact, compared to the lx521. You've shrunk the front view of the bass bin by half, but in reality volume stays about the same as they've gained extra depth.

    As for actually selling the thing to people, it looks too much like a lx521 rip-off and you're risking summoning the angry ghost of Linkwitz. It will only sell if it's considerably less expensive. Because you're not Linkwitz, so people won't trust you. And the lx521 looks better in my opinion.

    Just don't let this dissuade you from trying. Your speaker is just the first prototype. The companies I've worked with do at least four, before the final version takes form.
     
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