Merv's Politically Incorrect Audio Blog

Discussion in 'SBAF Blogs' started by purr1n, Dec 26, 2018.

  1. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Most improved member; A+

    Slaytanic Cliff Clavin
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    What happens when a guy named William shows up and says he owns it all because he's king now and it's good to be the king?
     
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  2. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    A guy named Gavin already did that. There wasn't much opposition.
     
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  3. rhythmdevils

    rhythmdevils Best SBAF member of all time

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    And you love the motherfuckin Joe Grado HP1000 because for years it was the ONLY headphone that played music not resonating garbage.

    That’s not really true anymore thanks to me posting pictures of shit all over head-fi for years:p
    |{

    But maybe it’s worth a mention. I don’t even know if this is your top 5 headphones thread that’s what I clicked on.
     
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  4. Stuff Jones

    Stuff Jones Friend

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    This seems as good a place as any to centralize the scattered protest/riot discussion (pending @purr1n's blessings).
     
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2020
  5. Lyander

    Lyander Too sensitive for SBAF

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    Extremism is bad.

    @purr1n I disagree that it's unlikely aggravators or whatever name you use for them (instigators? people that participate in riots and escalate things for the express purpose of portraying good-faith, amenable-to-peace protestors in a bad light) are NOT a part of this as such has become common practise in recent times. Just because it might not have been a thing with successfully peaceful protests in the past doesn't mean that it couldn't have caught on in recent years.

    I could be wrong on that count, but knowing people I rather doubt it.

    We also have to factor in that there's hundreds of years' worth of resentment piling up due to a constant plea for change that has gone on largely unheard; to say that racial discrimination doesn't exist in America, or anywhere in the world, is misinformed. I think people who call for police abolition are [rightfully] angry based on their own experiences and rubber bullets being fired into their friend's heads, but even as I see how people who echo "not all police are bad" are in their own way downplaying the terrorism visited upon members of non-white citizens by these same forces, calling to abolish the whole system is an over-reaction in the same way Google ended up under-paying male employees in an effort towards gender equality was.

    I've said this before in a separate thread I think, but I deeply resent that militaries exist because they are in my perception expressly geared towards warfare, i.e. combat and slaughter; by that same token it might be odd to hear me say that I support law enforcement, but there is in my mind a strong distinction between meeting the need to enforce laws within a country's own territory and maintaining a force whose sole purpose is to engage in large-scale conflicts with other such forces for the sake of imposing X's own desires and rules onto a different people; most pertinent example to me would be China's trying to take over all of friggin Asia and frequent encroaching on Philippine territorial waters to fish and... build military installations.

    That's a whole 'nother rant I can't be arsed to get into: https://www.rappler.com/nation/2587...gressive-expansion-south-china-sea-april-2020

    All that said, I respect people who willfully engage in military service and those forcibly drafted into service irrespective of their own desires, as some members here from Korea. It takes a lot of strength to endure all that, and the friends and family I have who are or have been in service are a testament to that strength. Part of my hatred for the system though is how it applies abject dehumanisation towards the self as well as out-groups for the express purpose of making them more effective soldiers— this invariably leads to all sorts of issues; military veterans post-deployment DO have a higher rate of substance abuse, suicide, and violent behaviour. There's a shit-ton of literature on the topic you're free to Google from reputable journals, not just BuzzFeed wannabes.

    Police officers, I feel a bit more conflicted on. They do serve a more essential service as far as I can see, and though many insist (with historical documentation that I'm still looking into) that "all law enforcement was originally established by oppressors to keep certain segments of the population downtrodden" (I'm paraphrasing), I fail to see how entities starting out as bad things automatically precludes them from growing into better, more useful things: basically any part of the yew tree (e.g. Taxus brevifolia) are poisonous to humans, but the bark of brevifolia was found to help mitigate the spread of cancers (https://dtp.cancer.gov/timeline/flash/success_stories/S2_Taxol.htm). In that same manner, just because US Police might have its roots entirely in keeping black slaves in check (again, still looking into it) does not mean that they do not serve a use in modern times, or that even if they often shit the bed by being the direct cause of death they can't be better via extensive, and possibly even deservedly painful, reform.

    I've seen many cases in my own community where people enter public office for personal benefit. For the love of crap go look up "Pasig Eusebio dynasty"— the one family was in charge of my city for nearly 30 fucking years and they're certainly far from struggling, never mind the graft charges being levied against members of the family. That goes down to people scrabbling for motes of authority on the smallest scales of relevance— it happens, and the abuse borne thereof is obvious to anyone who isn't paid or an idiot, so yes I understand the desire to upend law enforcement and make it better, but sustainability has to be taken into account.

    I'm leaving on this again. I see people calling him a modern Uncle Tom (surprisingly familiar with the reference), but I'd like to ask those who genuinely think that way to reflect on his statements about burning down your own home:

    https://twitter.com/RATM/status/1266684395659972608

    P.S.
    In retrospect, perhaps the ability to reflect on things is itself a privilege. I am far from rich but I have a comfortable enough existence that I can afford to feel complacent. Maybe it's that there are enough people who don't have that security that results in large masses crying for revolution— there's less to lose, but in their eyes much more to gain that's vital, like the right to basic human decency from someone who has a different skin tone.

    I see that many people only turn to criminal activity like pushing drugs or robbing homes because they have to feed themselves, or feed their families. It doesn't make what they do right in the least, but with the same means to earn a comfortable living being denied simply by virtue of their appearance or family finances, it may be that they simply have no other choice.

    Arguments that they always have other choices besides crime are missing points. This is something deeply integrated into impoverished societies the world over, and while that is itself a gross oversimplification,
    this isn't exactly a straightforward topic either.
     
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  6. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    At this point, I really don’t care. EL Lay can burn down. In fact, I’d say they are a bunch of wimps if they don’t burn Hollywood down because it shows lack of conviction. Gotta do extreme things to get some attention ya know. I would just hope that people who don’t want to be victims arm themselves, like how the Koreans did in the last generational riot, which I still remember vividly.
     
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  7. JK47

    JK47 The Beer Houdini

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    TLDR

    When was the last time you spent any amount of time here in the USA? Interacting in real life with people here has been interesting for me to say the least. Before all this COVID/Floyd excitement went down, most people didn't give a flying fuck what was happening outside of California let alone their own county, or city.

    I'm not exactly worldly, or well schooled academically myself, but have spent years living in different places around the globe, and somewhat appreciate, and subtlety understand (maybe just barely) the different customs, cuisines, religions, and languages/dialects between continents, countries, and cities. The amount of lost folk here with no direction is vast, and will probably never change. I have no intention to try and change that, I just find it very interesting, and is my observation based on years of actually being places in real life, not visiting on them on Youtube or the Internet expressway.
     
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  8. dmckean44

    dmckean44 In a Sherwood S6040CP relationship

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    They would be better off targeting the leaders of government, business and press. Bite off the head.

    Destroying your own infrastructure is never a smart move, you're still going to need to again afterwards.
     
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  9. Lyander

    Lyander Too sensitive for SBAF

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    That's fair.

    While extrapolating situations elsewhere based on what few places I have visited is pretty fucking stupid, the reason I bothered shitting all that out is that it's not just a problem endemic to one country and I personally feel that it's important to talk about certain things. Heck, the fact that protests against racism are sparking up many places outside of the American continent because of this this just goes to show that it is something many people are affected by and care about.

    That makes it pretty obvious I did it for self-satisfaction, so apologies if it discomfited anyone. I'm pretty much done talking now (as I should hope to be after that), so will go off to make some coffee and enjoy some books I've had on the back burner. Cheers dude.
     
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  10. YMO

    YMO it's not drinking alone if you're on Zoom

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    People talk about changes after any riots. People know that the police has issues that is going back decades. People know that if you are black you are more of a target of police harassment/arrest than other racial group. People know that police policies needs improvement. People know this and that and keep saying they 'feel sorry" to the black community. But here's a dirty fucking secret that no one wants to admit in the open:

    People on average don't give a fuck about police reform, they care about not having any crime in their living areas. If it means hard policing that protects their families and their property even if it might be unconstitutional, they will accept it.

    How many riots we had in the US over the last few decades? While small reforms were done in the police force, it will continue to happen with the possible bad policing. Those in the poorer areas will still live like crap with harassment from the police, and those with money or the ability to live in the suburbs will make sure none of this "riff-raff" will come to their neighborhood. That means support policies that helps the police be "more effective" against the crime population.

    As our history shown us when it comes to US elections on local/federal level, after a riot there is a higher chance that a candidate will win if they show off as the "law & order" candidate. Nixon used the "law & order" tacit to win elections, Ed Koch won his first term as Mayor by being one of the few Democrats in Dem Mayor Primary and Runoff Election to push for the deployment National Guards during the Summer Blackout Riots of 76 (it also helped that he was pro capital punishment and pro-police), and going back to NYC again Rudy Giuliani won his first term as Mayor after a string of racist events during the time of Mayor Dinkins (Crown Heights Riots was the biggest one, also, it didn't help that Mayor Dinkins was Black and most of the NYC White Population hated him for being light on crime not doing enough to control welfare). You also had Richard Riordan winning the LA Mayor race after the LA Riots under the GOP Banner, but that was I guess more on people were stick of Mayor Bradley doing the same job for 20+ years.

    With the history stated above, the law & order message has been very effective for the GOP. This is why Trump did his speech in front of the St. Johns church yesterday while getting rid of those protesters. In matter of fact, when the riots started to happen last week I was like "Oh boy Trump finally has an opening after the Covid-19 mess." After a serious riot, people prefer to vote for security over liberty and the constitution. This is nothing new for me if I must be honest.

    Why people want security over the constitution? That part is easy for you to answer. People are pretty ignorant on a lot of things with regards to Trump's Federal Executive branch. People forget that the Federal Executive branch is actually more limited than we think on state issues, which is why we have the 10th Amendment. The Insurrection Act of 1807 does give the President power to send troops in the states, but I'm very surprised that this hasn't been ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court due to at least in my opinion a violation of the 10th Amendment. Then again, both sides don't want the Executive branch to lose this power and try to sue about it in court.

    This part is so funny to me. I have plenty of Conservative friends who were against the the Covid-19 lockdowns but are 100% in support of Trump trying to pull the Insurrection Act of 1807 in order "to finish the jobs that liberals won't do." I thought they were for state rights? They keep talking about it all the time. Hell, I'm for state rights as well all day/night bro! But when I say that to my friends, they were like "well some liberal states don't know how to run their government so we need Trump's Government to get involve and override them." Oh well, another example of give me security over liberty.


    So what is going to happen after the Floyd riots are over? As I stated before, not much is going to change. As a native NYC'er I will expect even more people are going to leave NY in general and move down to FL. I keep seeing tons of NY tags that later will have a FL tag, and I even speak to some of these guys because I want to know their reason on why they move. Most of the time it is low taxes and better weather, other states a strong support of the police, strong 2nd amendment rights, and property rights here in FL. One guy honestly told me that "he wanted to escape from the minorities." Guess what, some of those guys have $$$. After watching the stuff that is happening in NYC over the last few days, I am expecting more people bailing NYC in general and move to the South.

    With that being said, I am expecting more people moving out of the areas where the riots hit them hard. I will not be too surprised that these guys will move to areas that is more Conservative/GOP leaning than Liberal/Dem leaning. I had a NY friend who loved the Polk County, FL Sheriff talking yesterday saying that in his county people love guns, and if you try to start trouble they will blow you back with their guns. Some of my liberal friends think that this Sheriff is a pig, but for some of my NY friends, it is fresh air to them.

    On my final note, MN is now a Presidential toss-up state in Nov IMO. After any riots that started in a certain city (which is Minneapolis), I noticed that the suburb voters will swing for the law & order types. Clinton barely won MN in 2016, and the MN DFL party has been losing their rural voting base for years. MN DLF has mostly been relying on the Twin Cities for their support at least from my perspective. If the GOP is smart (which they are), they will start blasting ads in the Minneapolis suburbs area showing the Minneapolis Police Station burning up in flames saying "This is what happens when you elect Democrats." Just watch....people will run to those who guys who promise law & order while giving up their freedoms all day/night. This also mean the swing districts in the Minneapolis area should be in play for the GOP. Like what history has shown to us, those who run on law & order aren't always successful on this front....
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
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  11. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Yup. Rebels without a clue. It takes strong conviction and sustained effort for change. Take a page out of Gandhi who toppled the most powerful empire in history.

    After COVID is over or the unemployment and government gift checks run out, the kids will forget about it and go back to working their barista jobs, watching final four basketball, playing Madden football, posting pretty pictures of themselves on Instagram, and telling the world how something offended them on Twitter.
     
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  12. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Change is possible and has happened. If you talk to cops who have been around the LAPD for a while, they'll tell you how bad things were back then (the 1992 riots) and the major changes made since, and how the LAPD continues to change. It's a very different LAPD today, although I still think the cops are a bit susceptible to being starfuckers (like what happened with OJ - but hey it's Hollywood), and that there are not enough cops to effectively cover such a large urban sprawl. We can see how far the city and the LAPD has come today in how they've handled the recent "riots": no protesting for you motherfuckers, curfew starts at 4pm! Yes, and they will still shoot you with rubber bullets and beanbags or club you in the face if you are ordered to disperse after 90 seconds and you don't.

    Similar changes have been made with the Santa Cruz police department. Things were already changing in the early 90s when I lived there. I think by the time I left, the city had implemented a citizens' council for oversight. It's much different now. Although I'm quite sure the Santa Cruz police department is still quite racist against panhandlers and are sure to beat the crap out of them after they are dropped off outside of city lines, and only after making sure there are no other people around. I don't know what they've done, but they seem far more effective at eliminating beggars on Pacific avenue today than decades ago.

    I don't know what's going on in NY today. In the 90s, a friend from NY and I used to joke about Giuliani's "death squad" policing methods: four ununiformed cops simultaneously opening the doors of the Oldsmobile sedan, running to the curb with guns drawn, and blowing away a drug dealer suspect loitering at the steps in front of a doorway, leaving dozens and dozens of shell casings by the curb. I would ask how or why? My NY friend would answer: We got sick of all the crime. Maybe NYPD today might have some of that legacy.
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
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  13. Stuff Jones

    Stuff Jones Friend

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    This is a politically incorrect thread, right? Then can we talk about actual evidence for a second? (Two sentences that are sad to see together). Lost in all this outrage is the lack of strong evidence that a black person is more likely to be killed by cops in a given interaction than a white person. Of course media attention will be 100x greater in the former case esp if the cop is white as it feeds into black resentment, white guilt and other races... morbid curiosity? And that disproportionate media attention drives the impression that disparities in killing by race is a massive problem and evidence of systemic racism. It's not clear however if there is actually a higher risk for a black person of being shot by the cops. Which would of course of undermine a major part of the premise of the protests.

    https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1948550618775108

    Other research makes the PC assumption that all races have equal interaction with police (i.e. blacks don't have higher rates of crime/arrests - they do - https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2017/crime-in-the-u.s.-2017/tables/table-43) and therefore use the population of each race as the "denominator" rather than the number of interactions with cops.

    edit: This is a better source of crime data: incidents rather than arrests. The results actually show a higher proportion of incidents than arrests for blacks.

    https://crime-data-explorer.fr.cloud.gov/explorer/national/united-states/crime
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020
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  14. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    I think it's less about being killed rather than the assumption at you are up to no good, even if this is perception. It's an odd feeling when eyes are on you. Old boss who I hated often used the phrase "perception is reality". Turned out to be a great political lesson for the workplace.

    I can't imagine being black or brown and understanding how people may perceive you. I do notice that my wife (who is white) locks the doors in the car when she's at a stoplight when she sees a black or brown person. Kids and I laugh at her for this: "mom, that's just a regular (black) dude!" She grew up in Michigan, so I guess habits are hard to break.

    I may be able to understand a bit. Although interracial couples are common now (and even then, it's usually the woman is who Asian), they weren't so much 20-25 years ago. I'd have to admit at feeling steered or sneered at in certain parts of the country, and even today, there are certain parts where I would not feel comfortable living. Heck, the other day, some Karen asked my wife if I had married her for a green-card? I mean WTF? Now imagine if that shit happened day after day. I'd go ballistic too, or at least have a conversation with this Karen to educate her, which she would probably take as threatening.

    Bottom line is that black people feel this way. What are you going to do about it? Post stats? Things are just so messed up here because of the legacy of slavery so it's difficult to have an honest talk or even joke about it. I can at least joke with my Latino friends about the "firewall" (highway 55) that protects Irvine from "them" (Santa Ana).
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2020
  15. Stuff Jones

    Stuff Jones Friend

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    I get that, but if you look at the much higher per capita relative crime rates it's rational if not nice for people to presume a higher percentage of black folks are criminals. Again I get that would suck to experience, but it's not completely without justification especially given finite resources. It's kind of like after 9/11 when Muslim looking folks were subject to more scrutiny. It sucked, but you kind of got where it was coming from and I'm sure a lot more people were OK with it than would admit.
     
  16. fastfwd

    fastfwd Friend

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    With all due respect, writing "crime/arrests" -- as though they're equivalent -- is part of the problem. That FBI table shows arrest rates, not crime rates.
     
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  17. Boops

    Boops Friend

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    What comes first: the higher per capita relative crime or the policy decisions and excessive policing that ensure this is the case year after year and generation after generation? The reasons for this kind of disparity are well documented and understood by people that study this history. This is the legacy of slavery that Marv mentioned.

    Yes and after Pearl Harbor, Japanese Americans were put into camps. These policies are/were racist. There are lots of people OK with racist policy. See the entire history of the US. It is still deeply fucked up and wrong.
     
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  18. Stuff Jones

    Stuff Jones Friend

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    Is there more accurate data on crime by race or evidence that misreporting accounts for wide the discrepancy in rates?

    This is more up to date: https://www.ojjdp.gov/ojstatbb/crime/ucr.asp?table_in=2
     
  19. Stuff Jones

    Stuff Jones Friend

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    I think blacks feel this way in part because the media disproportionately covers stories about white cop abuse against blacks because it sells like hotcakes and because doing otherwise is reputationally risky. If instead facts not just feelings were discussed and cops killing of all races and by all races reported on with equal fervor, blacks may not have the feeling that they are being targeted by cops and mowed down in droves across the country. It's a dangerous Trumpian precedent to set/promote that the facts, evidence and truth don't matter. I think we should discourage it.
     
  20. YMO

    YMO it's not drinking alone if you're on Zoom

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    Maybe because you are in the LA area that you are seeing some changes, I dunno. That's good that they were changes in your area, because not everyone received those changes from my perspective because......

    This was the old NYPD from back in the day under Giuliani. People voted Giuliani in to stop the racist attacks/riots and to clean up the streets. Those Broken Window policies was IMO greatly affected those who weren't white and it was mostly a zero tolerance policy. Heck, I would even say that some of the things that happened under Giuliani and the NYPD Police Commissioner were at times unconstitutional. However, the voters who voted for Giuliani didn't care. Crime rates went down, streets were cleaned up, that's where it matters. They felt safe and secured and they were happen someone was sticking with the police and also another big thing: He tried to cut back on social programs. People after a while got sick of the amount of waste going into these social programs. Plenty called it racist, others said nah learn to work.

    They were plenty of minorities who really can't stand Giuliani. If you happen to be White/Jewish/Italian/Irish/Asian/etc. you were on his side. Those Giuliani voters where also sick of tired of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson blabbing their mouths. Even today I know plenty of NY Jews who wish both Sharpton and Jackson were hanged for their Anti-Jewish remarks. They don't trust them, period.

    NYPD can really put things down in order if they had leadership who didn't give a crap about their perception. I will say this with confidence, if this happened under Giuliani the riots would be waaay over. He didn't care what people think about him or what the people think about the NYPD.

    I don't think NYC will ever pick a GOP again for Mayor due to a lot of Giuliani voters moved out to NYC and of course most of them IMO are in FL. I also don't think NYC will elect a strong law enforcement supporter Democrat like Ed Koch. I think De Basio should been embarrassed that his daughter got arrested and he stated in the public that he supports her. Good for the parent/daughter relationship, but for the regular NYC'ers they are like the fuck is wrong with you De Basio. People don't like him, but he will keep being elected due to being a Dem on the voter ballot in a city where more/less Dems have a serious advantage on the voter registration.



    Now, going away from NYC and into FL. I found that a lot of Police Officers act differently depending if it is in a Democrat or Republican County. Sheriffs in FL in Democrat countries are more open to changing their policies, Sheriffs in Republican countries not so much. I'm in Jacksonville/Duval Country, which is a Republican county. I just watched our City Counsel spoke with the Mayor and the Sheriff about the weekend riots in Jax + how to move forward. Some of the Dems on City Counsel (which they are a major minority) asked if everyone including the Mayor and the Sheriff can walk in Downtown together, of course Mayor and Sheriff (both Republicans) were not committed to it. One of the Republican City Counsels asked the Sheriff didn't even ask about the protests or our city history of racial issues. He asked if the protesters who were arrested over the weekend will be charged as domestic terrorists and if they are any threats of personal property. Some people who were watching got pissed at that, but there is a strong Conservative stance that anything BLM, social justice, etc. is leftism that needs to be destroyed by force. Hell, our Congressman (who was the previous Jacksonville Sheriff) had called BLM a terrorist group that should be put on trail as domestic terrorist. Some things won't change in a standard Southern City where people really don't want any "riff-raff" to come to their side of town or else they will take out their guns.
     
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