Timeless 7hz Ortho iem - Finally a Good Ortho iem!

Discussion in 'IEMs and Portable Gear' started by rhythmdevils, Dec 17, 2021.

  1. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    Just wanted to add that the Timeless sounds just fine out a Helm Bolt on phone. Not quite as detailed as a dedicated DAC, but on the go, completely immersive sound. I forgot to check on the Bolt and just checked and it sounds great.
     
  2. daduy

    daduy Rando

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    Anybody tried using them while commuting? How's the isolation?

    Thanks
     
  3. daniellistens

    daniellistens Acquaintance

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    Not great isolation. Lots of ports. Honestly kinda semi-open design I’d argue.

    If you look at photos of the IEM around the nozzle you see all the ports.
     
  4. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    Not fantastic, but it is not an open can either. If you want true isolation, you have to go full-time BA's most of the time. Anything with bigger drivers and lots of movnt are going to need venting. It blocks enough foe me when the kids are in the same room, but they would not be my first choice on a plane.

    And they are still secure, especially with the over the ear hook cable fit.
     
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  5. Clemmaster

    Clemmaster Friend

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    I just wore these on a 11h flight to France. They are pretty comfy to wear (for my ears, at least).
    Isolation was okay, certainly sufficient to enjoy in-flight entertainment without distractions.

    For best comfort and isolation, the Air Pod Pro will always take the cake. Too bad one cannot plug them in the in-flight screen.
     
  6. philipmorgan

    philipmorgan Member of the month

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    Well, crud.

    [​IMG]

    These are like 1mm too big. Even with the SednaEarfit Patented Crystal EarGlue IEM Tips, the enormous case of the Timeless 7HZ combines with my ear-flaps to physically lever the IEM out, breaking seal after just a few minutes of wearing.

    I have numerous better things to do with my time than search for an IEM tip that will fix this fit problem and not irritate my ears with overly-deep inserrtion, etc.

    Too bad. These IEMs sound really nice, and the few 5-minute listening sessions I got with them today in between re-fitting them confirmed others' impressions.

    Back to Amazon they go. :(
     
  7. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    That sucks! Maybe those other new planar IEMs will fit better?
     
  8. philipmorgan

    philipmorgan Member of the month

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    It looks like they would, and I'd bet $50 they use the same driver part from the same OEM :)

    But... my search has made me weary, and I'm pretty close to just getting the Aria and calling it a day for now, or getting Moondrop's miniature version of the Chicago bean and dealing with the excess of bling.

    [​IMG]
     
  9. Nash

    Nash Acquaintance

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    Dethonray Tender 1 is also an option but that's nearly thrice the price of Timeless. Personally haven't tried the Tender 1 but graphs online looks good. Also Dethonray as a company is interesting, their DAP DTR1 was pretty good sound wise but no features like most modern daps.
     
  10. Merrick

    Merrick A lidless ear

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    Popped some Spiral Dot+ (I think it's +, whatever ones the FDX1 comes with) on the Timeless and I think they make a noticeable improvement. Staging sounds bigger, bass quantity is reduced but bass extension sounds deeper, and some details are surfaced more easily. The mids sound really sumptuous with these. If you've been enjoying the Timeless but wanted less mid bass emphasis, these tips are worth trying.
     
  11. daniellistens

    daniellistens Acquaintance

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    I hate to say it but I think those tips are hard if not impossible to get a hold of. That is my experience anyway.

    The Timeless is really mailable when it comes to changing tips and cables. It responds to the changes.
     
  12. Biodegraded

    Biodegraded Friend

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    idk the stock tips (none included with this loaner) but with OG Spiral Dots vs a few others I've tried, I have the same impression as @Merrick does of the SD+. Spinfit CP-500s fit well and give me a vacuum-like seal, but made mid-bass too much and poorly textured.
     
  13. daniellistens

    daniellistens Acquaintance

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    I just listened to Tom Wait’s “Rain Dogs” album on the Timeless. Wow, that’s probably the best I have heard this album reproduced.
     
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  14. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    Hmmm I didn’t think that was a shitpost. :confused:
     
  15. daniellistens

    daniellistens Acquaintance

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    I’d agree.

    This particular recording did sound really good to me. I had never personally heard it sound better.

    Thanks for the post.

    @nishan99 just drops in this thread without posting something themselves. Lame.
     
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  16. JayC

    JayC Resident Crash Test Dummy

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    Consider that it could be a mistake, with the buttons so close to each other on mobile. Or maybe he dislikes the album. Its on him to speak up or correct himself.

    Unnecessary to make a comment like that on it.
     
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  17. Azimuth

    Azimuth FKA rtaylor76, Friend

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    This is true! I just had a post marked as Misinformation, but it was just an accidental click.

    Staying on topic - Crinacle had a brief listen to the direct competitor to the Timeless, the Shuoer S12. He says they are a little more V-shaped than the Timeless. Maybe some more bass with a bit more sibilance in the highs. Might be better that love planars for EDM. To me, it seems like it might be less refined than the Timeless in SQ. I will also bet that Crinacle is giving it a 5/5 because planar IEM's have been just out right terrible in the past.

     
  18. Biodegraded

    Biodegraded Friend

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    I’ve just had a few days with these courtesy of @Rockwell, who put his personal pair up for a limited Canada loaner. Thanks! He also included his Oriolus Isabellae, about which, more soon.

    Gear
    USB Audio Player Pro from Nokia 4.2 via USB to ifi nano iDSD BL (and briefly, straight from phone)
    HiFiBerry Digi2 Pro -> Modi Multibit v2 -> Vali 2
    No stock tips were included with this loaner so I tried a few silicons finally settling on JVC Spiral Dots (see notes below). Stock cable with a 4.4 bal to 3.5 SE adapter.

    Fit & comfort
    Because of the big round outside faces, this’ll be hit or miss (see e.g. @philipmorgan ‘s experience). They fit into my medium-size concha bowls just fine, actually very comfortably.

    Sound
    Tonality
    I really like the tonal balance of these. So often with IEMs, especially lower-priced ones, there’s too much in the upper mids and/or too much in the bass, and modding to try to correct particularly the upper mids can gimp timbre and technicalities (if those were any good to start with), leading to a compromise between acceptable tone and acceptable everything else. I had some initial reservations about overdone bass, but these were largely overcome by using JVC Spiral Dot tips. With those, I found bass still on the strong side, but I had no desire to EQ there or elsewhere in the range.

    Timbre
    Bass goes deep and is strong at the lower end. It’s a bit soft in the mid and upper, but that’s partly compensated for by its relatively high level. With some tips I tried, notably Spinfit CP-500s which gave me deep insertion and a vacuum-like seal, the mid to upper bass strength was a bit overwhelming and there was the feeling of a disconnect between upper bass and relatively lean lower mids. Changing to Spiral Dots tamed the level and improved the texture the mid/upper bass and brought back some body into the lower mids.

    Midrange timbre fits with my understanding (and limited experience) of typical planar – fast attacks but lighter note weight (the combo notable with cross-stick hits) and tone density (thinner-bodied male vocals and middle piano registers), and decays that are not too fast and not too slow. Highs are maybe a little artificial (‘plasticky’?) but not to the extent of many BA units that have overly fast cymbal decays. Perception of the texture of mids and highs as smooth and very ‘clean’ might be a consequence of a distortion profile that’s relatively low in the higher orders (see next section).

    Technicalities
    Macrodynamics while not weighty are not BA light either. At the lower end they’re helped by the strong bass level. Lovers of microdynamics & plankton might be left unsatisfied by the smooth texture of these sacrificing low-level detail retrieval, but this is a matter of preference. Where these really shine is in instrument separation and layering, the smooth texture and clean signature giving great note definition even in the absence of detail.

    Imaging is maybe a bit diffuse because of the smoothness, but the stage seems relatively wide so instrument localization across it doesn’t suffer. I don’t have anything to say on stage depth because I’m not sure that I’m able to perceive it independently of tonal dips or bumps de/emphasizing certain instruments or voices, so I’ll leave that alone. Busy passages at high volumes did seem to me to lead to a bit of congestion, probably a consequence of diffuse imaging.

    Some measurements
    As mentioned above, I really like the tonal balance, with a slight reservation about overdone bass. Here are @Crinacle ‘s FRs (won’t show mine because my coupler isn’t IEC711 compliant and does its own thing in the upper mids) of the Timeless vs the Drop/JVC HA-FDX1 with ‘medium stuffed’ nozzles (bluegreen in his case, might be greenblue depending on production run). Timeless has a bit more bass and has the upper mid peak better placed:

    [​IMG]

    Distortion is dominated by 2nd harmonic. L & R at 100 dB @ 1 kHz, with results below the noise floor of my loud room greyed out, show that H3 and higher are down in the weeds, H3 only just poking its head up in the bass:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The pattern is very clean and makes for an interesting contrast with BA/hybrid (e.g., Moondrop Blessing 2 Dusk) and even single DD (e.g., Oriolus Isabellae) units. Here’s a comparison of the 3rd harmonics of each of those, again with results below the noise floor greyed out:

    [​IMG]

    Timeless is lowest throughout, Isabellae is higher in the bass and decreases into the mids, Dusk is high everywhere. The pattern is similar but with lesser absolute difference at lower SPLs - although Dusk H3 stays high relative to H2 as SPL drops (@purr1n 's measurements at link above).

    There have been speculations about impedance. It’s a planar, single driver, IEM, so flat might be expected – and lo:

    [​IMG]

    Thoughts on synergy
    As I’ve mentioned, these are tip sensitive. Spiral Dots usually work well for me, so I was gratified to find they’re not only comfortable with the Timeless but also do them favours sonically. Because of the upper-bass- to-lower-mids timbral disconnect with other tips, I initially thought that cooler or more neutral sources/amps would be best, in order to try to calm down the mid & upper bass. With Spiral Dots, however, warmer upstreams that boost the lower mids to make up for the somewhat lean texture there would seem best. Modi Multibit (and Vali 2 tube hybrid amp) and Ifi nano BL worked well in that respect, and I can see why people are saying the Cayin RU6 (R2R with NOS) is a good match.

    The Timeless sounded adequate directly from my phone; but really if going portable I’d want to use it out of a warmish and powerful small amp, dongle or DAP. I didn’t have a 4.4 to 2.5 converter on hand so couldn’t try it out of the balanced jack of the Earmen Sparrow, which I suspect might be a good match (not real warm, but dynamic).

    Would I?
    I have a favourite single DD (HA-FDX1) and a favourite multi-BA (UE900S) (both of these are perhaps superseded now at the price or not far above, but I haven’t heard the popular alternatives in the price range*). The Timeless is different enough in character to each of those that at the price I’d consider picking one up as an alternative; and proficient enough in its own right to consider just on its own merit.

    So yes.

    Edit: *Apart from the Blessing 2 Dusk, which actually I did like.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 29, 2022
  19. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils MOT: rhythmdevils audio

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    The only iems you can put an XLR terminated cable on

    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Clemmaster

    Clemmaster Friend

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    Does anyone else sometimes have issue with this cable, where the pin doesn’t make good contact with the IEM and sound only comes out of one side?
     

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