Schiit Sol Turntable Review - Episodic.

Discussion in 'Vinyl Nutjob World: Turntable and Related Gear' started by purr1n, Sep 10, 2019.

  1. Ruby Rod

    Ruby Rod Facebook Friend

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    Quick update- I've got most issues sorted out and will be communicating the fixes to the powers above the clouds on the mountaintop. They'll have to figure out how to proceed, but no doubt it will involve updating the beta testers so they can report back on how well we did. Sometimes it take a couple loops, but it should be well worth it.
     
  2. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Friend

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    FWIW, I inquired today about the state of the beta testers who didn't buy initially - they haven't started shipping yet so I'm guessing they're applying some of these fixes and tweaks, and then we'll be engaged to go from there.

    Looking forward to it!
     
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  3. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    I received a replacement platter and bearing cups. They are good now. No visible platter wobble and no bearing binding. Looks like it was a QA issue. Waiting for the arm wands with more clearance for larger carts.

    I believe folks on the beta should have received an email that new parts will be shipped out.
     
  4. badf00d

    badf00d Friend

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    I received a replacement platter, and it appears to have the same amount of visible wobble as the first one. Both of my kids commented on it, so I'm assuming it's not nervosa on my part...
     
  5. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    LOL, let Schiit know about it.
     
  6. tranq

    tranq Facebook Friend

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    Is it possible for user instal error to result in platter wobble? I'm wondering if being even a half mm tilted (not absolutely flush) on one side could cause some wobble to show up.

    Legitimately wondering, not accusing anyone of anything.
     
  7. Ruby Rod

    Ruby Rod Facebook Friend

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    See what Schiit says. I only have a sample of 1, so they have way more experience with production parts. There are several places where tolerances can cause wobble, including the bearing inserts, the bearing shell and the fit of the bearing shell to the platter hole. Any errors at the center are multiplied by the time you get to the edge of the platter and it can be surprisingly hard to determine where the issue is.
     
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  8. badf00d

    badf00d Friend

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    Maybe mine is more warp than wobble. There is a dip in part of the platter, so it's not completely flat/true. I don't know if you call that warp, wobble, or something else?
     
  9. schiit

    schiit SchiitHead

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    Doesn't matter, it shouldn't wobble. Contact us for a replacement, and let them know it's been replaced once. We'll probably send you an entire bearing assembly and a new platter that has been tested.

    Seriously, if you have parts that are actually, verifiably bad, don't be shy, contact us. The beta is to work out problems with the operability of the product, which can't be done unless you have good parts to start with.
     
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  10. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Sounds like a warp if it's just a small part of the platter. How far off is it? I stacked up Lego blocks to check myself.
     
  11. badf00d

    badf00d Friend

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    You're a class act - thanks! I can't find an email address to contact, other than the orders account that sent out the beta notifications. I've replied to a couple of those and got crickets.

    Edit: Should these go through regular support, or the orders email?
     
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2019
  12. Puma Cat

    Puma Cat Almost "Made"

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    So, I've read this thead with interest as I've followed the development of Sol right from the beginning some years ago.

    I'll weigh in with some thoughts from my experience as a Design for Six Sigma Master Black Belt. I hope Jason (and Mike) may read this and they will find it helpful for addressing the quality problems surrounding the Sol's release and subsequent quality problems.

    At the highest level, the challenges that Sol is facing is that the quality of the product is presently not where it needs to be to meet customer requirements and also be profitable for Schiit from a business perspective. Product recalls, warranty returns, refunds, and parts re-manufacturing, rework, refurbishment ,and re-processing all contribute to COPQ: Cost Of Poor Quality. COPQ must be quickly and effectivly managed in a disciplined manner as it erodes profit from the bottom line and can erode brand equity, which can impact the top line (revenue).

    The only sustainable and manageable way, both from a manufacturing, business and customer experience prespective to deal with COPQ is to improve overall process capability. Process capability is measured statistically as process sigma score (e.g. a 3, 4, or 6 Sigma process) or as process capability, Cp/Cpk. The metrics for process capability, Cp/Cpk are key metrics that must be meausured and the product overall must be placed into statistical control in Operations to ensure that the process Cp/Cpk is acheived and maintained over time, or the product is gong to fail in the market and have an adverse impact on Schiit's bottom line. The target for process sigma needs to be ≥4 (a Cpk of 1.33) or Schiit will be bleeding their Mfg Ops white supporting quality problems with Sol over time. So, this must be measured for the product and tracked (how to track this later).

    Its pretty clear that the manufacturing for key components of the table, e.g. the platter, bearing, spindle to arm distance, external motor and pulley, etc. are suffing from VARIANCE with respect to critical tolerances and/or dimensions that are causing manufacturing, setup and operational problems. This is telling me that the manufacturing processes for casting, machining, finishing , various parts (e.g. the platter, platter belt, bearing spindle, bearing, arm, etc, etc) for these components are not in statistical control.

    First things first:
    1) The first step that Schiit need to implement is Measurement Systems Analysis (aka MSA or Gage R&R). Its MISSION CRITICAL to know with statistical rigor that it can measure the critical tolerances for parts. As measurement performance is a true "system": the part(s), the gauge and the Operators all interact and contribute to the overall measurement system's capability. As such. its critical that Schiit implements a formal MSA study to know with statistical rigor they can manufacture and measure the key parts with respect to their critical tolerances. or dimensions. Key parameters that must be qualified for their measurement system is 1) smallest effecfive measurement increment, 2) part-to-operator interaction, 3) repeatibility, 4) reproducibility, and, last but not least, 4) precision-to-tolerance (P/T) ratio. This last metric is particularly important as it will tell Schiit if they can measure conforming parts from non-conforming parts (i.e., good parts from bad parts) with statistical rigor.

    A graphic depicting an MSA (Gage R&R) analysis
    [​IMG]

    2) Capability Analysis: Once a measurement system with sufficient MSA parameters is in place, Schiit need to implement Capability Analysis. They need to qualify, statistically, their ability to consistenltly manufacture parts to their requisite crtical tolerances or dimensions. Their manufactring process must be able to put the parts dimensions/tolerances on-target with minimal variation. Process capability is measured as Cp/Cpk. If Schiit wants to manufacture Sol profitably, they will minimally need to hit a Cpk≥ 1.33 (Process Sigma of 4)

    A graphic depicting Capability Analysis
    [​IMG]

    3) Statistical Process Control: Once process capability is in place, Schiit needs to put the manufacturing of those parts into Statistical Control . The appropriate control charting (e.g. X-MR or X-MS) methods should be implemented to track manufacturing processes for manufacturing critical parts and their dimensions to ensure the manufacturing process remains in statistical control. This is particularly important for ensuring quality over time as there is always variance with Operations over time (for example, will Schiit Operations be able to achieve critical dimensions/tolerances with tool wear or variation in raw materials over time?).

    A graphic of Statistical Process Control using Control Charts
    [​IMG]

    4) Design of Experiments aka DOE:
    The manufacturing of the cast platter has proven to be particularly challenging. Its delayed the launch of Sol (likely more than once) and is continuing be a source of variance with respect to critical dimensions e.g. thickness, flatness, warping, etc. The most effective approch by far to obtain control over the platter manufacturing process (e.g. casting) is to perform a DOE to understand which input factors (e.g. time, pressure, force, temperature, material) and at what settings (level) are required to cast a platter to the requisite specifications, consistently and reproducibly, time after time. DOE is particularly powerful because it will not only inform which factors and their respective levels (degree or amount) are important to cast platters meeting specification, it will also elucidate any interactions between factors that influence this. And, guess what? For many processes, time, temperature, and pressure usually interact (think making automobile tires or injection molding a part).

    As a pictorial example, below is a DOE I did to integrate my REL sub into my 2-channel system. There were 3 factors in this system, sub gain, sub crossover, and the bass reflex port on the mains. The DOE told me where to set Gain, Crossover point and whether to use foam bungs in the bass reflex port for optimal in-room bass response.

    [​IMG]

    In conclusion, if Schiit wants Sol to be successful and profitable, and if it wants to put the current quality problems to rest for good, they really need to implement these basic quality best practices listed above for Operations. Can they fix the problems one at a time, piecemeal? Maybe. But the piecemeal fixes will very likely prove to be temporary and "unstable" as raw material, process, casting and tooling variations will take the parts and processes "out of control" again, only requiring them to be fixed over and over again. This will result in constant fire-fighting, and will drive COPQ up, which will again impact profit and the customer experience. This will impact the viability of Sol in the marketplace, trust me on this.

    So, Jason, if you and the gang of fine folks at Schiit want to get a handle on this to fix Sol once and for all...ping me via PM. I can help you guys.







     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2019
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  13. RobS

    RobS RobS? More like RobDiarrhea.

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    I find it impolite to tell someone how to run their business, especially over a message board. And even more so assuming you know exactly how to fix the production problems for the Sol. Sorry but I didn't read where Jason was soliciting advice from outside consultants.

    To say "Schiit needs to do x,y,z" makes you look like an arrogant asshole. I had to say something cause your cringey post pissed me off besides the Six Sigma nonsense.

    Anyway look forward to reading how the beta goes with Sol.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2019
  14. winders

    winders Know-it-all boomer, prob racist

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    I hate that Six Sigma shit......it makes no sense for a company like Schiit Audio.
     
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  15. ColtMrFire

    ColtMrFire Writes better fan fics than you

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    I'm gonna take a stab in the dark and say Jason probably knows how to run a successful business seeing as how... their business is already successful.

    A hiccup here and there isn't a catastrophe worthy of giving their entire business model a rethink, it's the law of shit happens when you roll out a new product you've never made before.

    They'll be fine.
     
  16. insidious meme

    insidious meme Ambivalent Kumquat

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    They probably have their own "Schiit Sigma" thing going on anyway.

    (Had to deal with some of that stuff as I was working for a GE affiliated company back in the day.)
     
  17. Pogo

    Pogo Friend

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    O Dear God in Heaven.
     
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  18. Biodegraded

    Biodegraded Friend

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    Agreed. Implementing a Six Sigma approach without first adopting Lean principles would be missing a huge improvement opportunity (/s).
     
  19. Superexchanger

    Superexchanger Friend

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    Hope it helps. Note, log scale.

    [​IMG]
     
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  20. Puma Cat

    Puma Cat Almost "Made"

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    Lean is fine, and Schiit would benefit from implementing it, but LEAN is about implementing pull systems for manaufacturing based on TAKT time; it doesn't address Cp/Cpk.

    The quality problems with Sol right now are more fundamental: MSA, process capability and SPC for part dimensions and tolerances and being able to measure conforming parts from non-conforming parts. One can implement a LEAN manufacturing system, sure, but if system components and parts are not to specification, LEAN won't fix that.
     
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