Bookshelf / standmount speaker impressions

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by rlow, Feb 10, 2020.

  1. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    I enjoy it. Like most of y’all around here who like to hear every new fangled headphone out there, bookshelf speakers are my jam for now.

    Regarding the sub sat thing, yeah you can get some pretty shocking performance with the right match and setup/integration.

    Agreed on the domestically challenged thing. One thing for sure that EQ/RC can help with is when you have no choice but to push your speakers close to walls, it can help bring down the inevitable bass peak.
     
  2. exocer

    exocer Rando

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    @rlow - looking forward to your feedback on the R3s, especially how they compare to the S400s.

    At one point, the Elac Adante AS-61s were on my short list. Have you ever heard\considered them?
     
  3. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    I had them on my list for a while, but there’s been enough reviews/impressions of them out there to tell me I would not like them. My understanding is they are very bright/sharp/analytical sounding and also ironally light on bass even though they are very large for a standmount with these size drivers (and you don’t even get high sensitivity for that lack of bass extension).

    They were discontinued pretty quickly as I understand it, which is why they are cheap if you can find them (and I believe there are a ton of used models available). I think Andrew Jones missed the mark on those ones.
     
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  4. exocer

    exocer Rando

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    Yeah, this is why I never pulled the trigger although the discounts were very attractive.

    Another interesting speaker to compare would be the Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2-EX.

    Definitely enjoying this thread and will stay tuned :headbang:.
     
  5. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    Graham Audio Chartwell LS6 impressions

    755B9438-2A7B-45FE-AA8A-8B00E1020948.jpeg
    Primary chain: SOtM SMS-200Ultra Neo streamer > Yggdrasil A2 > Freya > Vidar x 2 > Rel T7i subwoofer

    Intro:

    Who are Graham Audio? That’s pretty much exactly what I asked when I went into a local dealer to listen to some Totem speakers a while back. I had recalled seeing their brand on some sites and publications, but never paid any attention to them because of their association with “BBC style” monitors like Harbeth and the various makers of the LS3/5a, which I had no interest in at the time. On top of that, their speakers are pretty darn expensive on this side of the pond (~$3300 USD for the LS6), especially for the type/size/specs of the speakers in their lineup. Expensive enough that I knew they were likely out of my budget, so I pretty much ignored them.

    When I visited my local dealer however, the distributor for Graham had recently changed, and the dealer was dropping the brand and selling off his last demo units, for close to his cost. While I was comparing the Totem Fire to my current ATC SCM19 speakers (which didn’t prove to go where I was hoping it would), he suggested I also listen to the Graham LS6 to see what I thought.

    Suffice it to say, I was impressed enough by that demo (which was in a fairly poor sounding room) that I asked if I could take them home to try out for a few days.

    They didn’t end up going back.

    Design/Build:
    02EF0870-02D6-43BD-967A-B5A1062B8A0E.jpeg
    Basically a rectangular wooden box with black drivers. Some may find the simple design beautiful, while others will find them boring or boxy and old-school “British monitor” looking. They look like a traditional BBC-style monitor, like the LS3/5a but larger. The overall fit and finish is very precise, clean and tight. The cherry veneer is nice and smooth (not much for texture here though) and all edges and corners look perfect, as you would expect for a speaker of this price. These are a “BBC thin wall” design and not super heavy, but still feel solid and well constructed.

    Unlike the LS3/5a as well, these are rear ported speakers, with a fairly large flared port on back. The single set of binding posts on the back don’t look like anything special either, but they’re actually super solid feeling in use. Even though they’re not mounted on anything externally, there’s no wobble or give to them at all and you can get a super tight, secure grip on spade lugs very easily.

    The front panel has a tweeter adjustment to add +1 or +2 dB. This is actually a decent feature for rooms where you’re sitting very off-axis and want to counter some of the treble rolloff. Or if you tend to listen at low volumes you may find the treble boost helpful. In practice for me, in my setup/room, +2 was definitely too much, but +1 was useful, depending on how I had them placed and/or where I was sitting. Maybe they should have had +1 dB and -1 dB for those who prefer to tame the highs a bit, but for me it’s not an issue.

    Overall sound:

    Wide open, spacious, warm, airy, transparent, detailed and somewhat laid back. They have a pretty neutral overall FR with a slight bump through the upper bass/lower mids and the typical “BBC dip” through the upper mids and presence region (which takes a bit of harshness away from vocals and instruments and decreases listening fatigue). Also a slight tilt up in the highs. Unlike just about every other speaker I’ve owned, they don’t project sound in a forward way, but they still have a well extended and energetic top end. More on that below.

    Treble:

    Extended, detailed, slightly tilted up, transparent but non-fatiguing. Airy, but not overly so. Some typical BBC-based speakers roll off the highs to make them more pleasant to listen to (in particular for nearfield) - there’s none of that here. The tweeter has a wide dispersion and you don’t really lose much sitting off axis from them. The treble is well balanced from a wet/dry perspective as well, not sounding silky/sweet (like the Dynaudio Special Forty) but not dry and/grainy or edgy like the ATCs SCM19s could be. You still get most of the bite and sparkle that the ATCs have, but not the etch. They’re pretty close to a perfect match for my preferences, with a good level of metallic shimmer for a soft dome (sure, not as much as metal dome tweeters, but way less fatiguing). This is probably my favourite tweeter that I’ve heard.

    Mids:

    The midrange is a bit recessed in the mix (that BBC dip), but overall is very clear, smooth and detailed with the right amount of body and warmth (low mids) for my ears and not thick in any way. Acoustic instruments like guitar, violin, piano etc all sound clear, clean and open with excellent timbre and tone, and superb transients and harmonics. There’s a realness to acoustic instruments that’s quite stunning. Vocals do tend to sit back a bit in the mix, but are very clean and full as well, and at the same time are very open and transparent. The openness and of mids and vocals on the LS6 will catch many off-guard I think, especially looking at the boxy appearance of the speaker itself.

    Bass:

    For a small speaker they extend pretty low, especially with room gain. They are a rear ported design and the port is fairly large (incidentally the port appears to be almost identical in diameter to the Dynaudio Special Forty, because the port bungs from the Dyns fit in the LS6s perfectly). I’m able to get into the upper 30 Hz range in my room. Bass timbre and texture is also very good.

    However, they are definitely soft on slam and impact. The notes are there, but they have no impact on your body like larger/slammier speakers can do. There’s no real “heft” from the low end of these speakers and some may find them a bit muddy with a touch of boxiness, especially if you don’t get them out into your room and away from the walls. I’ve heard/owned speakers that sound more weaksause on bass impact than these though. A subwoofer certainly helps, but you need one that will go deep enough to add bass in the 30-40Hz range or lower with authority, and this still won’t help the midbass. An amp and source with slam is a must to get these things to do at least something decent in the way of punch. The Vidar monoblocks I’m using now do the best bass I’ve heard with them so far.

    I did try blocking the port with socks and bringing up the crossover on my sub, but I had a hard time integrating the sub properly. I need to do more experimentation to see if I can get this working more seamlessly.

    Soundstage:

    These speakers throw a massive soundstage that is wide, tall and deep. Really deep. Soundstage is one of their most impressive traits. I don’t know how Graham did it with a simple 2-way box speaker like this. These speakers completely disappear in my room with my current setup, especially once Yggdrasil entered the picture. These speakers and Yggdrasil go together like a match made in heaven. More on that later.

    Unlike just about every other speakers I’ve owned, virtually all the sound from the LS6 seems like it’s coming from behind the plane of the speakers, stretching back what seems sometimes like an infinite distance (depending on the recording of course.) The soundstage depth and layering with these speakers is really good.

    Even when sounds are panned hard left or right, it still seems like it’s coming from behind the speaker. Every recording sounds like it has its own 3D space that is distinct from the next recording. They really give you a sense that you’re at the recording session, rather than the recording session taking place in your room (which is what most speakers I’ve heard do). With the volume sufficiently high, and with many recordings, the stage fills the entire wall in front of me with no gaps.

    Imaging:

    But it’s not just a big homogenous “wall of sound” either. Imaging and instrument separation is also top notch. Once they’re properly placed, these image almost as good as the better KEF Uni-Q stuff. Instrument placement is precise and super solid and they seem the correct size - not diffuse and not too pinpoint either.

    Microdetail, plankton, atmosphere:

    This is probably the Grahams greatest and most unique attribute. It was the very first thing I noticed about them going from the ATC SCM19 and the Special Fortys - the atmosphere, plankton and microdetails are just stunning.

    With any acoustic instrument that has a body like a drum or an acoustic guitar, a standup bass, etc, I feel like I can hear the initial pluck of the string or hit of the skin, but then also the body of the instrument and all the overtones and trailing harmonics, not just the fundamental note.

    And you can also hear the space the instrument is playing in. The subtle reverberations and echoing after the drum is struck was one of the first things that I noticed. I had never heard John Bonham’s drums sound like that before - incredible timbre and texture and every strike sounded unique. Yes, Bonham’s drums don’t have the wham-bam that pound your chest or drive you into the back of your chair with these speakers, but you kind of forget about that when you hear all the detail and information they convey. It easy to get sucked into the sound of a real, imperfect instrument being played in a real space.

    Speed/attack/decay:

    Attack seems realistic - not too fast, not too slow. Acoustic guitar plucks sound like my own guitar does. Drums, although lacking in slam, hit at a what seems like a realistic speed, just not with a ton of force. They also don’t sound dry and popcorny, which I hate.

    Decay is where these speakers really shine though, with notes in the treble region seeming like they trail on forever - the reverb tail seems to stretch out into infinity while the rest of the music just keeps on playing.

    They handle busy passages really well, keeping everything well in order, even up to the max volume I would ever listen to in my small room.

    Equipment matching and setup considerations:

    These are the most inefficient speakers I’ve ever owned, even more than the ATC SCM11 and 19s. These appear to be about 1 dB less loud in my room at the same volume level as the ATCs, and at least one site measured the ATCs sensitivity around 83dB. At least they’re supposed to be a fairly benign 8 ohm nominal impedance. And like I said before, they need an amp with a lot of punch in the bass so they can have anything approaching what you would call slam. So I would suggest pairing these with lots of amp power and a source that can hit hard/fast down low with strong transients. No “velvet” sounding DACs with this speaker unless you want really smooth/soft bass.

    And because they are so transparent when it comes to atmosphere, plankton, and soundstage, I feel that Schiit DACs, Yggdrasil in particular, are an incredible DAC match. When I first purchased these speakers, I actually had both the Gungnir Multibit A1 and A2 in my system, as well as Yggdrasil, because I was trying to decide which of the 3 Schiit DACs I preferred. Once I put these speakers in my system however it was no contest - Yggdrasil opened up the soundstage, increased the separation of instruments and displayed low-level detail and atmosphere that the Gungnirs just couldn’t match. Don’t get me wrong, the Gungnirs do well, but Yggdrasil A2 is in another league. I sold the Gungnirs shortly after.

    I run these speakers in a pretty small room and sit about 8 feet from them. They have plenty of volume for my purposes, but they may not get loud enough or may fall apart at higher SPLs in larger spaces. I can’t get them to this point before I’m overwhelmed with room reflections however. They also need a lot of room to breathe and to lose the bass bloat from the rear port. At least 3 feet from the wall behind them is necessary in my room, and they would probably do even better with more space. Give them a bit of toe-in to focus the imaging, but not too far, to keep the soundstage large.

    Pros, Cons, Either:

    Pros:
    • Large, tall, deep and layered 3D soundstage with excellent imaging
    • Non-fatiguing sound that plays great with poor quality recordings
    • Great timbre and rich tone without sounding thick or too dense
    • Extended, airy, non-fatiguing treble with good sparkle and bite (for a soft dome)
    • Open, clear, sweet, smooth mids with excellent body
    • Atmosphere and plankton for days
    • Good bass extension for its size

    Cons:
    • Bass slam/impact/tightness/heft leaves something to be desired
    • Need a lot of room around them to avoid bass bloat
    Either:
    • Tonally neutral with a slight v-curve, depending on placement
    • Vocals are set back and the overall presentation is less forward and a bit more laid back than some
    • Not as tonally dense/warm through the mids as some, like the Buchardt S400

    Overall thoughts:

    These are basically the best speaker I’ve heard, for my tastes, from the mids up. Their technicalities are amazing. They do subtlety and atmosphere like nothing else I’ve heard. They transport you to the recording session better than any other speakers I’ve owned and they make well recorded studio albums sound like live recordings (it’s quite uncanny).

    They’re also very non fatiguing and you can listen to virtually any type of music, or quality of recording, without being annoyed or needing to turn them down.

    But you really need to supplement them with a subwoofer, and you need to be ok with somewhat soft bass for the range of frequencies that the sub won’t cover. Bassheads or fans/players of electric bass or drums who need that slam and impact for a realistic experience will likely be disappointed by them. EDM, hiphop, rap and metal lovers will/should probably give these a pass. However, jazz, folk, orchestral and other acoustic music sounds incredible on them.

    But can they rock? For me, yes - well enough at least along with my subwoofer. If the bass were a bit tighter and could slam a bit more, these would be my ideal small speaker. Combine the bass and lower mids of the Buchardt S400 with the rest of the sound from the LS6, and I think you would have the perfect bookshelf speaker, at least for my tastes.
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2020
  6. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    Do you find they need to be off the wall a fair amount like the Dynaudios?

    Enjoying these reviews you've completed!
     
  7. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    Yep, definitely. Pretty similar in that respect, although I prefer the bass on the Grahams. The Dynaudios have more punch and speed, but was too dry and artificial sounding for my taste.
     
  8. bilboda

    bilboda Florida boomer

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    Since getting the Sonnet, I have been looking to upgrade my speakers. I purchased a KRK 8S sub to take the load and boominess off the JBL LSR30x and it worked. 80hz xover took some of the warmth away but clarity was way up but sadly, I was now hearing the tweets better so I kept looking.
    A seller on ebay had Dynaudio BM12a, lived 10 miles away and they were $299.00 each. I wanted these but no feedback and he disappeared after exchanging emails and providing ph#, Shucks.

    I had been eyeing these for a month, https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649580908-mark-amp-daniel-maximus-ruby-omni-harmonizer/ got stimulated and bit the bullet and purchased them. Stellar reviews in many languages over the globe and I had high hopes.

    Another ear opening moment. I tried them without the harmonizer at first, yep, it was like a veil had been lifted, substantial bass and great clarity, stage and imaging. Beautiful music still going thru my 3 hour eval playlist. Added the harmonizer and looking for the best attenuation setting. They play from 7000hz and up. I start losing my hearing at 8000hz 5db, so I suppose I can use these to add some upward presence.

    So without further ado, meet the Mark & Daniel Maximus Ruby.
    6moons goes ape over the entire line up from the mfr https://6moons.com/audioreviews/markdaniel3/ruby.html but there are more on the web so I was able to get a consensus
    ruby.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2020
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  9. murphythecat

    murphythecat Self Imposed Exile

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    thanks so much for this! the graham ls6 seem amazing.

    I had the graham ls59 and they were lovely but they had a bbc dip a bit too pronunced for my taste, measurements showed something like 3-4db dip between 2 to 5khz

    did you ever measured the ls6? i wonder if it measure flatter then the ls59

    I remember reading a guy going from harbeth 30.2 to ls6 and definitely preferring the ls6; no small feat.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2020
  10. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    Recently had to relocate for a long distance. Speakers are doubtlessly much worse liability when moving for nearly 1.5k miles.
    Instead of brining my speakers with paying a huge amount, decided selling every bulky thing and buying a new pair of speakers in the new place.

    Originally planned to go really cheap. But during home auditions I found that my studio wasn't acoustically too bad. I thought I could go higher.

    But I've never imagined I settled down such a modern take. I regarded myself as rather a old-schooled stuff lover.

    [​IMG]

    Anyway I've been having these elac babies (vela 403) at home for a little less than half a month. A series of surprises. Surprising enough for me to give up returning.

    Shortly (1) both woofers and tweeters are damn great, (2) but more importantly lows and highs are damn maturely integrated unlike older elacs. Let me elaborate some.
    • Placement: vela was sensitive. Depending on the distance from the front wall, upper bass changes from pretty thick (but fortunately not boomy) to a little south to neutral. Need to tune in for one's taste. I ended up with 2.2 ft away. A little more for side walls. Speaker distancing was 6.5 ft, and listening position was 6 ft away from both speakers. Borderline nearfield I think?
    • Anything below 40hz is muted. 50hz warble tone is hearable but a little faint. But midbass around 60-70hz has a little bump that makes bass region more listenable. Muted low fundamentals seem to be partly addressed by a bit boosted harmonics. Not perfect, but didn't bother me -- as I was willing to accept compromises in this aspect.
    • Except sub-bass, other bass region was rather satisfying. Very speedy and responsive. Good attack. Not as hard hitting as I can hear with some nice woofers though. It's not emotionally done but conveys much information without hassles or feeling lean.
    • Midrange has been a strength of this manufacturer. Vela also has that dna. Clean, clear, and well-balanced. Human voices are convincingly seducing with good articulation. Nearly zero midrange congestion usually caused by cabinet resonance.
    • Mid to high connection was the most surprising point to me -- because when I heard older elac models (not sure if it was 3- or 4- series), overall sounding was far from cohesiveness although each unit seemed to have some potential. I will not be surprised if crossover was completely redesigned. What Vela shows is a pretty good level of cohesiveness. I also feel time and phase alignment marvelously matched. And mostly for those reasons, I found vela as easily disappear as coaxial drivers or wide banders. Good job, Elac!
    • Trebles and top ends are highlight of the show. I believe Vela's amt tweeters easily stack against top tweeters on the market today that money can buy. Goosebumping stereo images, very expanding staging (in all three axes), nicely separated and placed instruments, and so many other wonders. I've suspected Bifrost 2 could do that, but didn't fully hear that level due to transducer (headphones) limitation. But this vela made it easily recognizable.
    • Of course, this benefit is not achievable only with elac amt (they call it jet though). I witnessed similar greatness with uber metal tweeters (diamond, be), quad electrostatics, magnepan, and salk's raal ribbon. All I mentioned had capability of great highs and conveyed in their own distinct ways. What elec vela differentiate itself from the bunch is (1) the most forgiving and (2) the least bright character. I threw in a bunch of cheaply recorded junk tracks containing untolerallable highs. Super-performing tweeters pick up shits so easily and make listeners feel ashamed -- the most recent example is raal sr1a. Vela nicely (if not entirely) addresses shitty parts of music and lets me keep listening. Maybe it sacrifices some last bits of details or resolutions by comparison. I don't bother any more.
    • I'd also like to comment phenomenal airiness and spaciousness that vela's amt conveys. AMT is typically good at this as they introduce more reflections in various orders with super wide dispersion. Cheaper amt speakers do not apply as their sonic maturity has no merit over more normal tweeters of the same price point. In my memory, Adam's s2 did this best. And vela dethroned them immediately (dacs likely confounding). Occasionally feel a little overdone. But mostly damn great.
    • Some of caveats I found so far include (1) their al-coated woofer doesn't capture emotional details as much as paper cones; (2) subwoofers needed for full spectrum but vela's lows seems challenging to find a proper sub and get cohesive connections; (3) they don't even pretend to be neutral or uncolored (especially on highs). Neutralists or music creators should walk away.
    To sum, Vela shows me what such a modern take (metal housing, small and visually-driven design, botherline uber units, narrow width) is capable of.. in a non-bothering way. Very impressive.

    My impressions come from the current configuration of Bifrost 2 - JLH1969 - Vela.
    Anything with larger gains and powers than jlh was too loud (> 80 dbspl) at the optimally operating point in my environment. I am still fearing neighborhood's noise complaints lol.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2020
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  11. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    Thanks for the impressions, I’ve been curious about these for quite a while. The only AMT I’ve ever heard were in cheap active monitors quite a while ago and I wasn’t enamoured. I would assume the Elac JET tweeter is a whole other ballgame. The 403s are getting good reviews I believe, almost pulled the trigger at one point not too long ago, but wasn’t good timing. Will have to keep an eye out again.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2020
  12. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    The LS59 looks much more appealing because of the front firing port. Way easier to place...
     
  13. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    Unless you have visual preference regarding port location, sonically I'm doubting if there exist any benefits.

    I experimented this by comparing two cheap bookshelves: one with port on the front and the other with on the back. Looking at several location changes, both bass boosting degree (in db) and reflection cancelation frequency (in hz) occur in very similar ways. Now I'm mostly ignoring port location. Front ports may look uglier if naively designed.
     
  14. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    This afternoon I tried my DIY-accuphase (A60+) again to drive Vela. And compare with JLH1969 back and forth.

    [​IMG]

    Findings:
    • A60 needs a little high input voltage to start to rock. Not good if you have sensitive family or neighbor to take care of.
    • As I wrote in another thread and review, A60 served fantastically to my liking in driving SR1a by giving them more refinement to highs and wetness/liquidity to midranges. All these applied to Vela, too.
    • Hard hitting bass is not a strong point of this amp, but there clearly feels more support and authority in bass region, compared to Hood.
    • I could hear vocal overtones more clearly with A60. Bifrost 2 and A60 combinedly generate super engaging and inviting upstream flow, and Vela faithfully transform it to pressure wave although I might still want a little more romantic presentation.
    • Listening to Lush Life (Nancy Wilson) with this combo.. it's one perfect way to enjoy Sunday night! Every component in the rig does a fantastic job. The result is a series of unstoppable "one more song" moment.
     
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  15. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    Inferring from my observations, I think both AMT and Ribbons highly require more careful designs (in terms of woofer choices, acoustic center setting, and crossover designs) to integrate them into other dynamic drivers as sonic character is different by nature. Even elac did it poorly with older generations. So, it must be even more challenging with tight cost constraints. Emotiva Airmotiv or Wharfedale Evo 4s made me believe that way.

    Higher Adam (S-series) and current generations of Elac are quite satisfactory to my liking. Once properly incorporated into the mix, AMT tweeters excel in wetness, air, and fun compared to similarly tiered ones. Not so great in accuracy or sweet spot range though.

    I'm also looking forward to seeing your impressions of special 40s!
     
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  16. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    As I spend more and more time with my Vela (and thus my placement experiment converges), I almost come to a few conclusions:

    1. Jet5 is the strongest AMT implementation I've ever heard -- it superbly boosts everything related to air and dimension to insane extent -- not necessarily one-side good (will explain below)
    2. Vela is the best integration of 2-way mix between AMT and dynamic driver. Even considering 2-way monitors have big advantages in this aspect, I've never heard this-quickly disappearing speakers.
    3. 6 inch al-membrane woofer is a mixed bag. Great sense of speed. Decent attack. But mostly feels quite bouncy rather than truly hard hitting. Reminds me of Ether headphones. In additions, bass extension is inferior to even some 5-inch driver monitors.

    Speaking of #1, this works as a double-edged sword. Good thing is it's almost a perfect weapon to fight against shit recordings and pull musical pleasure out of them. I've been secretly? loving jpops. While modern tech helped greatly in reducing noise floor and improving clarity, have never thought their recordings capture ambience and spatial cue well (on average). This forced me avoid Japanese albums more as I moved up higher as an audiophile -- funny enough, I began this hobby to listen to high-tone female vocals better lol.

    Vela addresses this problem frickingly well. During the past two weeks, they keep surprising me by conveying crazy dimensionality and ambient feeling that normally MUST NOT BE there with usual high end rigs. They transform flat and boring stuffs to no less than engaging-ish ones. And for some tracks, wonders occur. Suara's Utawarerumono Super Live 2016 album *almost* renders the same experience I felt in some of her real live tours in Japan. Of course, that's fake. I know. It's nothing close to what I hear with higher end rigs (including JBL's large 4344 or DD67k in dedicated rooms). Nevertheless, Vela empowered me to happily listen to the forgotten tracks that I loved long ago, without losing audiophile benefits (details, transient, dynamics, staging and imaging). That's never bad in my book.

    Downside is this exaggerated ambiance and spatial cues screw everything already well-recorded. I don't say it unlistenable. No it's not. Still better than (inherently) crap things. But the feeling of distance and staging is skewed at best, distorted at worst. For this reason, I can't recommend these speakers for either hardcore audiophiles or serious listeners of high-quality music.

    Verite does this to some extent (and that's why they survived and sit around me) but verite's coloration focused on lower highs. Vela has rather downtiled smooth response from down up to top octaves and even beyond (my measurement failed to match to my perceived coloration). But I hear something distorted around 15-20k, in a much more revolutionary way than Verite. Again, that's not bad for me. But I can't say these speakers neutral or spot on timbre any day. Overall feeling is closer to "dream-like/euphonic" rather than "life-like".
     
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  17. Zurvv

    Zurvv Rando

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    oh those elac vela BS 403. I was replacing my desktop speakers (psb imagine mini with an opp ha-1 and rega bio-r.)
    yes, jumping from a desktop speaker to a "real" one, but wow i was impressed (the mids to highs shocked me how good they were.) so good that i needed to get some real hardware behind them. (people seem to hate on the oppo... *shrug* which i've liked, but maybe i don't know how much better stuff can sound.)
    So, now i'm waiting for a pile of schiit :) (yggd, vidar mono, freya+, mj2) Also a new cabinet... it also impressed me so much that i'm replacing all my HT speakers to vela too.

    I'm going to hold off on any deeper impressions till after all the schiit stuff comes (it seems I also need to warm up the yddg for weeks too(?!?))
    The placement is a little tricky. The balance between where i want to put it (around my desk) and "is the problem the placement or the speaker itself" (mainly in relation to bass.)

    I confuses me why so people aren't using the 403s (or atleast looking at.) I was first looking at the Canira BS 243.4 (who names these) but liked the 403s more.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2020
  18. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    Just a quick note. My speakers are now pulled away from the wall by 5.5 feet. I am not sure about different room dimension. But to my acoustically challenging house, it was a very worthy placement try. Opens up crazily...
     
  19. Zurvv

    Zurvv Rando

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    I'll try. I was thinking of maybe getting it on a stand that can roll. ie, desktop stuff and then roll it out for music chill'n.
    Am i a crazy person for vidar monoblocking these? (I also like the idea of all xlr.. and two vidars will look cool together :p )
    (i won't have my second vidar and yggd till the end of the week. booo.)
     
  20. Vtory

    Vtory Illogical Spock

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    Velas are not super hyper ultra low sensitive speakers. But I found more power beneficial for them (tried 10Wpc vs 200Wpc and doubtlessly preferred the latter). In addition, Vidar x2 had edgier and harder presentation from my memory (auditioned through SR1a). Chances are they pair very well.
     

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