The Game of Thrones Thread (With Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Random Thoughts' started by ultrabike, Jun 28, 2017.

  1. treboR

    treboR Wow, I made it this far without being a friend?

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    I feel like you are thinking of a modern view of how medieval times were.

    If you massacred a city every time it fell, there would be hardly any left.

    The only time I know that there were true massacres of entire populations were the crusades (siege of acre) and the Albigensian crusade (kill them all, God shall know his own)

    Did atrocities happen? Yes, but it wasn’t standard to just kill everyone.
     
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  2. Psalmanazar

    Psalmanazar Non Voting Friend

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    Cities had walls to protect their sick loot. Medieval armies really weren't usually big enough to take medieval cities and mostly didn't even have the siege weapons to even attempt to attack them. It wasn't in their best interest usually, and when they did, and the starvation part was going well, the city usually just consented to be looted.

    That's another thing that didn't make sense at all on Game of Thrones. Why not let King's Landing run out of food before attacking it? Muttonchops pirate can't supply the city forever as the lesbian pirate is going to show up and kick his ass with the rest of the pirate people.

    Also Game of Thrones leaves out the loot. Medieval warriors were like Bill Murray in Space Jam. When they were attacking people with nice stuff, they all showed up to "help" but they didn't play defense. Lots of other business always needed attending to when defending against random hairy guys trying to take someone else's stuff. Rulers who seem impressive on the attack seem outgunned on defense when all their underlings run away to hide with their nice things in castles with scary walls rather than risk getting shishkebabed by lances or shot with arrows.
     
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  3. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    Well, they did take the loot from Highgarden. Although it didn't make sense why they defended outside their walls just to let Dickon mow them down.

    --

    On the part where there was no objection to Sansa's insistence on an independent North: I was puzzled for a while until I realized, who is going the stop them? There's no one left. At least no one left in the middle or south that cares.
     
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  4. BillOhio

    BillOhio Friend

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    Apparently, because they had a dragon that could torch the city in just under 11 minutes.
     
  5. muse

    muse Almost "Made"

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    Yeah, I'd agree that the situations and contexts are different. But fundamentally, it illustrates that executing someone for insubordination isn't something out of the ordinary in the GoT universe.

    Dany sparing the Tarlys would have been great, and might have been great in the greater scheme of garnering support for her cause of throne ascendancy in Westeros. Still, the fact remains that the common (de-facto?) punishment for insubordination to a queen... is death.

    Dany choosing to burn them wasn't a sign that she was turning batshit crazy. It was her not taking a 'higher road'. And there's clear difference to that.

    Jon and Robb are exception cases who inherited the honor of honorable Ned Stark. The steadfast Stark honor is an outlier, not the norm. Also, Ned and Robb (with the Umbers) swung their swords as military officers, but in the name of the king (Robert / Robb himself respectively).

    Tywin wouldn't pass the death sentence not for any sense of mercy, but rather for sheer pragmatism of having able bodied men aid in the Lannister war cause.

    Also, it's undeniable that Danaerys losses were by far the greatest of any single character in the show. She lost the majority of her army, her entire armada, her most faithful servant, her most trusted friend, and two of her children. Willingly fighting a cause that was not originally even hers. For a bunch of people who were largely antagonistic towards her, completely ungrateful, and for the most part gave her shit advice. They took the benefits of her power and afforded her none of the respect. The show seems attribute her descent into madness to pure, self-generated (hereditary?) anger, and none towards justified grief brought on by faults of the people around her. Grief that would be more than normal and expected of anyone in that situation. That to me seems too unrealistic.

    Again, none of that exonerates her for going ape-shit crazy in KL, but the point is that when you considering the context of her actions and the scope of what she had to endure, none of the actions before that could really be construed as some innate symptom of madness. Or at least madness that could not be tamed/balanced by her other redeeming traits (which just conveniently disappeared).

    I have nothing on the direction that the show took in having her become the mad queen, but the manner in which they steered it to that end was just not done right at all.
     
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  6. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    I feel the natural outcome of that would be for Dorne, the Vale, and the Iron Islands to declare equally their independence. The other kingdoms would probably negotiate alliances. Maps would probably be redrawn.

    This would put King Bran as lord over probably two or three white trees, and Tyrion as the hand that cuts the grass when it's too tall.

    Unhappy nobles would create unrest. It was unnatural for all folks in the council to be so content. Perhaps it's left at that, because that would be another story. Star Wars also has deadlines.

    Dude. In a nutshell. Dany totally lost her marbles a while back. Couldn't find them no more. Didn't care. Forgot she had them in the first place.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2019
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  7. Tachikoma

    Tachikoma Acquaintance

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    It would have made a great deal more sense if Dany became a mad queen _after_ taking KL, but I suppose they ran out of episodes for that sort of development.
     
  8. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    You mean as Palpy 2.0 with improved looks and a sexy body? Yup, that would be something HBO would have been able to milk. But didn't.
     
  9. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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    [​IMG]
     
  10. Vordhosbn

    Vordhosbn Acquaintance

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    I can kinda get behind this. However, there were still some good episodes in 6/7 and it still mostly FELT like Game of Thrones.

    Season 8 went full "jumped the shark"on us. Or maybe we should start calling it now: "shot the dragon".
     
  11. msommers

    msommers High on Epipens

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  12. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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  13. iFi audio

    iFi audio MOT iFi Audio

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    Yup, that's brilliant and quite accurate depiction of GoT time line.
     
  14. mscott58

    mscott58 Friend

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  15. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    The difference is that HBO GoT is a rushed POS. One can accuse GRRM of many things, but rushing is not one of them.

    So far stuff based on his writting is far better than D&D's ass sauce.

    I may read the books.
     
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  16. ultrabike

    ultrabike Measurbator - Admin

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    LOL! Unlike HBO, GRRM weasel-ed this one nicely.

    Got $ from the TV show. Book promotion through the roof given shit TV show ending.

    EDIT: I do feel somewhat sorry for the folks behind the special effects and other support. The dragons and other sci-fi stuff were unlike anything I've ever seen. Those guys deserve a few Grammies, a few more Oscars, and all kinds of Schlong awards.
     
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  17. mscott58

    mscott58 Friend

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    You definitely should if you liked the earlier seasons of the HBO show. I read the books before the show and while they're related, there is so much more to the books - more characters, plot-lines, orgies of food, all kind of good stuff!
     
  18. purr1n

    purr1n Finding his inner redneck

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    GRRM has no incentive to rush. He's sleeping on a bed of currency with Queen Elizabeth's face on them. Absolutely happy for him and would encourage him to take his time.
     
  19. Boops

    Boops Friend

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    I was just reminded of Avatar (the cartoon) and how epic and incredible and satisfying the ending was to that series and I’m even more annoyed at D+D. They were on straight up easy mode with thousands of pages of rich, detailed material as a foundation to adapt. And they *still* fucked it up. They just suck.

    Also have you noticed that all the people in the little “inside the episode” things seem to only talk about how they overcame technical/project management challenges? Its cool that you had to build a destructible city. Too bad it sucked to watch.
     
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  20. mscott58

    mscott58 Friend

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    Sorry for the meme fest, but some good ones here!

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