The Two Channel Advice Thread

Discussion in 'Advice Threads' started by purr1n, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    Have you experimented with speaker placement and especially toe-in, and your listening location as well? A lot of soundstaging is derived from setup/seating position and room. Are you seated against a wall? This can also limit things unfortunately. I’m not saying a preamp can’t improve soundstage - it can. But IMO it’s further down the line compared to room/setup, the speakers themselves, and then you get into amps and sources. If you did try a new preamp, definitely go with Saga - Jotunheim won’t do any better for you than a SYS will (Jot is a balanced headphone amp first - the preamp part is really not it’s primary purpose, nor it’s strength - Saga walks all over it as a preamp.)
     
  2. rockwoodkelly

    rockwoodkelly Rando

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    I’m not dead back against a wall, but I am close. I’ll mess with toe once again, and pay extra attention to the results. Thank you so very much for the recommendations and advice.
     
  3. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    How far apart are the speakers and how far away are you sitting? Ideal setup in many cases is usually close to an equilateral triangle or something within a couple feet of that on each end.
     
  4. rockwoodkelly

    rockwoodkelly Rando

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    8’ wide, just under 9’ back from the speakers.
     
  5. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

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    Yeah looking at the speakers more closely, they appear to be the same tweeter but different horns. This could be the difference.
     
  6. Riotvan

    Riotvan Got lost for three weeks at Delft City Hall

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    If possible try moving your seat 2-3 feet forward. Angle the speakers so that they fire over your shoulders and cross 1.5 feet behind your head. Dips in and differences in frequency response between the speakers can also affect soundstage and imaging. Play with this and make notes etc.

    Maybe get something like a umik-1 so you can see what’s going on.
     
  7. rlow

    rlow A happy woofer

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    Definitely try this. In fact, try changing just about everything and take notes. Take your time with each change and see what you think. Change the width between the speakers, distance to the listening position, distance from the wall behind, toe-in, etc.
     
  8. zonto

    zonto Friend

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    If you're sitting right next to a wall and don't have any absorption behind you, that could be the issue as well. When I emailed with GiK Acoustics a few years back in a similar position, they recommended their 6" bass traps on the wall behind a couch up next to a wall.

    Could be worth doing a free room evaluation with GiK: https://www.gikacoustics.com/acoustic-advice/
     
  9. rockwoodkelly

    rockwoodkelly Rando

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    I’ll definitely mess with toe and push back some more this weekend as time allows. I’ll definitely take notes.

    I plan on finishing the walls next month with theatre-like drapes for the ‘look’ of an actual cinema. The secondary hope is they will also kill much of the boundary reflection issues. Fingers crossed.

    Thank you for the fine suggestions.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2021
  10. LetMeBeFrank

    LetMeBeFrank Won't tell anyone my name is actually Francis

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    I have my speakers 90° to the wall, seems to give the best soundstage in my experience. The closer they are toed into my head the smaller the soundstage gets.
     
  11. rockwoodkelly

    rockwoodkelly Rando

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    90° to the wall is where I’m at currently. I’m going to mess up all that perfect perpendicularity at some point this weekend. :)
     
  12. Pocomo

    Pocomo Facebook Friend

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  13. rockwoodkelly

    rockwoodkelly Rando

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    Tool Lateralus and Pink Floyd Dark side of the moon. And many many other rock albums.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2021
  14. jmaz87

    jmaz87 Rando

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    hope this is the right place to ask, didn't think a new thread was needed since this thread exists

    Recently moved actives (Adam T5v and T10s) out to Livingroom because I hate the sound bar but now I'm stuck with the dilemma of volume control.

    Currently using an E30/L30 because its the only thing I own with remote AND volume. Function wise its also convenient because I can plug an extension into the L30 and run Headphones at the couch without losing remote volume control.

    I have a Bifrost 2 that I normally use at Desk where I can adjust the Headphone amp / pre-amp volume by hand and I'd love to use this but then I lose volume control with a headphone amp...

    any suggestions?

    As I see it I can get a preamp like Saga S to solve volume control for actives but then I need a separate system for headphones in the same room.

    my other option is another Dac with balanced / SE output and well implemented volume control so I can set Headphone amp and actives and use Dac to fine-tune (main diff being Dac direct to actives)
     
  15. jmaz87

    jmaz87 Rando

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    ended up just getting the Saga S I can't freakin wait but also kinda whish i jumped for Freya S... the road not travelled
     
  16. jmaz87

    jmaz87 Rando

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    as if explaining to GF she had 3 remotes now wasn't hard enough... I found out I can't select outputs they are both just "on"

    This sucks because in passive mode plugging in HPA drops the volume on speakers and HPA volume is significantly lower even with Saga S at full volume...
    haven't decided if its a deal breaker for me I was really trying to get away from digital volume control (I know silly)

    I think the Bifrost 2 / Saga S sound great so far but its annoying everything else falls short of much cheaper offerings...
     
  17. Colgin

    Colgin Friend

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    Seeing the post above now as I am making a similar comparison. Finally getting around to setting up speakers in my living room and need some advice. The space is a large L-shaped living room/dining area. Our sofa faces a long (25' wall) which goes from the foyer, through the LR and to our window where the L to our dining area starts. My old speakers are old KEF floorstanders. However, we now have an approximately 13' wall unit/shelving unit over which our Samsung TV hangs. I cannot use floorstanders since the speakers would be too far apart. Instead we need to use monitors/bookshelves on the cabinet under our TV. Height is about 17" and it is right up against the wall.

    We have narrowed down our choices to the Kef LS 50 Meta (Royal Blue) and the Dynaudio Special 40. I had looked at the SP40 a couple of years ago, pre-pandemic, and needed to go back to listen to them again. Both work for us aesthetically and while having different sound sigs, ether would work. My biggest issue is that the speaker would be very close to the rear wall. There might only be about 6" between back of the SP40 and the rear wall. I am concerned with the back port and whether it would be too boomy in our room (although it is overall a quite large space for an apartment) and if using the plugs would ruin the sound. My understanding is that even though the LS50 is also back ported it may be less of an issue due to less bass response.

    Total budget is $5,000 - $6,000. I need a new amp/streamer, but would plan to use my ADI-2-DAC. Speakers would be used 90% of the time just to run our TV through. But when I have the apartment alone I do like to occasionally crank it for music. (Normal listening volume for me would be probably 70-80 DBs, but I might go louder to 85-90 DBs for shorter periods; sitting position 9' from speakers). Seems like SP40 might be better for that purpose, but KEF might be better for day-to-day duty. Would almost certainly get a sub for the KEF as I felt they needed it. SP40 I thought was OK for music without any sub being added. My final concern with KEF is lack of speaker grilles since we have cats.

    Thoughts appreciated. Thanks.
     
  18. jlucas

    jlucas Acquaintance

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    I just had to pipe in to add that subs are always needed! :)
     
  19. Colgin

    Colgin Friend

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    Quick follow-up question to my prior post. Does anyone know if the Dynaudio Special 40 speaker grills are cloth or metallic (and whether that may have changed from earlier editions to the latest since I am potentially looking at both new and used sets). I had assumed they were metallic and attached magnetically, but in some photos it appears they may be cloth.

    I have two cats and in the past they have gone to town on cloth speaker grills. I know that the LS 50 Meta do not have any speaker grills. However, I believe the tweeter is metallic and the waveguide seems to offer some sort of tweeter protection at least. My initial instinct was that the Dynaudio would be more cat proof than the KEF, but if the Dynaudio only has a cloth grill I might actually be better with the Kef. Not sure how much a bookshelf speaker would attract their attention, but when I had the floorstanders those were definitely treated by the cats as a nice scratching post alternative. The drivers of those speakers were never damaged, but they looked a mess overall due to scratching at the cloth grills.
     
  20. Colgin

    Colgin Friend

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    I guess this is moot now. I went ahead and purchased a used pair of Dynaudio Special 40. Hopefully it works out well.
     

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