Crown CDi1000 Power Amp Review and Measurements - Stream of Consciousness

Discussion in 'Power Amps' started by purr1n, Jan 12, 2020.

  1. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

    Staff Member Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    70,784
    Dislikes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    Nope. Because gain is gain. A pro power amp with 32db of gain is still going to have the same gain as a home hi-fi power amp with 32db of gain. Doesn't matter if XLR or SE is being used to feed it.

    Feeding a pro amp XLR doesn't not mean the gain will be any different. It just means the input signal will be higher, typically x2 higher than RCA, if from a DAC with both SE and BAL outputs.

    The only thing I see is that the pro amps pay less attention to THD+N, and their sweet spot is a bit higher up in the power range. Still, much of this (perhaps all) is meaningless, because the CDi1000 with its merely good 70db SINAD measurements (and worse at lower power levels, which I'm sure I'm in with the big efficient JBLs), sounds way better than probably any amp up to $2.5k sold at Audio Advisor.
     
    Decomo likes this.
  2. Decomo

    Decomo Facebook Friend

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2016
    Likes Received:
    205
    Dislikes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Australia
    Thank you very much. I just watched this video and this guy has some issue with line level mismatching and he is going to get updated model 1002 which comes with input sensitivity option (0.775 and 1.5v I guess).

     
  3. Decomo

    Decomo Facebook Friend

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2016
    Likes Received:
    205
    Dislikes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    Australia
    i am thinking to get Crown Audio XLS 202 older model which is similar spec as XLS1000 mentioned above which I can get cheap to try.
     
  4. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

    Staff Member Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    70,784
    Dislikes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    Keeping in mind I can only attest to the sound of the CD1000. It's suspected that the XTi1000 may be the same thing or perhaps sound the same (spec is the same), but comparison of the boards shows that there are some significant differences.

    The XLS series could be totally different. (I believe they are cheap class D).
     
    Decomo likes this.
  5. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

    Friend
    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2015
    Likes Received:
    2,607
    Dislikes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    The Netherlands
    I tried an XLS1002 some years ago but i sent it back after i learned it does an ad/da step on the incoming signal because of the dsp. Triggered my nervosa and it had the slightly boring neutral class d sound. Don’t remember the fan bothering me though so iguess that’s a plus.
     
    Decomo likes this.
  6. Adrien

    Adrien RobS / neomax

    Anti-SBAF PSYOPS
    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2020
    Likes Received:
    2
    Dislikes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Belgium
    Does anyone know the diameter of the screw post of the Crown amp? I am trying to find the correct fork size for the screw but can't find any information. Here's a screenshot of the manual.

    I'm surprised Crown says it can take spade lugs since it's a barrier strip, spades will not fit.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. ergopower

    ergopower Friend

    Friend
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Likes Received:
    370
    Dislikes Received:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    South Central PA
    Sure they do, that's what they're designed for. Also bare wire, of course. Most common is 3/8" or 9.5mm center-to-center spacing. These use a #6 screw, stud diameter is 9/64". Width between barriers is going to be in the range of 5/16" or 7.85mm.
    Go here to look up a spade terminal that matches. Should be able to get up to 14 AWG capacity
     
    Adrien, JK47 and monacelli like this.
  8. Adrien

    Adrien RobS / neomax

    Anti-SBAF PSYOPS
    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2020
    Likes Received:
    2
    Dislikes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Belgium
    Help I think there is something seriously wrong with this refurbished amp. It sounds putrid. There is no bass whatsoever. It sounds like the polarity is inverted. Imaging is terrible too. My cheap Denon AVR receiver sounds 100x better than this which leads me to believe something is way off here. I'm using passive Dynaudio speakers. I can hear the tweeters hissing from 6ft away. Do I have a lemon? It came with a receipt that this was tested by Crown and it passed.

    Do I have this plugged incorrectly from the terminal strip? I had custom cables made to get this to work. Using Belden 1800F with Pheonix 3 female and XLR female. Then outputs are Belden 5000UE with #6 Fork terminals to locking bananas.

    @purr1n @Superexchanger

    Since you guys have this amp maybe you might be able to help.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Screen of the CDi 1000

    [​IMG]

    Here is screenshots of the Audio Architect software where I can control the Cdi 1000:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Any ideas? Is there DSP working somehow?
     
  9. jlucas

    jlucas Rando

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Likes Received:
    14
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    So I picked up a used CDi 1000.
    I plugged it in, hit the power button and nothing.....
    So I check the internal fuse and 120v was getting to the far side of the fuse, played with switch the exterior button connects to... still nothing.
    Left it plugged in and the on button depressed, walking by an hour later and it's now actually one. No idea when it actually powered up as I was not watching it.
    Cycling the power now, it turns on immediately. Any ideas FTW?
     
  10. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

    Staff Member Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    70,784
    Dislikes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    Can you flip the polarity of only one speaker to test?

    This amp will the its inherent gain and balanced input will have much more gain than most home gear using SE inputs.
     
  11. Adrien

    Adrien RobS / neomax

    Anti-SBAF PSYOPS
    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2020
    Likes Received:
    2
    Dislikes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Belgium
    I tried that, still the same results. In fact I originally had my cable connectors on the terminal strip backwards but when I fixed it, still sounded like inverted polarity. I was using a Goldpoint passive pre-amp and balanced connections from Convert-2.

    Considering my impressions are completely different from yours and others who posted here, looks like I got a bad amp. It was refurbished by Crown in 2019 and they included a service receipt to show it passed their tests. The seller was gracious enough to accept a return on it considering my problems with it.
     
  12. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

    Staff Member Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    70,784
    Dislikes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    Sounds like the DSP may have gotten "stuck". I would have suggested a reset to default via "updating" the firmware.
     
  13. Adrien

    Adrien RobS / neomax

    Anti-SBAF PSYOPS
    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2020
    Likes Received:
    2
    Dislikes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Location:
    Belgium
    You're probably right because I could still do active EQ thru the software eventhough the preset was "DSP Off". I tried resetting the device by doing a firmware update, but it still allowed me to actively EQ it. It just seemed like there was no way to turn off DSP which is probably what attributed to the very poor quality in sound for me.

    I appreciate your help.
     
  14. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

    Staff Member Friend BWC
    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Likes Received:
    70,784
    Dislikes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Padre Island CC TX
    That's the downside to the more modern pro amps - the DSP junk that's embedded. Usually they are super reliable. I've seen stacks of these deployed in projection / machine rooms for years.
     
    Poleepkwa likes this.
  15. jlucas

    jlucas Rando

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Likes Received:
    14
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    Talking to Crown service today. There is a start up capacitor on the board (C192 right next to the power switch) that goes bad in units from the 2014-2015 date range (next to serial number on back) and can cause issues of not starting up, however even they say it is odd that it only did it once. If it acts up in the future and the solder joints look too small for me to want to attempt myself, they have a repair location here local to me that can do the fix to the upgraded part (60v instead of 34v) used in the later units. Crown is part of Harman Pro btw, no idea how long that has been the case but that is who answers the service line.
     
    Vtory and Ntbm3 like this.
  16. jlucas

    jlucas Rando

    Contributor
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Likes Received:
    14
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Location:
    Central Ohio
    Finally got it all hooked up and fed by my Roon server. It's in a room that was on a Onkyo integrated before and after some level matched back and forth the verdict is the soundstage is bigger with more detail and less smearing of notes compared to the Onkyo. Happy vs the cost.
     
  17. seamon

    seamon Acquaintance

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2016
    Likes Received:
    51
    Dislikes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Indiana
    [​IMG]

    Got one cheap off ebay for $240 and made some high end cables to go with it. Honestly, I'm pretty impressed.
    The sound is dynamic and what really impressed me was the separation and layering. This does not have the sterile sound of a typical class D amp.

    I am planning a full rackmount LX521.4 build and 6 of these along with a Dangerous Convert 2 or Solaris DAC. I wanted to test the waters before I commit to buying 6 of these and honestly this is great!
     
    purr1n, Ntbm3 and lagadu like this.
  18. fraggler

    fraggler A Happy & Busy Life

    Friend
    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Likes Received:
    3,577
    Dislikes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    Dope looking XLR connectors. What are they?
     
  19. seamon

    seamon Acquaintance

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2016
    Likes Received:
    51
    Dislikes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Location:
    Indiana
    ETI Research Kryo XLR + Neotech NEI-3001 MKIII wire
     
    fraggler likes this.
  20. JayNYC

    JayNYC Friend

    Friend
    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2016
    Likes Received:
    42
    Dislikes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Am curious about the DSP section in the CDi1000 (and similar amps).... if DSP is active, does that mean the analog input signal goes thru an internal ADC-->DSP-->DAC ? Similarly, if DSP is inactive/off, does that mean the analog input signal bypasses the conversion cycle completely, or does it still go ADC-->DAC just without DSP applied?
     

Share This Page