Discussion in 'Digital: DACs, USB converters, decrapifiers' started by RobS, Aug 28, 2019.
Thank you. This is super helpful.
The Bifrost 2 slipped again, until June 30.
Honestly, if this new reality we live in is going to cause the Bifrost 2 to be permanently backordered, perhaps it would be a good idea to simply replace it with a new Modius Multibit. Same concept as the the Modi Multibit - outside power adapter, non-upgradeable, no electromagnetic isolation, much cheaper. Truly balanced with AES input like the Modius. I know it was very difficult to fit the multibit chip in the Modi-size chassis, but perhaps the Modius size should do the trick.
Do you want better sound or do you just want to buy something?
It is not really about me. I already tried the Bifrost 2 and while I liked it, it did not work out for me because there was a technical issue with my unit. I also did not feel that the price difference reflected the upgrade in sound quality compared to the Modi 3. It was better, but not 6 times better.
I bought the original Bifrost Multibit less than six months before the Modi Multibit was launched and I ever since felt uncertain about the market position of the Bifrost. Most people reported that the Modi Multibit was very close to the sound quality of the V1 Bifrost. I still feel that if one wants to go for the top sound with no op-amp trickery, you may as well go for the big boys since they have a fully discrete output stage. I have been contemplating going for either the Gungnir Multibit or the Yggdrasil but they are getting a bit long in the tooth and I am worried that a new version would be released right after I pulled the trigger.
I am kind of secretly hoping for the Modius Multibit because that would mean that the SuperMegaComboBurrito filter would finally be affordable to anyone.
then it will be more expensive than BF2 also
You never know...
I tend to use these when not using Schiit interconnects:
They don't fit perfectly, as the base-finger-grip are pressing against each other and very slightly torquing/spredding RCA sockets on all my Schiit gear. It's so very slight I don't worry about it. I wish the standard was 15, 16mm center to center for "ganged RCA"...
Jason has already said on HF (see this post) that he wants to maintain resale value for present Yggdrasil owners by continuing to upgrade rather than coming out with a Yggdrasil 2.
Is it written in stone? Nope, but I would not put off buying a Yggdrasil because you are worried that a Yggdrasil 2 is right around the corner.
A Modius Multibit wouldn't even use the SuperMegaComboBurrito filter, since for it to be cheaper than a Bifrost 2 would take going down to Modi Multibit/Bifrost MB 1 chips that can only run the 4x ComboBurrito filter. There was some speculation about the super late Bifrost V1 being run at 8x but that was never confirmed. Unless they've found new radically better chips to work with at the low end of the cost spectrum, I would bank on the Gungnir and Yggdrasil being updated (Unison for certain before or alongside the transport release, other things *cough* Nexus *cough* maybe) before a Modius Multibit gets released. If a better value than Bifrost 2 is what you're after, then Modius already exists right now for the buying. Do note that as far as SE output is concerned, most impressions point to the Bifrost 2 holding up well against current Gungnir and Yggdrasil, while Modius really seems to benefit from being run out of its XLR.
This is how my 13.8mm Amphenols look on the back of the Asgard 3:
Yeah, in regards to the above, any sort of replacement to or upgrade from the Modi MB, assuming truly balanced outs, might continue to use the 16-bit DAC ICs as a cost savings measure. The output stage in and of itself I don't think would be the costly factor here.
Some other possibilities might be that they instead leverage a different multibit IC. TI in particular just released some new R-2R ICs, though it's hard to say if they would be feasible for audio. By that, I mean, you should be able to make them work for audio, but I believe there are other design challenges to consider (let's call it bug squashing) to make them worthwhile. Might not be worth the effort for a lower end product.
And there are still some old school audio multibit ICs floating around that you can buy new, in bulk. While I have my doubts Schiit would pursue something like that, it's technically possible.
Anyway, just piggybacking off these replies to reiterate that there's no reason something like this would have to be pricier than the BF2.
I have one of the last iterations of the Bifrost Multibit 1. Based on the frequency response measurements, compared to both a recent Modi Multibit and older BF Multibit, I'm almost positive they changed it to run 8X OS at some point.
Seems you need to invest on downstream, not to add (or replace with) another upstream component. Modi-Bifrost gap is huge with resolving downstream. Enough not to say price gap unworthy any day, even considering varying mileage or D/S bias.
When you say downstream, do you mean transducers? I have the HD800S which is pretty resolving
You outed yourself there. Then you should upgrade your amp. And until you get a Stellaris, there is always room for an upgrade.
then I don't get it - why we wan't to have it fully balanced? To get one more bit of resolution or ...? I'm not sure this is an optimal way to distribute money in bill of materials for a budget product. But I'm just speculating here.
I find it a bit too hard hitting at times. For example, sometimes with guitar plucks, it sounds overly aggressive. It's as if the guitar player is always plucking as hard as possible, even when they are softer plucks. I think this might be because of the USB out on my PC.
I get what you mean though. It's sort of rounding out the edges
Sounds grey to me as well. Right now I only have a USB source, but I have a Eitr on the way. Do you think an Eitr would remedy some of the issues you stated?
I'm getting really tired of the endless wait. I've been on the waitlist for 2 months now. They seriously need to find a new vendor for the PCB's they say they are waiting on. Extremely frustrating. I don't have a DAC currently and I have no interest in wasting money on a burner that I'll have to flip at a loss.
Sorry for venting but I'm not sure why they keep posting a ship by date on the product page when it is a made up date that will just get pushed back again. And it's the same amount of delay, always 2 more weeks.
To me Eitr is worse than Unison. After all, it’s basically previous USB Gen5 converted to SPDIF.
If you want a proper SPDIF source, get a an RPi and a PI2AES (with case and switching power supply) - it kicks Eitr’s butt and is better than Unison from a typical PC/MAC USB source.
I picked one up from Schiitr on Saturday. They had three in stock, I bought one and they sold another while I was there. It was probably stock they had sitting there from before the stay at home order forced them to close. If you’re in the LA area it’s worth giving them a call and seeing if they have any in stock. I wanted a black one but they only had them in the standard finish.
I know you've heard this before, but Bifrost 2 is imminent. We approved the first articles of the analog boards on Friday, and that's all we need to get rolling. A few more days and we should be shipping again. Hopefully, This is an extraordinary time, so please excuse the extraordinary delays.
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